Brexit, for once some facts.

[flecc]

The stupid bit about HS2 is its not going to link with HS1.
Commonsense (bit lacking with this government) is that you catch the Eurostar(HS1) from Europe which teminuses at St Pancras. Then you have to walk out of St Pancras and walk/taxi or tube to Euston to board HS2 to the north. Those stations are only 500 yds apart....surely St Pancras should be a through station and you stay on the train for Birmingham and Manchester.
They talk about a need for capacity,make all the first class coaches into standard class and instantly 4 more coaches on every train,there is hardly anyone in first class,except government officials.
KudosDave

Once again due to our backward ways. You may remember a company called Central Railway who proposed a through route for freight, detailed on this link. That included a bypass link around the perimeter of London, which would have been the perfect opportunity to build an HS link alongside while building that.
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[flecc]

Will we pay the £66 billion?
KudosDave

Ask the EU for a grant as they ask us for the £87 billion leaving payment.
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[Kudoscycles]

We didnt see the other side of the big red bus....maybe it had £1,269,230 million per week going to the EU.
Hope my maths is right??
KudosDave

 

[Woosh]

Will we pay the £66 billion?
KudosDave

I think we would if we can get a good deal afterward.

 

[oldgroaner]

I think we would if we can get a good deal afterward.

I'm sorry but you've lost me there "afterward" of what?

 

[oldgroaner]

In the Sun; Where else? A whoppping great lie!
"
GOING NUCLEAR
Britain threatens to send radioactive plutonium back across the Channel as Brexit talks reach deadlock over nuclear regulation


UK officials locked in negotiations have told Brussels they have the right to return radioactive waste we currently hold
Britain has imported spent nuclear fuel from the rest of Europe since the 1970s for processing at Sellafield.

The process produces uranium and plutonium but also radioactive waste. One nuclear expert told the FT: “It might just be a reminder that a boatload of plutonium could end up at a harbour in Antwerp unless an arrangement is made.”

A paper on nuclear regulation post Brexit has also highlighted that the EU bears responsibility for some “special fissile materials”.

Around one fifth of the UK’s 126 tonne stockpile of civilian plutonium at Sellafield is thought to come from the EU.

The row highlights UK officials starting to exert their own leverage in the Brexit talks.

It follows a bitter dispute over the future of Britain’s membership of Euratom treaty governing atomic technology and trade in nuclear materials. Eurocrats have told Britain they have no alternative but to quit the agency under Brexit.
This is a lie Davis has announced we are leaving

Let us hope they won't mind the fact that there may be a delay while we dredge it back out of the Irish Sea, or perhaps we could suggest that they be patient till the Longshore Drift that has taken it around Scotland and the East Coast, reaches the other side of the North Sea?
Perhaps there is some truth in this
"One nuclear expert told the FT: “It might just be a reminder that a boatload of plutonium could end up at a harbour in Antwerp unless an arrangement is made.”

I suspect that the boat isn't necessary and plenty has arrived on each succesive high tide!
Like some proof of that? lookee here!
https://www.theguardian.com/uk/1999/apr/23/paulbrownhttps:

"
More than a third of the plutonium pumped into the Irish Sea from Sellafield nuclear plant in Cumbria over the past 40 years is missing, scientists working for the ministry of agriculture have disclosed.

Since a tiny speck of plutonium inhaled is enough to trigger cancer, scientists are anxious to explain the disappearance of more than 60kg, which they had expected to find in sea sediments.
Currents take plutonium up the Scottish coast and round the coast of Norway to the North Sea. Some of it washes up on the coasts of our European neighbours and some travels further north up the Norwegian coast to the Barents Sea and the Arctic.

It only a measly amount "Nuclear Fuels to pour 8m litres of nuclear waste contaminated water into the Irish Sea.
And someone has conveniently forgotten we got paid to process the waste too.

 

[Woosh]

I'm sorry but you've lost me there "afterward" of what?

at the end of the day, despite all the huffing and puffing, there will be a deal with the EU because exit on WTO is a no no for both sides.
Until then, the EU can do as much tictoc as they like. We are skint anyway.

 

[oldgroaner]

The Express are having a Fantasy day again
"
Brexit boost: Leaving EU hasn’t damaged UK’s global reputation, landmark survey reveals
BRITAIN’S decision to leave the European Union has not damaged its reputation on the world stage, a landmark survey of global movers and shakers reveals today.

at the end of the day, despite all the huffing and puffing, there will be a deal with the EU because exit on WTO is a no no for both sides.
Until then, the EU can do as much tictoc as they like. We are skint anyway.

That's true, eventually we will knuckle under and say thank you, but we have to make an abject surrender look like a victory against the odds to con the public into hailing something they now hate, as a triumph.
And we will simply pay up, quietly and without a fanfare from the "money tree"
But the Government is having to work harder to deceive the Public this time.
More Fake news and lies!
Does that count as an improvement? I wonder.

 

[Danidl]

The stupid bit about HS2 is its not going to link with HS1.
Commonsense (bit lacking with this government) is that you catch the Eurostar(HS1) from Europe which teminuses at St Pancras. Then you have to walk out of St Pancras and walk/taxi or tube to Euston to board HS2 to the north. Those stations are only 500 yds apart....surely St Pancras should be a through station and you stay on the train for Birmingham and Manchester.
They talk about a need for capacity,make all the first class coaches into standard class and instantly 4 more coaches on every train,there is hardly anyone in first class,except government officials.
KudosDave

... I was wondering when other people would twig this. I have not been a regular train user until recently.. (free travel pass ) and have been bemused by the Enterprise service Belfast Dublin express. .. a lovely train, top quality. When it stops at Dundalk, on its way from Belfast, a person appears at each of the probably 4 carriages reserved for first class, in order to ensure that only those worthy of entering do so while the rest of us mortals trundle down to the probably 3 carriages , suitable for us lesser beings, and with luck achieve a seat.
There is probably a carriage per first class passenger.. certainly it appears that way on the Dublin Belfast return, where I have yet to see a person getting on the first class carriages.
Anywqy it is not that there is a significant revenue to be gained

 

[oldgroaner]

Ask the EU for a grant as they ask us for the £87 billion leaving payment.
.

