We do have a lot of wind and water too, with hydro, in the sense of ocean bed tethered generators, showing a lot of promise.
The "death" of the car, (as we know it)
- Thread starter SHAN
- Start date
Historic suburbs maybe, but things change. I live on a 1960s/70s built estate with some 3000 homes, mainly houses, and about 6000 population. Every one of us has a garage or in a few cases a car port, but none of us have an attached garage or parking space next to our homes and none of the garage blocks have electricity laid on. This is far from unique, I could show you a number of other estates in the south-east similarly unsuited to evs.
Ergo, none of us has an e-car, despite many of us able to afford and use one. As I discovered when I asked for quotes, laying on electricity to a garage can cost thousands, £6000 in my case.
The RAC have said that 25% of UK homes cannot have charging next to their home, but that is a large underestimate. They've made some false assumptions like assuming that houses with garages on estates like mine have them next to the houses when none of them do. It wouldn't surprise me if a third of UK homes can't have a next to home parking point.
The irony is that it's in large towns and cities where 85% of the UK population live and e-cars are best suited that homes are least likely to have adjacent charging, homes so often being terraced or flats. That facility is most likely for the 15% of the population in countryside homes where e-cars are often least suited due to distances.
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I am all on my own so I looked at the Twizzy:
Cost to buy new: €7,340.00
Cost per year over 5 years and 10,000 km/year = 54€/m battery rental €2,116.00
Cost per km: €0.21 about the same as a Dacia
Cost per month: €176.33
Range 160 km (45 km/h version)
Vélomobile (home made on trike chassis):
Kit: $1500 + shipping http://fvsilverbullet.com/trike_products.htm
Range 330 km at 45 km/h average speed with a 52 Ah battery...
Cost to buy new: €7,340.00
Cost per year over 5 years and 10,000 km/year = 54€/m battery rental €2,116.00
Cost per km: €0.21 about the same as a Dacia
Cost per month: €176.33
Range 160 km (45 km/h version)
Vélomobile (home made on trike chassis):
Kit: $1500 + shipping http://fvsilverbullet.com/trike_products.htm
Range 330 km at 45 km/h average speed with a 52 Ah battery...
Also on my own so also looked at the Twizy, but quickly ruled out for English winters and street parking. I wish Renault would make a larger battery version, enclosed and secure with heater demister facilities. That would greatly expand it's market.
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No it isn't. You just need a place to charge nearby where you do shopping/lunching/drinking or some such. Fifty-six percent of car journeys in Britain are of less than five miles.
Wishful thinking, that isn't going to happen for nearly all of us in a foreseeable future. Even here in London the local supermarkets only have 13 amp charge points that take from 12 to 15 hours to charge, so they never get used. A tiny minority of often quite distant locations have 4 to 5 hour charge points, but they are equally impractical since it's far longer than most of our social functions take. Try looking at the charging point maps in the UK after ten years of promises about them and you'll have a better understanding of the situation.
Leaving the other 44% longer and sometimes very much longer. Having two cars to cope is hardly environmentally a good solution.
For those who can have a home charge facility a plug-in hybrid is probably the best solution, 20 to 25 miles electric range for all the short journeys and i.c. for the longer ones. But again a home charge point is vital, travelling to charge isn't practical when the e-range is so short.
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I suspect an awful lot of people are doing what I'm doing and sticking with petrol/diesel cars and just trying to use them less - hence the electric bike 
This has the added benefit of saving me money as well as reducing emissions. Whichever way you cut it trying to go further by getting an electric vehicle is going to cost me significant amounts of money and inconvenience at the moment.
My petrol car is sitting on the drive at the moment, it's not really been used for a fortnight, it will be needed on Sunday when I have to get from Cambridge to Reigate by 10:30am. A Tesla could do that fine but not any of the economy options.
This has the added benefit of saving me money as well as reducing emissions. Whichever way you cut it trying to go further by getting an electric vehicle is going to cost me significant amounts of money and inconvenience at the moment.
My petrol car is sitting on the drive at the moment, it's not really been used for a fortnight, it will be needed on Sunday when I have to get from Cambridge to Reigate by 10:30am. A Tesla could do that fine but not any of the economy options.
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My best period for that was when I first retired. Over a 7 year period I drove some 400 miles a year, often not using the car for three months at a time. My unpowered cycling was up to 5000 miles a year. Cars back then (1990s) would still start after three months standing still, today's electronics packed ones won't, batteries can be flat after three weeks stationary on some models.I suspect an awful lot of people are doing what I'm doing and sticking with petrol/diesel cars and just trying to use them less - hence the electric bike
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Latest exaggeration about e-car market prospects. Parkers have just published a newsletter forecasting this:
"Consider this the calm before the storm, and by 2020, we’ll probably not be able to move for electric cars, let alone plug-in hybrids".
