Brexit, for once some facts.

[Kudoscycles]

What I always find disappointing when a Labour Government gets in, is that all these "celebrities" and rich parasites who say they're going to leave the country if labour gets in, don't.

If Corbyn gets in he will instantly raise corporation tax to 25%, that will mean the big corporations will move their profits even more aggressively to low corp tax locations like Ireland,overall less tax will be raised.
Much better would be to lower corp tax but develop a mechanism that forces these big companies to reveal their profits in the U.K.,perhaps a revenue tax,where every company pays corp tax or revenue tax.
KudosDave

 

[SHAN]

If Corbyn gets in he will instantly raise corporation tax to 25%, that will mean the big corporations will move their profits even more aggressively to low corp tax locations like Ireland,overall less tax will be raised.
Much better would be to lower corp tax but develop a mechanism that forces these big companies to reveal their profits in the U.K.,perhaps a revenue tax,where every company pays corp tax or revenue tax.
KudosDave

Nobody knows what will happen. It wasn't that long ago labour insider's were treating Corbyn as an unelectable joke. More worrying is John McDonnell's arithmetic.

 

[Woosh]

It wasn't that long ago labour insider's were treating Corbyn as an unelectable joke.

I think the Corbyn brand is a little oversold.
He benefited from the tactical votes from students and remainers. Since, Corbyn seems to have played down his daring manifesto.
At the next GE, these votes may go to the LibDems if they copy Mr Corbyn's tactics.

 

[SHAN]

At the next GE, these votes may go to the LibDems if they copy Mr Corbyn's tactics.

Which is about all they're fit for. Mind you, regardless of who you are "for or against" its always a mistake to underestimate anyone, which has happened with disastrous consequences throughout history. Lessons are NEVER learned.

 

[SHAN]

students

As were our current "leaders" at one time in their lives.

 

[flecc]

At the next GE, these votes may go to the LibDems if they copy Mr Corbyn's tactics.

There's over four years to the next general election, a period in which we are likely to see a drop in the economy with falling living standards and rising prices while Brexit settles towards eventual success or failure.

The public are already increasingly impatient with recent politics and greatly resent all aspects of the period of decline following the 2008 recession. Brexit by 2022 will be so boring it won't even be an issue for the majority. I believe the 2022 GE outcome will be a radical reset of political party fortunes, with Labour winning by default due to the anti-Tory feelings, the LibDems experiencing a considerable recovery and a huge fall in the number of Conservative MPs.

Then all bets will be off.
.

 

[SHAN]

Oh dear.
https://www.theguardian.com/education/2018/jan/01/toby-young-universities-regulator-office-for-students

 

[Zlatan]

There's over four years to the next general election, a period in which we are likely to see a drop in the economy with falling living standards and rising prices while Brexit settles towards eventual success or failure.

The public are already increasingly impatient with recent politics and greatly resent all aspects of the period of decline following the 2008 recession. Brexit by 2022 will be so boring it won't even be an issue for the majority. I believe the 2022 GE outcome will be a radical reset of political party fortunes, with Labour winning by default due to the anti-Tory feelings, the LibDems experiencing a considerable recovery and a huge fall in the number of Conservative MPs.

Then all bets will be off.
.

You might be right about Labour but not if they do not change policies and get rid of Corbyn. The whole voting public has changed, just read on here how many are actually landlords, how many have money invested.
The entire demograph has shifted to the right,yes the extreme left are vocal but just see what happens in elections. Labour realised about this shift and rightly or wrongly gave us Blair and New Labour. Blair threw away the faith shown in him and destroyed New Labour. The party reacted going other way giving us Corbyn. When labour wake up and realise there has been a massive shift right they will get power. If they continue being steered by and listening to their left...they never will get in no10.
The impression given on here by the vocal left do not give anything like a realistic picture of our current voting public. The lefties like to think this shift has been proliferated by right wing press, which may well have had some affect . The real reason is the high number of people for whom policies previously seen as benefitting the right now benefit many. ie..the ones mentioned on here around landlords / tennants. There are many others. ( IHT laws,CG tax etc etc)
Labour not being able to change and adapt to a changing demograph is part of our current problem. The tories are still sitting pretty.

