Brexit, for once some facts.

tillson

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May 29, 2008
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Shame that it has given rise to so many abuses of the system, isn't it? and a whole class of speculators that damaged house prices.
Whenever money and human beings are brought together abuse and fraud will take place. It’s what humans do. Benefit fraud happens on both sides, some recipients claim money to which they aren’t entitled and some landlords rip off tenants.

We can’t condemn the everyone based on the actions of a few. All we can do is our best to crackdown on the abusers on both sides. There is some high quality accommodation available in the private rental sector at a fair price.


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oldtom

Esteemed Pedelecer
A Labour government will bring some sanity back to the UK and put an end to venture capitalists and foreign governments and their corporate friends buying up our major utilities, through a programme of re-nationalisation.

Anyone who has watched this little clip will understand why it is important to re-take control of our railways but that is only one area - there are many others where tory thieves have stolen great entities owned and supported by the British taxpayers then hawked them off to the highest foreign bidder with handsome, invisible commissions for those responsible for the thefts.


Tom
 
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Zlatan

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A Labour government will bring some sanity back to the UK and put an end to venture capitalists and foreign governments and their corporate friends buying up our major utilities, through a programme of re-nationalisation.

Anyone who has watched this little clip will understand why it is important to re-take control of our railways but that is only one area - there are many others where tory thieves have stolen great entities owned and supported by the British taxpayers then hawked them off to the highest foreign bidder with handsome, invisible commissions for those responsible for the thefts.


Tom
No,the current labour party would bankrupt us in 12 months.
 

tillson

Esteemed Pedelecer
May 29, 2008
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A Labour government will bring some sanity back to the UK and put an end to venture capitalists and foreign governments and their corporate friends buying up our major utilities, through a programme of re-nationalisation.

Anyone who has watched this little clip will understand why it is important to re-take control of our railways but that is only one area - there are many others where tory thieves have stolen great entities owned and supported by the British taxpayers then hawked them off to the highest foreign bidder with handsome, invisible commissions for those responsible for the thefts.


Tom
I think certain utilities such as transport, energy & health should be under state control. The concern I have is with regards to who will run them. The public sector tends to attract massive bell-ends, complete tools when it comes to business. I think we know that if for instance, the railways were re nationalised, an arse-hole would be appointed to run it based on some ridiculous employment quota scheme. Within six months they would run it into the ground with a bloated management structure and hideous inefficiency.

The theory of nationalisation I like, having seen public sector management in action, the reality is inefficiency, poor decisions, incompetence and generally poor working conditions for staff.
 
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Danidl

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Sep 29, 2016
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I think certain utilities such as transport, energy & health should be under state control. The concern I have is with regards to who will run them. The public sector tends to attract massive bell-ends, complete tools when it comes to business. I think we know that if for instance, the railways were re nationalised, an arse-hole would be appointed to run it based on some ridiculous employment quota scheme. Within six months they would run it into the ground with a bloated management structure and hideous inefficiency.

The theory of nationalisation I like, having seen public sector management in action, the reality is inefficiency, poor decisions, incompetence and generally poor working conditions for staff.
We are way way off topic, which is was brexit and its ramifications. I would however disagree with you to an extent . some state enterprises are excellent provided they dont get above their station as it were, and if they are kept isolated from party politics. It is perhaps a derided term, but public servants charged with running public enterprises have to be imbued with a sense of patriotism. I am happy to say I have met many such in my life to date.
 
