Brexit, for once some facts.

[oldgroaner]

Arlene Foster is wrong in saying she will not accept any regulatory divergence. Such divergence already exists and is accepted by the DUP:

N.I. subjects have the right to be R.o.I. citizens.

N.I. subjects have the right to be EU citizens.

Other UK citizens without Irish relationships have no such automatic rights.

Ergo, there is already regulatory divergence and Brexit doesn't mean N.I.'s subjects are leaving the EU completely. Only the geography is really leaving and with "regulatory divergence", even that will hardly be fully leaving.
.

Perhaps Mrs May should promise the DUP and even bigger Bribe?

 

[oldgroaner]

Laura Kuenssberg‏Verified account@bbclaurak

Hearing it was the DUP call that sunk today's chances of a deal - Foster held her press conf, 20 mins later May leaves talks with Juncker to call her, goes back into the room and the deal is off.

Yep, deal will be on DUP`s terms Mr. Juncker!

Don't you mean unless a bigger Bribe is forthcoming?
You can't put a price on loyalty, well most people can't

 

[tommie]

My word! Now a Labour MP in full agreement !

Kate Hoey‏Verified account@KateHoeyMP 56m56 minutes ago



Kate Hoey Retweeted Arlene Foster

Absolutely right

Kate Hoey added,

Arlene FosterVerified account@DUPleader
We will not accept any form of regulatory divergence which separates Northern Ireland economically or politically from the rest of the United Kingdom.

 

[Kudoscycles]

Well yes, apart from the fact that the Farmers and Fisherman also want to keep the benefits and even Wetherspoons have been on this today, saying he needs immigrant labour.

Its as if everyone is finally starting to realise what the membership of the EU gives us.

I thought the boss of Wetherspoons was an ardent Leaver.
KudosDave

 

[Kudoscycles]

Its all going to work out ok.

The areas in YELLOW voted to REMAIN in the European Union so will continue to TRADE FREELY within the EU. There will be a HARD BORDER between the YELLOW and BLUE areas, who voted to LEAVE. The RED LINES represent a SERIES OF ELABORATE ZIPWIRES to transport PEOPLE and GOODS.

So what happens if you live in the blue area?
KudosDave

 

[flecc]

My word! Now a Labour MP in full agreement !

Kate Hoey‏Verified account@KateHoeyMP 56m56 minutes ago

Kate Hoey is a well known rebel who often steps outside of party lines and regularly comments on N.I. issues rather than doing her job of being the MP for her Vauxhall constituency.

She's a featherweight who has no influence where it matters.
.

 

[Kudoscycles]

It WILL be a `sensible` border on the DUP`s terms.... end of

View attachment 22359

Is Theresa May deaf or just hoping that Foster would change her mind...Foster told May that she would not accept NI to be any different to the rest of the U.K....May goes to Brussels and intends regulatory divergence for NI then seems surprised that Foster shoots her down.
It was obvious that even if Foster could be persuaded Scotland would have wanted the same,the nearest thing to Remain.
Perhaps May will agree for the UK to also be subject to regulatory divergence.
May is doing badly....the £40 billion could still be voted down by the Tory bastards,the Irish problem voted down by the DUP and the rebels left in the Tory party could also vote her down.
KudosDave

 

[Kudoscycles]

Perhaps May should have asked the EU for a free trade deal,that is the only solution....it would put the ball back in the EU court.
I shouldn't but I find the mess the UK government is in very amusing,Brexit was always a bad idea and is increasingly looking like a very bad idea....it's not only a detail problem,the whole concept is wrong,the U.K. is part of Europe and should stay in the EU.
It appears that the EU thought that May was signing up to the whole of the U.K. being part of the single market,don't our team in Brussels brief May?
KudosDave

 

[Woosh]

the U.K. is part of Europe and should stay in the EU.

No.
The UK has always seen the EU as a trading zone whereas the EU27 see the themselves as a political project, so brexit is understood by virtually everyone, inside and outside the UK.
It will cost jobs to get out of the single market but it's stupid to leave the customs union as well because it forces us to negotiate immediately new FTAs elsewhere.
The trouble is TM has the majority of MPs supporting soft brexit but not her conservative membership and the DUP which she needs for C&S. She will have to beat the last two into submission or they'll get rid of her.

 

[oldgroaner]

My word! Now a Labour MP in full agreement !

Kate Hoey‏Verified account@KateHoeyMP 56m56 minutes ago



Kate Hoey Retweeted Arlene Foster

Absolutely right

Kate Hoey added,

Arlene FosterVerified account@DUPleader
We will not accept any form of regulatory divergence which separates Northern Ireland economically or politically from the rest of the United Kingdom.

You'll be keen to hand back the Billion pound bribe then?
After all promises were made, and look what good a promise from the DUP is!

 

[oldgroaner]

Is Theresa May deaf or just hoping that Foster would change her mind...Foster told May that she would not accept NI to be any different to the rest of the U.K....May goes to Brussels and intends regulatory divergence for NI then seems surprised that Foster shoots her down.
It was obvious that even if Foster could be persuaded Scotland would have wanted the same,the nearest thing to Remain.
Perhaps May will agree for the UK to also be subject to regulatory divergence.
May is doing badly....the £40 billion could still be voted down by the Tory bastards,the Irish problem voted down by the DUP and the rebels left in the Tory party could also vote her down.
KudosDave

If she has any sense she will resign and let one of the other idiots have the ball to drop.