 

[flecc]

You might be right about Labour but not if they do not change policies and get rid of Corbyn. The whole voting public has changed, just read on here how many are actually landlords, how many have money invested.
The entire demograph has shifted to the right,yes the extreme left are vocal but just see what happens in elections. Labour realised about this shift and gave rightly or wrongly gave us Blair and New Labour. Blair threw away the faith shown in him and destroyed New Labour. The party reacted going other way giving us Corbyn. When labour wake up and realise there has been a massive shift right they will get power. If they continue being steered and listening to their left...they never will get in no10.
The impression given on here by the vocal left do not give anything like a realistic picture of our current voting public. They like to think this shift has been proliferated by right wing press, which may well have had some affect . The real reason is the high number of people for whom policies previously seen as benefitting the right now benefit many. ie..the ones mentioned on here around landlords / tennants. There are many others. ( IHT laws,CG tax etc etc)

While I understand what you are expressing, I feel you've discounted what I've posted about how the public will be feeling in 2022. Just look back at the past recessions and what followed:

The 1980 Thatcher recession. By 1985 the economy was doing quite well, unemployment down and many new businesses helping to give a feel good factor.

The 1991 John Major recession. Again by five years later things had picked up and we were entering a boom period.

The public are well used to "boom and bust", survive those dips and can forgive the party in power as following elections show.

But now look at the so called 2008 recession which actually started in late 2007:

Far from recovering in five years as we always did previously, it's now ten years since and we are still suffering its ill effects. Worse still, prices are rising while incomes are still being held down and the housing crisis worsens by the day. Already there's huge resentment at this seemingly never ending situation, expressed against all of our politicians but especially against the governments who presided over this period.

Now add four further years to the next general election during which the economy will suffer more while the Brexit dust settles. The outcome as I've posted will be a very forceful public reaction at the ballot box.

In 2022 Brexit won't be an issue, for the great majority it's already no longer an issue as they've got bored with it and by then they'll be sick of it. And what the newspapers say about Corbyn won't be much of an issue since propaganda repeated for too many years loses its effect, and ever fewer even read newspapers.

So, exactly as I posted, the public's anger against the Tory party's rule over the 14 years of personal decline will lead to their punishment, leading to Labour slipping into power by default. It's not a question of Corbyn winning, it's one of the Tories losing, and the recovery of the LibDems will underline that.
.

 

[Zlatan]

While I understand what you are expressing, I feel you've discounted what I've posted about how the public will be feeling in 2022. Just look back at the past recessions and what followed:

The 1980 Thatcher recession. By 1985 the economy was doing quite well, unemployment down and many new businesses helping to give a feel good factor.

The 1991 John Major recession. Again by five years later things had picked up and we were entering a boom period.

The public are well used to "boom and bust", survive those dips and can forgive the party in power as following elections show.

But now look at the so called 2008 recession which actually started in late 2007:

Far from recovering in five years as we always did previously, it's now ten years since and we are still suffering its ill effects. Worse still, prices are rising while incomes are still being held down and the housing crisis worsens by the day. Already there's huge resentment at this seemingly never ending situation, expressed against all of our politicians but especially against the governments who presided over this period.

Now add four further years to the next general election during which the economy will suffer more while the Brexit dust settles. The outcome as I've posted will be a very forceful public reaction at the ballot box.

In 2022 Brexit won't be an issue, for the great majority it's already no longer an issue as they've got bored with it and by then they'll be sick of it. And what the newspapers say about Corbyn won't be much of an issue since propaganda repeated for too many years loses its effect, and ever fewer even read newspapers.

So, exactly as I posted, the public's anger against the Tory party's rule over the 14 years of personal decline will lead to their punishment, leading to Labour slipping into power by default. It's not a question of Corbyn winning, it's one of the Tories losing, and the recovery of the LibDems will underline that.
.

Yes, I see all that Flecc and obviously you could be right.
I am very cynical about human nature and people vote very selfishly. If voters feel Tory policies benefit them.personally they will hold onto power. Its very difficult, almost contradictory for labour policies to be viewed as benefitting land lords,investors, IHT receivers, CG payees etc etc.
But time will tell ???!!!

 

[SHAN]

The public are well used to "boom and bust",.

Perhaps they forget about it.

leading to Labour slipping into power by default. o

Possibly the reason why any party gets in throughout history.

and the recovery of the LibDems

Which will always be a protest vote.

 

[flecc]

Yes, I see all that Flecc and obviously you could be right.
I am very cynical about human nature and people vote very selfishly. If voters feel Tory policies benefit them.personally they will hold onto power. Its very difficult, almost contradictory for labour policies to be viewed as benefitting land lords,investors, IHT receivers, CG payees etc etc.
But time will tell ???!!!

I've happily agreed this. At the next GE it's likely to be a numbers game in which nowhere near enough will feel they've benefitted from the Conservative's last 14 years to return them to power. It will be the party's misfortune since they didn't cause the 2008 recession, they'll be just as much victims of the bankers as the rest of us.
.