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OxygenJames

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Jan 8, 2012
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What I always find disappointing when a Labour Government gets in, is that all these "celebrities" and rich parasites who say they're going to leave the country if labour gets in, don't.
The Labour government that left a note last time saying 'there's no more money left'.
Because the government aren't paying my rent, they are paying the tenants who would be receiving housing benefit even if not in a property I own, and if they moved I,d be able to charge a more realistic rent.( £500 for a 3 bed semi in a leafy suburb with front and rear garden and double garage, recommended rent £625, most govt will pay to family £500. They should be making up difference...but cant)
Like I said, you typify exactly why labour/ Corbyn are unelectable.
Stop proving you are nothing but a silly old cantankerous p1ll0ck OG. Your current argument against me is quite ridiculous. And BTW originally this family paid their own rent, perhaps you would have evicted them when they couldn't pay . I returned their bond and waited until their claim for rent was processed...missing 2 months rent ...And there is still no bond paid in house. They don't have one.( yes, its very risky on my part)
Stop showing yourself up OG.
I,d actually prefer to sell house and invest elsewhere but that would entail evicting family..which from your stupid comments is exactly what you would do.
But, prey tell us what you would do ?
But you wont. You,ll just come back shouting exploitation left wing bs.
So please explain how I,m either profiteering or benefitting from system ? Or perhaps I wouldn't be if this family moved to a run down area of town and I rented out to somebody capable of paying full rent ? I,d feel loads better, his kids having to change schools and no garden to play in...but I,d be £125 a month better off but some how not exploiting system any more.
No,the current labour party would bankrupt us in 12 months.
12?
 
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tillson

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May 29, 2008
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We are way way off topic, which is was brexit and its ramifications. I would however disagree with you to an extent . some state enterprises are excellent provided they dont get above their station as it were, and if they are kept isolated from party politics. It is perhaps a derided term, but public servants charged with running public enterprises have to be imbued with a sense of patriotism. I am happy to say I have met many such in my life to date.
Don’t worry yourself, the whole thread is way off topic. It’s just a free-for-all opportunity to sound off.

Conversely, some of the biggest toss-pots that I have ever encountered have been in public service management.
 
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Woosh

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May 19, 2012
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There's over four years to the next general election, a period in which we are likely to see a drop in the economy with falling living standards and rising prices while Brexit settles towards eventual success or failure.

The public are already increasingly impatient with recent politics and greatly resent all aspects of the period of decline following the 2008 recession. Brexit by 2022 will be so boring it won't even be an issue for the majority. I believe the 2022 GE outcome will be a radical reset of political party fortunes, with Labour winning by default due to the anti-Tory feelings, the LibDems experiencing a considerable recovery and a huge fall in the number of Conservative MPs.

Then all bets will be off.
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brexit is a long term issue. In the meantime, the economy will continue to struggle because the UK has an important structural deficit which was covered by the City of London and in the last 10 years, by increases in immigration. Now that brexit is nearly here, fewer immigrants come to the UK, the structural deficit will be more keenly felt.
There is not that much differences between the conservative party and labour, both want to square the brexit circle, only people in the middle have a sensible solution. Sure, the electorate will soon be fed up with constant brexit being debated on TV, they will turn to someone with new ideas. The UK has traditionally little experience with centrism - may be now is the time.
 
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Zlatan

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Nov 26, 2016
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brexit is a long term issue. In the meantime, the economy will continue to struggle because the UK has an important structural deficit which was covered by the City of London and in the last 10 years, by increases in immigration. Now that brexit is nearly here, fewer immigrants come to the UK, the structural deficit will be more keenly felt.
There is not that much differences between the conservative party and labour, both want to square the brexit circle, only people in the middle have a sensible solution. Sure, the electorate will soon be fed up with constant brexit being debated on TV, they will turn to someone with new ideas. The UK has traditionally little experience with centrism - may be now is the time.
That's much nearer to how I see it...either Tories making financial sacrifices or labour social ones. Neither seem capable at the moment. And quite possibly its Blairs fault..
 
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Woosh

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May 19, 2012
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And quite possibly its Blairs fault..
the media has made a big deal out of Blair's share of blame for the war in Iraq. All politicians lie, Blair is no different. I don't think another PM at that time could have said no to President Bush, who in a way was not any more subtle than Mr Trump, Bush said then 'you either are with us or against us'. The war in Afghanistan was started by Nato, any Bristish PM would bend under American pressure. From my point of view, a US of E's common foreign policy could have mitigated the catastrophic human costs of these wars.
 
