e-Bike of the Year 2011 (Unlimited Budget)

[OTH]

The Storck Multitask is very comfortable. The ballon tyres provide more than sufficient "suspension" for road/cycle track use, and the riding position is relaxed by normal bike standards.

 

[tillson]

Just thought I'd bump this thread back up as time is running out. It had slipped down the board onto page 4, but I know some of you think that is the best place for it!

 

[flecc]

It would take a miracle or underhand practice to change the winner at this stage though!

Ian Hughes will be pleased at this New Year's award.

 

[eddieo]

To me the Stork Just seems to be simply smart marketing...There has been chat about the bikes for years on various threads on German Pedelec. a few had tried them at shows but hardly any delivered until recenty and of the 2 reviews I read one had a motor failure. Also the system seems to be from Swiss manafacturer "Go Swiss"

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There are many bikes appearing with variations of this sytem latest are 36 v with a variety of batterys from 5Ah to 19Ah even the 16 Ah ones are similar price to Stork and some models cheaper. So if there was an award for smart marketing I thing Stork are the undoubted winner

Here are a selection of bikes

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and some videos including one of the green mover

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=69fRE53AgW4

skip through this one until black bike appears.....Oh Lordy!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8t_MoO0ycr8&feature=related

 

[indalo]

To me the Stork Just seems to be simply smart marketing

Yes Eddie, I'm inclined to agree with that as when one looks at the spec, it's not especially or radically different to many other machines. It does utilise some decent quality components however and is clearly a step-up in class from the mainstream.

Having said that, Storck dealers are not the only people about whom we can level that charge; there are others, some massively opportunist and obvious in their methods, some more subtle and we need look no further than the pages of this forum to witness some of that marketing.

As I'm sure you did, I looked at both the recent poll results and was amazed at some of the voting choices, especially in the "money no object" poll. Of course, people are free to choose whoever or whatever they wish in any poll and I support that right but even now, I feel there was something strange possibly insidious going on. Whether there was or wasn't, we'll never know but your point about smart advertising certainly got me thinking and it wouldn't be the first time I've put two and two together and come up with five.

Indalo

 

[eddieo]

Are you suggesting the fori is being manipulated in some sort of dastardly deed by the unscrupulous!?!?

Because if you are I think your spot on my friend!

 

[flecc]

Are you suggesting the fori is being manipulated in some sort of dastardly deed!?!?

Because if you are I think your spot on my friend!

I think the answer is in the two different ways people respond to this sort of poll.

One group will tend to vote for the item they know with some certainty to be good, either from personal knowledge or by the opinions of trusted sources who have tried the product.

The other group will tend to vote for the perceived best exotica, often due to a lack of real knowledge about what there is on the market. Obviously this group is susceptible to high quality marketing, and the most expert at that becomes this group's choice.

The unfortunate thing about this is that the votes of the first group will be fragmented across the various ones they know about, the second group's choice will be concentrated on the best marketed product.

Therefore, unless the first group is overwhelmingly large, the second group will decide the outcome. Of course, since the numbers who have real knowledge of the full range of choices will always be limited, the poll becomes a test of marketing skill as you both suspect.

However, I'm sure the mechanism is the natural one I've described, and the outcome is not due to planned manipulation.

 

[Cyclezee]

What a great idea, a poll for the best Kalkhoff of 2012

 

[eddieo]

What a great idea, a poll for the best Kalkhoff of 2012

well the XTR is £4000 and has cheaper shocks then my £1100 Specialised crosstrail. For the same money I can now get an X series flyer....no contest me thinks!lol
I really think Kalkhoff are loosing the plot..

 

[flecc]

I really think Kalkhoff are loosing the plot..

But still expanding faster than their rivals! They really are unstoppable, which is why Pon Holdings bought them, knowing what a good investment they are. Ultimately business is about making money, and they sure are good at that.

 

[Tim]

I think it's unusual for a company that innovates so much to be in the lead. First to introduce 36V Panasonic system after making the 26V system the clear market leader in Europe, first to put the BionX system on a decent bike, first to offer batteries with first 18Ah then 24Ah capacity, buying and then developing the Daum system as Kalkhoff Impulse and introducing it to the mass market, first to offer electric bikes with the sort of finish and high quality components at reasonable price (compared to Swiss Flyer - by the way, that X-Flyer model appears to use 26V motor and the over-wide 15Ah battery pack). 87,000 premium ebikes left their factory last year and there'll be many more this year.

