Brexit, for once some facts.

oldgroaner

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 15, 2015
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Another Hero rises to the occasion
"
Mark Francois reportedly willing to go up Big Ben with hammer and 'bong' it himself
I wonder if this idiot has any idea how very brave nay foolish you would have to be to do that? :D
 

flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
53,196
30,602
That's lies again. I've never left this forum because of a dispute. I always have other reasons for leaving, of which you know nothing about.
Again? I've just proved you wrong when you tried this dishonesty earlier.

If you prefer to be a liar again, that's your choice.
.
 
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oyster

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 7, 2017
10,422
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On a lighter note
Cometh the hour, cometh the man
"
Uri Geller calls for Dominic Cummings to hire him to secure post-Brexit trade deals
Geller said he saw himself as an "international ambassador" - able to help solve the crisis in the Persian Gulf and bring about a nuclear deal that both Iran and the US would agree to.

"I believe I can also negotiate with Iran and get the peace agreements much faster than anyone else can do."


All together now, let's have a collective sigh of relief. :cool:
I met him (UG - not, thankfully, DC) once. During a total eclipse in the English channel. On a ferry.

Seemed perfectly pleasant but I don't believe a word of his self-proclaimed abilities.
 
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jonathan.agnew

Esteemed Pedelecer
Dec 27, 2018
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That was in the days when the Brexit thread was extremely accessible and noticeable from the main forum. My words were brief, but what I meant was that I would have preferred if politics had been kept away from the electric bike forum. The reasons being that there were many bad words posted and things got very personal, which caused many good contributors to the electric bike stuff to leave the forum entirely. If you look at the posts in this Brexit thread at that time, you will see that a very large number of people from the main forum got drawn into it.

All this was solved when admin more or less hid it. Now, people that come to Pedelecs looking for electric bike info, don't find it, so they don't get drawn in. If you look at who's posting now, you'll see that virtually no new people have found their way here from the Electric bike sections. It's just the same approx 10 people.

Now that my wish has been achieved, and this thread is not corrupting what goes on in the electric bike section, I'm happy. I think admin did a good job.

The threads's whole existence seemed a bit pointless other than being a means to vent off some steam. The facts presented were never going to convince anyone nor influence anything. It never achieved anything other than bad feelings.

Even now, it's toxicity hasn't gone. Look how you're trying to dig up evidence to expose me as a bad person, and trying to twist what I say into the most negative interpretation, like some sort of witch hunt. I'm not a bad person, so that's not going to work, but if it helps you vent off steam from your own problems, then go ahead. It doesn't bother me.

I'd like to remind you Mr Zlatan that in post #20 of that thread, when Tommy said that the Brexit thread should be closed, your name is there with a big fat green tick!

If it adds to my case, I'll give you this quote from Mr Zlatan in the same thread, which pretty well summed up the situation at that time. Note the bit about dual identities. I think you should review some of your posts in the last couple of days Mr Zlatan:

"Expressing opinions on anything is absolutely fine...hijacking sections of a forum, insulting opposing views and then using forum to soap box your own indoctrinations should not be tolerated.

Just for record without flecc ( and Woosh) that thread would have deteriorated even lower. It seems to me some ( including those two) can have civilised discussion with opposing views and agree to disagree. For some on that thread this quality is missing.
Mods should delete and sin bin offending posts, posters. ( Calling all leavers racists, all Tories scum etc etc has no place on forum in any section)
I also suspect there are dual identity posters prevalent on the thread. Mods could stop that.
If there were a poll, I,d vote to close thread. "
Here's some free advice. Despite the fact that were from diametrically opposite ends of the political spectrum. Because I have an allergic dislike of ganging up (and get more than a whiff of that happening). And dont like joining a consensus. And because, as far as I can tell, everyone except, perhaps, woosh, has behaved atrociously at some point on this thread (let him who have no sin and all that). And like feeding birds. Disengage from this argument. It's not worth it. Make a few on topic posts, if you can be bothered (I often cant). Ignore the insults, it says more about the posters making it than anything else. Take it all less seriously.
 

vfr400

Esteemed Pedelecer
Jun 12, 2011
9,822
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Basildon
The rhetoric in the press is starting to swing.

