Brexit, for once some facts.
- Thread starter flecc
- Start date
Brendan O'Neill just now:
"Right now, nothing better illustrates the moral chasm separating the UK political class from ordinary people than the issue of No Deal.
This week MPs voted to take a No Deal Brexit off the table while a Sky Data poll found that No Deal remains the most popular of three Brexit options among the public. This is the Brexit crisis summed up.
On one side are the political elites, deal-desperate, risk-averse, and keen to keep hiding their own inability to govern by remaining tied to the EU. And on the other side are voters, who are clearly willing to take risks and make a big, unpredictable break from the EU if it means recovering British democracy.
The spat over No Deal reveals a key front in the Brexit battle – that between a lily-livered establishment and an emboldened people."
"Right now, nothing better illustrates the moral chasm separating the UK political class from ordinary people than the issue of No Deal.
This week MPs voted to take a No Deal Brexit off the table while a Sky Data poll found that No Deal remains the most popular of three Brexit options among the public. This is the Brexit crisis summed up.
On one side are the political elites, deal-desperate, risk-averse, and keen to keep hiding their own inability to govern by remaining tied to the EU. And on the other side are voters, who are clearly willing to take risks and make a big, unpredictable break from the EU if it means recovering British democracy.
The spat over No Deal reveals a key front in the Brexit battle – that between a lily-livered establishment and an emboldened people."
I'm not, you are! I explained your mistake in an earlier post . you have no evidence to say that the other companies do or do not have similar plans.
The probability is that they do.
Try reading and understanding posts before prancing around as if you have won something.
He spoke for his membership and you have no reason to suppose that reaction he received is likely to be unique to his membership.
No matter how you would like that to be the case.
You simply did the usual leaver thing of finding something you thought you could use as ammunition.
It didn't work.
"
the IoD is not representative in any manner, statistical or otherwise, of British business."
In your "Expert" opinion"?
Arguably that may be true, but you are infinitely less representative of British Busines than the people who actually run it are.
Why did you vote leave if you have so little faith in the very people who will be running the economy after Brexit?
Whatever possessed you to do that?
Right. To be sure. The IOD extrapolated its figures into the 6m. Truth is we have no actual idea what the other (ie 6m - 30,000) are thinking.
'The probability is that they are'.
Really?
Only if the IoD is representative of the whole group.
Where is your evidence for that?
You have none.
you are saying that from the perspective of living in London. If you lived in Blackpool you would have a different view
But its not about 'perspective' is it? It's about facts. And the facts are that money comes out of London and the SE and goes to the regions.
But apparently not enough otherwise the EU wouldn't be part funding infrastructure in West Wales.
Edit: found the map, the red regions are the ones getting the money
I'm just stating the facts, a different view from anywhere else is of necessity wrong. I'm sorry the £50 million surplus generated here isn't enough to enrich such as very deprived Blackpool much more, but it's the best we can do. If the government doesn't invest enough of our money in the infrastructure here to keep the honey flowing, Blackpool among others will suffer even more.
Anyway, how much more loss must we suffer? London was not so long ago a major manufacturing centre until the government persuaded, bribed or bullied companies to relocate into deprived areas. That done they next did it to commerce and government departments with constant moves to the regions. As fast as we create companies to generate wealth they get snatched away, often only to fail elsewhere.
So when it comes to views, that on what's unfair is very different here too, with much tangible justification.
.
Labour putting corporation tax back up to 27% is not going to be popular.
KudosDave
then they'll have to spend even more money on enticements.
Mind you, any big business would be frightened equally by the ERG.
current probability estimates since Tuesday's votes on Peston show this week:
May's deal 50% unchanged
No brexit 35% (down 5%)
No deal 15% (up 5%)
Of course it's not enough, what our 8 million people generate could never be enough for the remaining 58 millions.
The sad fact is that the government takes our London generated £50 billions for elsewhere while the EU has had to give to London's own deprived areas for which we have no money left.
Where's the justice in that?
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Michael Heseltine talked about it quite a bit.
That was at the time he run the Dept of Trade and Industries. He tried to defuse the poll tax bomb. Building houses, moving government offices out of London etc. They tried it all but to little effect.
Juergen Maier (@siemens) made the point very well @ BBCQT last night: we have replaced so many well paid wealth creating manufacturing jobs like the kind of jobs at Siemens (they make gas turbine generators, trains etc) with service industry jobs like tourism, catering etc.
Indeed, it didn't help elsewhere but did damage London a lot, making us run fast to stand still.
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You do understand probabiity theory? only when it suits apparently, where is your evidence
for this statement?
a much greater proportion (12%) are planning to move production back to the UK. Again, this went unreported."
Strange that the EEF report link I posted paints a much starker picture?
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If you imagine you can use this report to support the leave argument then you are completely off target!
Here is more from that Report
EEF campaigned for and welcomed a commitment
to a transition, but a time period that stretches
solely from April 2019 to the end of December
2020 is far too short. In this period the UK
Government will need to not only reach a
comprehensive agreement on trade with the EU,
it will then also need to communicate the detail to
British business, allow them sufficient preparation
time as well as introduce new technology and
systems to support the revised arrangements. For
the manufacturing sector this will be particularly
relevant in areas such as customs duties, export
logistics, proof of origin and VAT payments.
"
The Customs Union, in tandem with the Single
Market, allows the movement of these goods
across countries in the EU and allows ports like
Dover to manage huge volumes of traffic without
significant delay, meaning products arrive at their
destination reliably, in volume and as scheduled.
And all without the inconvenience of customs
checks, paperwork, bureaucracy, tariffs, and
duties. Further, through the high quality systems
and software which have been developed to help
support this, both prime contractors and mid-sized
suppliers have been able to benefit from ‘just-intime’
delivery arrangements, ensuring that product
is produced and delivered exactly when needed
The Customs Union, in tandem with the Single
Market, allows the movement of these goods
across countries in the EU and allows ports like
Dover to manage huge volumes of traffic without
significant delay, meaning products arrive at their
destination reliably, in volume and as scheduled.
And all without the inconvenience of customs
checks, paperwork, bureaucracy, tariffs, and
duties. Further, through the high quality systems
and software which have been developed to help
support this, both prime contractors and mid-sized
suppliers have been able to benefit from ‘just-intime’
delivery arrangements, ensuring that product
is produced and delivered exactly when needed
Maintaining these benefits is key to the financial
health of the manufacturing sector. Failure to
do so would dramatically increase the cost and
complexity of sending or receiving goods across
the EU border and increase the trend for businesses
to invest and grow in Europe rather than the
UK. It is highly likely that this would lead to the
loss of many jobs and contraction of the UK
manufacturing sector.
They want BRINO not BREXIT with a customs union.
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