It's not as though they're churning out the same old model year in year out like virtually every other ebike manufacturer you can name. Even better, Kalkhoff owners love their bikes because Kalkhoff understand what customers want and expect in an e-bike, which is what really counts in the end.

 

[eddieo]

No one in in their right mind is going to pay £4000 for a 36v Panasonic drive with torque sensor and £170 forks, when a better a looking, and specified, lighter and stronger performing, Bosch bike can be had for half that amount.

 

[flecc]

We'll see Eddie, only the results will count. Also, we don't yet know how powerful the 36 volt Panasonic system is, it could equal or better the Bosch. As I know you appreciate, e-bikes are very personal things and there are many who prefer the way the Panasonic units work. Yamaha tried the more powerful way of doing it, working more like the Bosch, and lost out in the wider market, so Panasonic continuing with the 26 volt systems is very sensible.

 

[Tim]

No one in in their right mind is going to pay £4000 for a 36v Panasonic drive with torque sensor and £170 forks, when a better a looking, and specified, lighter and stronger performing, Bosch bike can be had for half that amount.

And yet we've sold six times as many Pro Connect S XTRs than the cheaper the Bosch model. I think the maximum assistance of 300% compared to the Bosch's relatively restrained 250% helps

As for the difference in range, most people would concede the Panasonic's 80km (from a 504Wh battery) is better than 40km (from a 288Wh battery).

 

[eddieo]

But still expanding faster than their rivals! They really are unstoppable, which is why Pon Holdings bought them, knowing what a good investment they are. Ultimately business is about making money, and they sure are good at that.

Its not just me saying this.....German enthusiasts also appear underwhelmed by the outrageous price of Panasonic 36 V system! Also not much enthusiasm for impulse drive either as not very exciting. Plus the reverse logic cadence? of 26 v system still puts many of these bikes.

The Bosch drive with with more then 35 major manufacturers and a choice of well over 150 different model bikes sporting this drive, is the success story of 2011/2012. unfortunately it looks like 2012 is going to be a repeat of 2011 for the UK with these bikes thin on the ground...

 

[flecc]

Plus the reverse logic cadence? of 26 v system still puts many of these bikes.

That's no longer true now, just like the power level as Tim has posted. Much has moved on and today's Panasonic systems are up there with the rest of the market. I'm not too concerned about the German market opinions which are predictably in favour of their home grown product, which is why so many German manufacturers are using the Bosch unit. They want to appeal to their home market, as do Kalkhoff with their home grown Impulse unit.

 

[eddieo]

its hard enough to get anyone on here to part with more then a grand, let alone £4000 for a bike with £170 forks .......But then the PC were never rated much for comfort

 

[Kudoscycles]

Sir John Harvey-Jones,ex boss of ICI,sadly deceased now....when asked by a junior 'sir,what is the best product we sell?'....replied 'the one most people want to buy!'
Dave
KudosCycles

 

[yselmike]

i paid 4000euro for my flyer s thats with an extra charger and an upgraded battery from 10ah to 16 ah
I will pay it plus I get good sevice from my dealer Piet de Jongh - Home in Purmerend.
if you can put it together yourself great i can barely mend a puncture sometimes you
pay for what you get.
I stopped smoking 20 years ago I was on 50 a day + i brought the london times and de Telegraaf every day
i was spending over 5000 dutch guilders a year on fags and rags i dread to think what that would cost
now in Euros add the booze and other stuff readily available when I lived in Amsterdam.
4000 euro is not so much of a wrench though it aint cheap.

 

[eddieo]

Sir John Harvey-Jones,ex boss of ICI,sadly deceased now....when asked by a junior 'sir,what is the best product we sell?'....replied 'the one most people want to buy!'
Dave
KudosCycles

Thanks Dave! that will be a Bosch bike then!lol As hardly any around as demand so great, whereas plenty of reduced price Kalkhoff 2011 models in Germany

I nearly ordered a step though Sahel the other week for wife, for £1500 it looked really good in Red and Black with Big Apple tyres...but after a bit of digging I found out the weight was over 25kg, prehistoric or what!

Anyway the wife has gone fitness mad and refuses another electric bike I will wait a bit and see how things develop....but I will get a new crank drive eventually but may wait for Mark 2 Bosch which might just be announced later in year at German shows