Brexit, for once some facts.

[OxygenJames]

Labour putting corporation tax back up to 27% is not going to be popular.
KudosDave

Right. It won't necessarily bring in any more money either. There is a limit to which you can put up tax before you actually start taking less than when it was at a lower rate.

The Laffer curve explains all:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laffer_curve

 

[OxygenJames]

You do understand probabiity theory? only when it suits apparently, where is your evidence
for this statement?
a much greater proportion (12%) are planning to move production back to the UK. Again, this went unreported."
Strange that the EEF report link I posted paints a much starker picture?

Two different media outlets reporting different facts?! NO!! This can not be!!! Tell me it's not so!!!!

 

[Danidl]

Brendan O'Neill just now:

"Right now, nothing better illustrates the moral chasm separating the UK political class from ordinary people than the issue of No Deal.

This week MPs voted to take a No Deal Brexit off the table while a Sky Data poll found that No Deal remains the most popular of three Brexit options among the public. This is the Brexit crisis summed up.

On one side are the political elites, deal-desperate, risk-averse, and keen to keep hiding their own inability to govern by remaining tied to the EU. And on the other side are voters, who are clearly willing to take risks and make a big, unpredictable break from the EU if it means recovering British democracy.

The spat over No Deal reveals a key front in the Brexit battle – that between a lily-livered establishment and an emboldened people."

That is certainly an interpretation , an alternative is that the elite in Westminster have realised that the jig is up that looking into an abyss with no upside. If the population has been constantly been feed the utter pap as in my earlier posting today, could you blame them for being misinformed?

 

[flecc]

Right. It won't necessarily bring in any more money either. There is a limit to which you can put up tax before you actually start taking less than when it was at a lower rate.

The Laffer curve explains all:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laffer_curve

Not so sure about the accuracy. From your link:

"In their economics textbook Principles of Economics (7th edition), economists Karl E. Case of Wellesley College and Ray Fair of Yale University stated "The Laffer curve shows the relationship between tax rates and tax revenues. Supply-side economists use it to argue that it is possible to generate higher revenues by cutting tax rates, but evidence does not appear to support this. The lower tax rates by the Reagan administration decreased tax revenues significantly and contributed to the massive increase in federal debt during the 1980s."
.

 

[Danidl]

Right. To be sure. The IOD extrapolated its figures into the 6m. Truth is we have no actual idea what the other (ie 6m - 30,000) are thinking.

Now I dont know or indeed care,who the IoD are, but from its title would it be more likely to be limited companies and corporations rather than the collection of "Rovers Return " type of pubs or individual small garages ? If so would it not be responsible for more economic activity and employment?.The fact that it has its offices in a prestigious location and has a Royal charter suggests the former.

 

[OxygenJames]

'The probability is that they are'.

Really?

Only if the IoD is representative of the whole group.

Where is your evidence for that?

You have none.

This from Tim Worstall:

(I asked him about the discrepancy)

"Well, IoD tends to be large businesses that don't like the CBI. And large businesses are much more likely to relocate than small...."

 

[OxygenJames]

Now I dont know or indeed care,who the IoD are, but from its title would it be more likely to be limited companies and corporations rather than the collection of "Rovers Return " type of pubs or individual small garages ?

As I just said: IoD tends to be large businesses that don't like the CBI. And large businesses are much more likely to relocate than small.

 

[Fingers]

Now I dont know or indeed care,who the IoD are, but from its title would it be more likely to be limited companies and corporations rather than the collection of "Rovers Return " type of pubs or individual small garages ?

Institute of Directors

Anyone can join. Its basically a gentleman's club. I know a couple of members. It's pretty irrelevant.

 

[OxygenJames]

Not so sure about the accuracy. From your link:

"In their economics textbook Principles of Economics (7th edition), economists Karl E. Case of Wellesley College and Ray Fair of Yale University stated "The Laffer curve shows the relationship between tax rates and tax revenues. Supply-side economists use it to argue that it is possible to generate higher revenues by cutting tax rates, but evidence does not appear to support this. The lower tax rates by the Reagan administration decreased tax revenues significantly and contributed to the massive increase in federal debt during the 1980s."
.

There is some controversy - but the accepted rate for total taxation on income is around 55% - anymore than that and revenue collected actually drops.

Not sure what the figure is on Corp tax - if Corbyn is going to set it at 27% you can pretty safely assume that's not the optimal figure but some politically motivated number - seeing as Corbyn's an economic idiot.

 

[OxygenJames]

Institute of Directors

Anyone can join. Its basically a gentleman's club. I know a couple of members. It's pretty irrelevant.

Seems like we can pretty safely ignore extrapolating out their internal survey results into the 6m actual businesses out there.

 

[OxygenJames]

From the economist:

 

[oldgroaner]

Two different media outlets reporting different facts?! NO!! This can not be!!! Tell me it's not so!!!!

No the situation is in fact you are reporting different facts to the o

Two different media outlets reporting different facts?! NO!! This can not be!!! Tell me it's not so!!!!

Actually the situation is that you are either quoting a different report fron the EEF
Brexit - Making it work for manufacturing

PUBLISHED 21 Sep 2018

Extracts from which I have posted, or you are making it up as you go along.
Which is it? it has nothing to do with the Media

 

[oldgroaner]

Seems like we can pretty safely ignore extrapolating out their internal survey results into the 6m actual businesses out there.

Am I supposed to be impressed that you mix socially with people you decribe in such a contemptuous fashion?

 

[oldgroaner]

This from Tim Worstall:

(I asked him about the discrepancy)

"Well, IoD tends to be large businesses that don't like the CBI. And large businesses are much more likely to relocate than small...."

You stand revealed for what you really are, a leave camp agitator.
A drone for the Adam Smith institute.
No wonder you are coming on here to be a nuisance!

 

[OxygenJames]

Interesting fact: Only 9% of British businesses do any trade at all with the EU.

 

[OxygenJames]

Am I supposed to be impressed that you mix socially with people you decribe in such a contemptuous fashion?

Where did I say I mix with them? That was Fingers don't pin that on me.

 

[OxygenJames]

You stand revealed for what you really are, a leave camp agitator.
A drone for the Adam Smith institute.
No wonder you are coming on here to be a nuisance!

Darn! I've been outed!

 

[Woosh]

Right. It won't necessarily bring in any more money either. There is a limit to which you can put up tax before you actually start taking less than when it was at a lower rate.

The Laffer curve explains all:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laffer_curve

empirical data proves that JC is probably correct to set CT at 27%.

Furthermore, there can be several peaks instead of just one around the optimum rate.

 

[Woosh]

Interesting fact: Only 9% of British businesses do any trade at all with the EU.

those 9% are composed of large businesses, you should see how much economic importance they represent.

 

[OxygenJames]

empirical data proves that JC is probably correct to set CT at 27%.

Furthermore, there can be several peaks instead of just one around the optimum rate.

JC is probably right? Now I've heard it all.