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oldtom

Esteemed Pedelecer
Care in the community really isn't working, judging by the lunacy apparent in some of these posts from the 'Brexidiots' on the first day of 2018.

The UK is culling badgers under a tory government which chose not to listen to the advice of experts, just because tories like destroying things. When we start culling tories, the UK will become a far better place for everyone left!

Tom
 
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Zlatan

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the media has made a big deal out of Blair's share of blame for the war in Iraq. All politicians lie, Blair is no different. I don't think another PM at that time could have said no to President Bush, who in a way was not any more subtle than Mr Trump, Bush said then 'you either are with us or against us'. The war in Afghanistan was started by Nato, any Bristish PM would bend under American pressure. From my point of view, a US of E's common foreign policy could have mitigated the catastrophic human costs of these wars.
It wasn't just the blame put on him for our part in the war it was his entire handling of situation from the start to the end. Initially he lied ( wmd) , supported Bush without question and I firmly believe was involved in a cover up around Dr Kelly. Ok, perhaps he didn't have him assassinated but Kelly was at least put under immense pressure to not go against government and say things that could easily have brought entire pack of cards crashing down. The man is a proven liar, we simply suspect that of all the rest. IMHO his lies killed many and we are still feeling repercussions in the east to this day. I also think the labour party has almost destroyed itself trying to distance itself from him.He still has massive suport within the party. To be fair in his early days I thought he was marvelous.

Nice to see Tom can find it in his heart to support the super rich in their adversity. He seems to be continually posting links to the extremely wealthy. Nice one.
 
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SHAN

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His ability in that department is sound, unlike tory fiscal policy, based as it is on the work of Mr HC Andersen.

Tom
Possibly he should be better prepared for radio interviews. Just because Tory fiscal policy is proving to be "wrong" doesn't automatically make the opposition's right.
 
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flecc

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Possibly he should be better prepared for radio interviews.
I think it's deliberate. An opposition giving away in detail what they intend to do just allows the party in power to steal their ideas. Labour due to inexperience have suffered this many times but now seem to have learned at last.

Better to appear vague and lacking detail, knowing how short the public's memory is anyway. The detail can appear when it can count, in the final run-up to the election.
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SHAN

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I think it's deliberate. An opposition giving away in detail what they intend to do just allows the party in power to steal their ideas. Labour due to inexperience have suffered this many times but now seem to have learned at last.

Better to appear vague and lacking detail, knowing how short the public's memory is anyway. The detail can appear when it can count, in the final run-up to the election.
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I won't disagree, but a few politicians have fallen on their own sword as a result of bad radio practice. Whoever replaces the current government should do so not by default but by being sharper. Unfortunately Fiscal policy is where the buck stops. The financial markets are "king".
 
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flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
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Whoever replaces the current government should do so not by default but by being sharper. Unfortunately Fiscal policy is where the buck stops. The financial markets are "king".
In office by default will suffice, in politics expediency is king.

As for fiscal policy, it remains to be seen how McDonnell will perform if actually elected. He may surprise over time.
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oldtom

Esteemed Pedelecer
Whoever replaces the current government should do so not by default but by being sharper. Unfortunately Fiscal policy is where the buck stops. The financial markets are "king".
All the myths about Labour fiscal incompetence perpetuated by moronic, brainwashed tory scum was abroad thanks to the self-same tory press (we now say media!) before the post-WW2 Labour government was elected.

That government took on a hugely ambitious programme to house, feed and care for the nation and they did so through good husbandry of the meagre funds they inherited in the exchequer. The tories lied about the state of the nation's finances back then in an attempt to discredit Labour and they have been doing so ever since.

Every generation since has been deluged by the same lies from the same sources and the brainwashing-of-the-nation programme created then has since been improved, honed and finessed to such an extent that millions of morons today cannot begin to comprehend that they are victims.

Intelligent people understand that no Labour government ever has created a national debt - indeed, Labour has a fantastic record of debt reduction.

Tom
 
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