BREXIT COULD BOOST UK ECONOMY BY £135 BILLION, SAY TOP ECONOMISTS

 

oyster

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 7, 2017
10,422
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BREXIT COULD BOOST UK ECONOMY BY £135 BILLION, SAY TOP ECONOMISTS

The only date I could see on that page was 2018. And it promised The full report, From Project Fear to Project Prosperity, will be published in the autumn.
That report has a date of 15th August 2017.

https://www.economistsforfreetrade.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/From-Project-Fear-to-Project-Prosperity-An-Introduction-15-Aug-17-2.pdf

A lot of water has flowed under a lot of bridges since then.

The latest date I could find was 13th March 2019 - on a page with a copyright of 2018 (???).
 
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flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
53,196
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The only date I could see on that page was 2018. And it promised The full report, From Project Fear to Project Prosperity, will be published in the autumn.
That report has a date of 15th August 2017.

https://www.economistsforfreetrade.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/From-Project-Fear-to-Project-Prosperity-An-Introduction-15-Aug-17-2.pdf

A lot of water has flowed under a lot of bridges since then.

The latest date I could find was 13th March 2019 - on a page with a copyright of 2018 (???).
Indeed, it is an old prediction. In fact Zlatan has posted 17 times about Patrick Minford's pro Brexit predictions, the first time in November 2016.

All those posts are on this link.
 
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Zlatan

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 26, 2016
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Indeed, it is an old prediction. In fact Zlatan has posted 17 times about Patrick Minford's pro Brexit predictions, the first time in November 2016.

All those posts are on this link.
And, I, m not convinced anymore... They have all gone rather quiet..And although I haven't slogged back through the lot, I believe I, d already discounted Minford's view.
Hargreaves was very vocal pre referendum (I believe he contacted every household? He did ours and he was main reason I voted leave) but he has said nothing about Brexit, that I have seen, for 2 years or so. I, d guess the fallout from Woodford / Hargreaves Lansdown scandal has made him keep a lower profile. There are links between Brexit situation and Woodfords strategy (or lack of it) but I, m not certain which way he, d banked to keep ship afloat. Woodford has come to typify all thats wrong with priviliged monied type. Hargreaves could have done more? ,perhaps,who knows?
I, m afraid rightly or wrongly the mud has, and will continue to do so, stick to HL. (and Hargreaves who no longer works at HL) Both HL and Hargreaves are working to distance themselves from Woodford. Affected HL customers are in line for compensation. Its a disgrace, the lot of it.
 
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flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
53,196
30,602
And, I, m not convinced anymore... They have all gone rather quiet..And although I haven't slogged back through the lot, I believe I, d already discounted Minford's view.
Yes, I knew you had, merely posted to show that this was old news.

However, Minford is an economics professor for a reason and I've no doubt his calculations did and still do reflect the economic potential of Brexit.

But therein is the problem, potential is theory. To be realised it's necessary for us to be making the stuff the world wants at the price they'll pay, and shipped in the huge quantities necessary to reach Minford's prediction.

And that of course is where we fall flat on our face, since we do neither. The range of things we make now is pathetically small since we turned ourselves into a services economy, and those few things we do make have far too small a potential market to support us.
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Woosh

Trade Member
May 19, 2012
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wooshbikes.co.uk
Minford's model is based entirely on the UK pulling out of manufacturing and becoming Singapore in Europe.
I don't think the EU and the US like this idea a tiny little bit.
Competing on tax regime is a non starter.
 

oldgroaner

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Nov 15, 2015
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flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
53,196
30,602
Minford's model is based entirely on the UK pulling out of manufacturing and becoming Singapore in Europe.
I don't think the EU and the US like this idea a tiny little bit.
Competing on tax regime is a non starter.
Very true. We are also set on pulling out of our most valuable source of services income and haven't the land mass or climate to become a major food exporter.

That just leaves manufacturing where, as I posted, we just don't have anything like sufficient current ability or even potential in terms of product, price or volume.

There's no doubt in my mind that a no deal exit would have a catastrophic outcome, and I'm sure a deal either side of the Atlantic would leave us worse off for a very long time than we were before Brexit.
.
 
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oldgroaner

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 15, 2015
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Very true. We are also set on pulling out of our most valuable source of services income and haven't the land mass or climate to become a major food exporter.

That just leaves manufacturing where, as I posted, we just don't have anything like sufficient current ability or even potential in terms of product, price or volume.

There's no doubt in my mind that a no deal exit would have a catastrophic outcome, and I'm sure a deal either side of the Atlantic would leave us worse off for a very long time than we were before Brexit.
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The supreme irony from the voter's point of view is that the Brexit vote was for many was a protest against Austerity, and the end result has been to weld those responsible even more firmly in place.
 

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