Prices of the electricity we use to charge

Woosh

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Bbc2 last night screened a program called the secret genius of modern life, featuring essentially the role of electric vehicles. One of them is solar powered. Their promoters claimed that the solar cells on this car can collect enough for 11,000 miles a year.
I can see people may be interested in this.
 
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flecc

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Bbc2 last night screened a program called the secret genius of modern life, featuring essentially the role of electric vehicles. One of them is solar powered. Their promoters claimed that the solar cells on this car can collect enough for 11,000 miles a year.
I can see people may be interested in this.
I saw that program earlier in the week. I think those solar car promoters were being very over ambitious though.

Australia with their sunshine have for many years been running the solar car challenge. 1,878 miles through the Australian Outback, from Darwin, Northern Territory, to Adelaide, South Australia. At first it only suited single seat microcars with huge panel areas, but they now have a multi-seat cruiser class within the race.

The 2017 Cruiser class winner, the five-seat Stella Vie vehicle, was able to carry an average of 3.4 occupants at an average speed of 69 km/h (43 mph). Like its two predecessors, the vehicle was successfully road registered by the Dutch team, further emphasizing the great progress in real-world compliance and practicality that has been achieved.

BUT, of course that is in Australia's incredible non stop outback sunshine and warmth, so ok in the Sahara too. Here in Britain we can't even fully power a bicycle from a trailer carrying a large panel area when the sun is shining, so a practical solar powered family hatchback is a very long way off, probably never.

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matthewslack

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I managed an average useful generation this summer of 1,000Wh per day from my 330Wp solar trailer. It was capable of much more on blue sky days, but a 250W 25km/hour legal torque sensored pedelec, even pulling a trailer in hilly terrain is not capable of consuming all it can produce!

Most ebike journeys are rather less than my 75 mile daily average, so could be powered by a much smaller panel.

For example, my daily commute is 2.5 miles each way, ridden on high assist and needs about 100Wh for the return trip. If the bike lives all day outside charging in the summer half of the year that only needs a 33W solar panel to keep it going, and even my smallest 400Wh battery is plenty to smooth over the duller days.

That solar car program was interesting, but for most people putting the solar on their house roof and charging from the mains will make more economic sense. Their business model so far is 'build exclusive and expensive to fund a future cheaper mass market version'.

For those lucky enough to have space for a garage, south facing and unshaded, just the garage roof covered in solar can produce enough energy to drive a small electric car several thousand miles a year. Just not directly.

(Single garage, 3m x 6m, pitched roof, one side facing south. About 11m2 roof plane, so about 1.5kWp solar system. At least 800kWh/kWp/year in most parts of UK, so 1,200kWh generated per year. Small electric car consumes 100 to 200Wh per mile. Using 150 as reasonable midrange value, 1,200,000 / 150 = 8,000 miles per year. Double garage? Double the numbers. Flat roof? Halve the numbers.)
 
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flecc

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Small electric car consumes 100 to 200Wh per mile. Using 150 as reasonable midrange value, 1,200,000 / 150 = 8,000 miles per year.
That is very optimistic. If I try very hard I can just about coax 4 miles from each kWh in warm weather from my current Nissan Leaf, but that takes quite a lot of effort on my part. 3 miles is more like it with gentle driving, so 250 to 330 Wh per mile with very gentle or gentle driving, normal driving with the rest of the traffic often takes 400Wh per mile.

Running an ev on garage roof solar is very much a summer possibility in this country. During our grey overcast winters there's no chance and even the mid Autumn to mid Spring six months would often be very difficult.
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matthewslack

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There have been various projects over at least 15 years now to connect African sun to Europe. Here's a current UK one.


It needs the CFD in place for the finance to work. Technically it is a bit stupid to run a cable selfishly all that way, bypassing continental Europe. Far better to develop a cooperative relationship with our neighbours...

But a vast resource only requiring money and geopolitical stability to unlock.
 

soundwave

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guerney

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Bbc2 last night screened a program called the secret genius of modern life, featuring essentially the role of electric vehicles. One of them is solar powered. Their promoters claimed that the solar cells on this car can collect enough for 11,000 miles a year.
I can see people may be interested in this.
Lightyear's new car intended for cheap mass market production is expected in 2025. 40-ish mile solar powered range per day would be useful for many people. I can't see the same being possible for ebikes unless solar panel efficiency improves beyond the point of magical, or suitably orientated surface area is hugely increased, like @matthewslack 's solar trailer (or some combination of both).