Good Plan
Tell them it's for a Mental Health initiative to combat Mass Stupidity.

 

[oldgroaner]

I have just seen something astonishing in the Daily Express: the latest Poll


Will Britain remain outside the EU after Brexit.........31%
Will Britain Rejoin the EU after Brexit........................69%

Has the Penny Dropped at last?

 

[flecc]

I have just seen something astonishing in the Daily Express: the latest Poll


Will Britain remain outside the EU after Brexit.........31%
Will Britain Rejoin the EU after Brexit........................69%

Has the Penny Dropped at last?

Yes, if there was another referendum, Remain would win by a large margin, certainly over 10% ahead.
.

 

[oldgroaner]

Just saw this load of Baloney on Facebook
https://www.facebook.com/ProudToWearMyPoppy/photos/a.1472412113033612.1073741828.1472390089702481/1907759692832183/?type=3
https://www.facebook.com/ProudToWearMyPoppy/photos/a.1472412113033612.1073741828.1472390089702481/1907759692832183/?type=3
This sort of Propaganda deserved a response here is mine

"What a load of Baloney! the people who wrote this were not even alive at the time of the second world warm were they? to have fought in that war you would have to be 96 Years old! The continentals owe you nothing whatsover for the efforts of our Fathers and Grandfathers who made the sacrifice, you should be ashamed of claiming credit for something that was nothing whatsoever to do with you! Show some respect for the previous generation and don't use their sacrifice for Propaganda purposes."

 

[flecc]

Just saw this load of Baloney on Facebook
https://www.facebook.com/ProudToWearMyPoppy/photos/a.1472412113033612.1073741828.1472390089702481/1907759692832183/?type=3
This sort of Propaganda deserved a response here is mine

"What a load of Baloney! the people who wrote this were not even alive at the time of the second world warm were they? to have fought in that war you would have to be 96 Years old! The continentals owe you nothing whatsover for the efforts of our Fathers and Grandfathers who made the sacrifice, you should be ashamed of claiming credit for something that was nothing whatsoever to do with you! Show some respect for the previous generation and don't use their sacrifice for Propaganda purposes."

And once again the myth of Europe punishing us. When will it sink in the heads of these morons that we are merely being asked to pay what we promised and signed up to, and what we receive the benefits of.
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[Woosh]

And once again the myth of Europe punishing us. When will it sink in the heads of these morons that we are merely being asked to pay what we promised and signed up to, and what we receive the benefits of.
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the newspapers reported a big row over the cost of CAP as one of the negotiable areas from the British point of view.
When we are out, should we still pay into CAP for many years and don't enjoy frictionless trade in foodstuff in the corresponding period? Would the rebate apply to liabilities?

 

[oldgroaner]

the newspapers reported a big row over the cost of CAP as one of the negotiable areas from the British point of view.
When we are out, should we still pay into CAP for many years and don't enjoy frictionless trade in foodstuff in the corresponding period? Would the rebate apply to liabilities?

Possibly, and the EU haven't ruled out negotiating these points, have they?

 

[Woosh]

the problem is the politicians from both sides want to play chicken.

 

[oldgroaner]

From Reuters today
"
EU officials saw the statement, which said "the government recognises that the UK has obligations to the EU, and the EU obligations to the UK, that will survive the UK’s withdrawal", as a welcome acceptance that the finances had to be discussed.

It was still unclear, however, whether Davis will expressly agree with the assumption in Brussels that, however the calculation is worked out, the result will be that Britain pays the EU and not the other way around. EU officials said there was also discussion of how Britain's long-standing rebate on EU budget payments should be treated in the calculations..

That last sentence is the most interesting one I wonder what conditions were attached to those rebates to make the EU accept them in the first place?

 

[Woosh]

assuming that you can take the word of the politicians from both sides (UK/EU) at face value, you come to the point that neither can win on the long run.
The facts are simple: both sides have to continue to trade for practical reasons. The EU can't punish the UK because few of its members would see that as a worthy objective on the long term, the UK can't balance its budget for a very long time if it loses the contribution of EU immigrants. So, logic says that both sides have to accommodate each other, UK pays in and decides how many and who EU immigrants it wants to take.

 

[Danidl]

assuming that you can take the word of the politicians from both sides (UK/EU) at face value, you come to the point that neither can win on the long run.
The facts are simple: both sides have to continue to trade for practical reasons. The EU can't punish the UK because few of its members would see that as a worthy objective on the long term, the UK can't balance its budget for a very long time if it loses the contribution of EU immigrants. So, logic says that both sides have to accommodate each other, UK pays in and decides how many and who EU immigrants it wants to take.

.. You are consistently assuming that the EU has some mission to punish the UK. Question that assumption. Now the EU will not want to reward a member for behaving as the UK has behaved... Carping at every opportunity, wilfully misrepresentation of the functions and roles of EU commissions , whining and getting a rebate in Mrs Tatchers time . Now you might claim that it is not official UK doing these things but just elements of the Press but were it so, where were the debunking of these misrepresentations from official UK.?
Nevertheless the EU would want the UK on side, even if only to plug a huge security hole in the North sea.
Can you instance occasions in these negotiationswhere the official line from the EU has been vindictive?