Not able to move for pure electric cars within just over two years? That would need a miracle.
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"Consider this the calm before the storm, and by 2020, we’ll probably not be able to move for electric cars, let alone plug-in hybrids".
Not able to move for pure electric cars within just over two years? That would need a miracle.
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I know about them... The world leaders in that field Openhydro are local to us. My college and engineering departments I was in educated a number of their middle technucal management .
The logic for owning a car in a large city.. like London escapes me, particularly as the public transport network is very extensive. The arguement for car rental, for those special trips to the supermarkets or the hospital is more sound., Although home delivery also makes sense. There care those car hire clubs, where the car is owned by the club, sits on the road or a depot and the owners share it out..
The price for installation of electrical supply seems very high. Was this for three phase perchance. It is one of those cases where it might make sense to get a group deal, especially if the garages were clustered.
I cannot imagine the same situation here in Ireland where electricity is not available to garages. Mind you the majority would be in the curtilage of the dwelling.
That's easily solved Flecc. Disconnect battery when you leave it, or put a solar charger on dash. Left car for months. ( with both options) and car started fine...or invest in a,£60 Suoka booster...( mine has started from Small 2,stroke jetski,s, to 7 litre V8 petrol engines..) Its really easy to use...and stores in glove box..( about size of 4 mobile phones ?) And it can charge phones, cameras, laptops, etc etc and its an led torch ( even flashes red if you want)
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We have a house with garage about 50 yards from house ( gated community,a pain actually) and we were quoted £6k for a single phase installation..( and its only 5 yards from road)
Not that easy. The most guilty car in this discharge respect was a Nissan first generation Nissan Qashqai and most drain due to it's sensory alarm system. No battery, no alarm, not realistic of course! As it was in a remote garage a solar panel solution not very practical and also entails faffing about connnecting/disconnecting.
I just used a jump starter when necessary, but now have a car that doesn't waste so much battery charge on standby. And use the car more frequently anyway, at over eighty I refuse to feel guilty about that.
Saving the environment is a young person's job, it's their future, not mine!
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Not three phase, just a normal 22kW domestic installation to the garage. In England the network suppliers have monopolies, in my area it's UK Power Networks. They are the only ones permitted to lay on the basic supply to the garage and external meter box. Their cost depends on distance, at X charge per metre depending on what has to be dug up and made good, plus a very large standing charge. Even if there's the supply already next to the garage wall, their bill is well north of £2000. Connection can only come directly from a main supply line, not a spur already supplying others, so that increases distances and costs. Regulatory requirements introduce further costly complications.
Then there's the cost of an approved electrician carrying out the internal distribution, consumer unit, outlets, light etc and connecting to the exterior box. That's still only 13 amp sockets of course, so add on the cost of a faster charging unit for the make of car installed by a specialist supplier. Finally the cost of a meter installation by the supply company.
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When in that case I,d fit a second battery and a split charger. ( similar to leisure battery system) Your car alarm would flatten primary battery but not second. On arriving at car with a flat battery you would merely turn second battery to fully on.( I had such system on a Vito a few years ago) Start car on second battery,return switch to normal, car would then charge primary battery and then secondary. Cheaper than swapping car for a very minor fault ( secondary battery would only need to be 30ah or so...)
Effectively it would be like having a booster battery built into system. Its an easy fix flecc. Hundreds of folk leaving cars for extended periods have same problem. A Z3 I had used to do it. With that I carried a 12 v mc battery in boot. Switched over to that to power alarm and central locking. When returning to car just swap lead back over .( just the one earth lead) Faffing about isn't really an issue if car has been left long enough to flatten battery. I think you wanted a new car.
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I had that dual battery system on my boat but couldn't be bothered on a car. I didn't swap the car for that reason, it just went after three years in the usual way, during which time I just used it more frequently but had the jump starter for the odd occasion.
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This is what happens when you use a terminological inexactitude. Like including the word 'just' as in 'You just need...'. Home charging is not a sine qua non of running an electric car. Having a place to charge in your vicinity is.
Not sure how that works. We looked into having electric as second car..afraid it just does not work for us yet. A good friend has Tesla S...he can and does get 250 miles ( on a 100% overnight charge) He can do a 80% charge in 25 mins at certain stations ( Ikea for some odd reason) But his car does not make financial sense at all..fair enough if its your hobby ( he,s a serious petrol head !) .
For 90% of us a small 2nd hand ICE car is loads easier and cheaper than electric. Cant see it changing soon.
Fiesta eco boost...Range 450 miles. 60 mpg...cheap tax/ insurance. Nice to drive. Dont have to worry about charging...Buy a good one for £4k. Keep it 3 years, sell on for £1500 (???) Cost per year about £1200 ??( everything)
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