 

[Kudoscycles]

Theresa May might as well abandon Brexit now,it's going to be very difficult to get over Stage 1 unless she accepts that the whole of the U.K. will stay in the single market and the customs union,the Tory bastards especially Fox will not want that.
She will need to fight a battle within the Tory party to overcome Stage 1 and move onto trade talks,also unless she has already agreed to stay in the customs union there is no way the EU is going to give the UK a free trade deal....the EU will want the certainty that the UK cannot puncture the EU trade wall and the only way they can be certain is if we stay in the customs union and are controlled by the EU. The Tory bastards will also rebel against that and threaten the £40 billion divorce bill so we go back to Stage 1 again.
So May might as well either abandon Brexit now or make her mind that we are going to crash out,there is no possible median.
KudosDave

 

[Kudoscycles]

If she has any sense she will resign and let one of the other idiots have the ball to drop.

Possible,but I think she will fight a battle with the Tory right wingers,they will try to get rid of her and war will break out in the Tory party....she likes the job just doesn't like her fellow MP's.

 

[Woosh]

If she has any sense she will resign and let one of the other idiots have the ball to drop.

that's giving in to the bullies in her party.

 

[flecc]

The trouble is TM has the majority of MPs supporting soft brexit but not her conservative membership and the DUP which she needs for C&S. She will have to beat the last two into submission or they'll get rid of her.

She won't have to try to hard, they'll give in.

The right in her party knows that bringing her down will risk Labour seizing power in a premature election. The DUP know that if she falls, they can lose their moment of glory and the bulk of the promised billion.

All May has to do is agree the EU cash and the flexible Irish border deal and let them both impotently fume like the windbags they are.
.

 

[Kudoscycles]

She won't have to try to hard, they'll give in.

The right in her party knows that bringing her down will risk Labour seizing power in a premature election. The DUP know that if she falls, they can lose their moment of glory and the bulk of the promised billion.

All May has to do is agree the EU cash and the flexible Irish border deal and let them both impotently fume like the windbags they are.
.

Not sure that she can pick up the EU deal without the support of both the DUP and the 35 bastards,either of them could vote her down.
She has given in to the EU at every stage,no reason why she should not give in to the EU over the Irish border,that effectively means staying in the customs union. Perhaps she could agree to the UK staying in the customs union until the trade deal between the UK and EU supersedes,that may satisfy the 35.
That moves the problem onto the vote that parliament has already been given,the danger is that parliament could decide that the overal deal is very bad and prefers crashing out.
Danidl....do you know what would be the economic effect of crashing out between the north and south of Ireland?
KudosDave

 

[tommie]

The DUP know that if she falls, they can lose their moment of glory and the bulk of the promised billion.
All May has to do is agree the EU cash and the flexible Irish border deal and let them both impotently fume like the windbags they are.
.

Hey flecc, you`re coming across as a tad miffed tonight, now why would that be!?

The best thing to happen now is to get a couple of DUP MP`s on the negotiating team - these present spineless numpties are clueless when it comes to dealing with the EU.
Give them a take it or leave it ultimatum.

 

[Zlatan]

Hey flecc, you`re coming across as a tad miffed tonight, now why would that be!?

The best thing to happen now is to get a couple of DUP MP`s on the negotiating team - these present spineless numpties are clueless when it comes to dealing with the EU.
Give them a take it or leave it ultimatum.

Like a horse head...in bed ...sort of ultimatum...

 

[SHAN]

So what happens if you live in the blue area?
KudosDave

You'll turn green with envy.

 

[Danidl]

Not sure that she can pick up the EU deal without the support of both the DUP and the 35 bastards,either of them could vote her down.
She has given in to the EU at every stage,no reason why she should not give in to the EU over the Irish border,that effectively means staying in the customs union. Perhaps she could agree to the UK staying in the customs union until the trade deal between the UK and EU supersedes,that may satisfy the 35.
That moves the problem onto the vote that parliament has already been given,the danger is that parliament could decide that the overal deal is very bad and prefers crashing out.
Danidl....do you know what would be the economic effect of crashing out between the north and south of Ireland?
KudosDave

No. And the true fact is nobody else does either. My belief is that it would hurt us badly in the south. Our energy market and our agricultural supply chain is strongly integrated on an all ireland basis. Our domestic retail sector works seamlessly with UK based distributors .e.g . Tesco, Maplins, Halfords, B&Q , Guinness Boots, tkmax as well as many industrial distributors .. british oxygen , machine tool distributors etc.. .... So there would be massive disruption. Areas which would not be affected in my opinion include the FDI companies in pharma, IT , microprocessors, airline leasing and these are pretty big operations.
I suspect that our exposure would be less than that of NI. More of their product comes south for processing. They are the smaller economy and pro rata have a larger border.
In a crash out scenario there would be a hard border and they would be disturbing to me personally... I live not far from it.
What is giving me a little hope at this stage is that the penny is finally dropping in Whitehall.