 

[oldgroaner]

Could not agree more. Its been sheer circumstance we remained land lords. Selling with a tennant devalues property and asking them.to leave not quite right...but try telling OG that.
Why that allows OG to decide I,m profiteering and a hypocrit I,m not quite sure but in doing so he sheds light on why Labour will never see power under Corbyn. If I,m seen as OG suggests (ie profiteering??). the entire business world will never support him.
BTW house prices are not rising sufficiently to see capital growth. Perhaps selective isolated regions but generally houses are not even beating FTSE,which has also stagnated for last decade. Best thing to do at moment if you have capital is spend it...no pockets in shrouds.

So you think it's right to cream off benefits into your pockets as rent?
Of course it's profiteering! what else can it be?
Why should my tax payments be going into your pocket?

And now you try to make out how public spirited you are?
Very droll

 

[oldgroaner]

An apology from OG?! Come on now. Be sensible. That's something you are almost never going to see - no matter what the circumstances.

Nice rant btw - we (me and the wife) rented out one of our flats after moving in together - got tenants in there - nice family - but with Corbyn making all the noises he is we are going to sell next year - its just too risky - interest rates going up (we have some of it on a mortgage) - but mainly the insanity of Corbyn and the fact that he seems to hate landlords - even good ones like me who look after the place - don't charge top rents - don't hold massive deposits - but Corbyn's not interested - he'll do some insane rent cap that will mean the number of decent places available will go down because people like me will get out of the business - meaning you're left with less properties and of lower quality. Of course he might not get in - but I don't really want the stress of thinking he might - so next year its bad news for my tenants.

Oh - one correction on something you said - that 70% A and E figure is often misquoted - was from a study on the main hospital in Newcastle - the actual facts (something various people here don't like but you sound like you're open to them) - the actual fact is that the 70% refers to Sat night from 2 - 4am. Overall for the weekend the figure is - if memory serves me right - 12%. Public Health England, who if they have their way will ban anything we like to do - and they're one of the one's who continually refer to that figure - incorrectly.

Another outbreak of self righteousness from a right winger, but what else is to be expected? I see you have no qualms about dumping them do you?

 

[tillson]

So you think it's right to cream off benefits into your pockets as rent?
Of course it's profiteering! what else can it be?
Why should my tax payments be going into your pocket?

And now you try to make out how public spirited you are?
Very droll

The benefit you refer to is Housing Benefit and as the name suggests, it is paid to the recipient so they can pay for accommodation. If someone is providing safe housing of a good standard and at a fair price, why shouldn’t the landlord accept the housing benefit as payment? That’s what it’s intended for.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

 

[tillson]

..... and here we have the face of socialism.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

 

[oldgroaner]

..... and here we have the face of socialism.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

Wrong word you mean Conservatism, which is after all what the word means.

 

[oldgroaner]

The benefit you refer to is Housing Benefit and as the name suggests, it is paid to the recipient so they can pay for accommodation. If someone is providing safe housing of a good standard and at a fair price, why shouldn’t the landlord accept the housing benefit as payment? That’s what it’s intended for.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

Shame that it has given rise to so many abuses of the system, isn't it? and a whole class of speculators that damaged house prices.

 

[oldtom]

More worrying is John McDonnell's arithmetic.

His ability in that department is sound, unlike tory fiscal policy, based as it is on the work of Mr HC Andersen.

Tom

 

[Zlatan]

So you think it's right to cream off benefits into your pockets as rent?
Of course it's profiteering! what else can it be?
Why should my tax payments be going into your pocket?

And now you try to make out how public spirited you are?
Very droll

Because the government aren't paying my rent, they are paying the tenants who would be receiving housing benefit even if not in a property I own, and if they moved I,d be able to charge a more realistic rent.( £500 for a 3 bed semi in a leafy suburb with front and rear garden and double garage, recommended rent £625, most govt will pay to family £500. They should be making up difference...but cant)
Like I said, you typify exactly why labour/ Corbyn are unelectable.
Stop proving you are nothing but a silly old cantankerous p1ll0ck OG. Your current argument against me is quite ridiculous. And BTW originally this family paid their own rent, perhaps you would have evicted them when they couldn't pay . I returned their bond and waited until their claim for rent was processed...missing 2 months rent ...And there is still no bond paid in house. They don't have one.( yes, its very risky on my part)
Stop showing yourself up OG.
I,d actually prefer to sell house and invest elsewhere but that would entail evicting family..which from your stupid comments is exactly what you would do.
But, prey tell us what you would do ?
But you wont. You,ll just come back shouting exploitation left wing bs.
So please explain how I,m either profiteering or benefitting from system ? Or perhaps I wouldn't be if this family moved to a run down area of town and I rented out to somebody capable of paying full rent ? I,d feel loads better, his kids having to change schools and no garden to play in...but I,d be £125 a month better off but some how not exploiting system any more.