Bbc2 last night screened a program called the secret genius of modern life
Since the cancellation of "Tomorrow's World" the Beeb has needed more programmes like that - "BBC Click" isn't enough, hampered by scheduling and pieces too bite-sized and lacking in sufficient detail... but it's nice there's a longer Click available for determined geeks. There's not enough accessible science on the Beeb.
 
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guerney

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(Single garage, 3m x 6m, pitched roof, one side facing south. About 11m2 roof plane, so about 1.5kWp solar system. At least 800kWh/kWp/year in most parts of UK, so 1,200kWh generated per year. Small electric car consumes 100 to 200Wh per mile. Using 150 as reasonable midrange value, 1,200,000 / 150 = 8,000 miles per year. Double garage? Double the numbers. Flat roof? Halve the numbers.)
That's only 21.9 miles per day - I don't think any of Lightyear's cars would get far in the UK, unless their panels are unbelievably efficient.
 
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guerney

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There have been various projects over at least 15 years now to connect African sun to Europe. Here's a current UK one.


It needs the CFD in place for the finance to work. Technically it is a bit stupid to run a cable selfishly all that way, bypassing continental Europe. Far better to develop a cooperative relationship with our neighbours...

But a vast resource only requiring money and geopolitical stability to unlock.
Depending on the location of the panels- a giant collection of space based solar generators could shield the earth from the sun and control the earth's temperature, while beaming energy back using microwaves for conversion to power grids, but without this being a global project, it could be seen as a weapon to rapidly explode skulls in selected areas of countries. There may be increases in nocturnal animals, but I'd prefer space based solar panels reducing sunlight to lower temperature, instead of adding massive quantities of sulphur to the atmosphere as some mad scientists have been suggesting.
 

guerney

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Calls for UK ban on pre-payment meter installations made under court warrants

End Fuel Poverty Coalition fears energy suppliers are using warrants to disconnect poorest ‘by the back door’




 

guerney

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44.01 secures $5M to turn billions of tons of carbon dioxide to stone



It's quite shellfish of them, keeping all that carbon to themselves:

Could Oyster Shells Sequester Carbon?

 
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guerney

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My neigbour is a bulb customer, was grumbling about this. He also shouted (because he's a bit deaf) "I'm putting £20 a week into the gas payment meter! And I only have central heating on for a couple of hours a day!"

Battle deepens over sale of energy supplier Bulb to Octopus
Emails showing Centrica was told that UK state support for bid was on offer cloud dispute over fairness of process


Octopus Energy takeover of collapsed UK rival Bulb faces legal challenge

 

guerney

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There have been various projects over at least 15 years now to connect African sun to Europe. Here's a current UK one.


It needs the CFD in place for the finance to work. Technically it is a bit stupid to run a cable selfishly all that way, bypassing continental Europe. Far better to develop a cooperative relationship with our neighbours...

But a vast resource only requiring money and geopolitical stability to unlock.
 

PC2017

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£20 a week into the gas payment
I can believe that, it could be boiler temp or if its aging it could efficiency... I have been recording my daily usage with heating 50% day its £4.50 with heating 75% a day its £5.00 my boiler is new. it's killing me tbf - One think to ask or work into a chinwag, is he getting and using his EBSS £66 voucher, there are reports many aren't

Who is paying for these court hearings? - I will read the articles later...
 

guerney

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is he getting and using his EBSS £66 voucher, there are reports many aren't
He was getting very cold I think, so it was a brief chat, while I was in agony with more than the weight of my bike in my rucksack (pumpkins) - I only had time to tell him about my electric blanket money saving tip which he was skeptical of "That's just soft!" he shouted, but seemed interested when I pointed out how little it costs for per month. I was going to drop by with a emergency space blanket, I'll ask about the voucher then.
 
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guerney

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How much of that is standing charge.
There's also rather a lot of debt being paid via his meter. It's really sad that he's struggling so soon after retiring.
 

flecc

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Octopus Energy takeover of collapsed UK rival Bulb faces legal challenge

This is deliberately misleading, never trust the news media.

The judge last week did not refuse to hear the pending case. He refused to consider it in reaching his judgemnt that the takeover must go ahead immediately without further delay.

The matter is effctively closed now, Octopus are taking over Bulb and quite right too. The legal challenge is just sour grapes, chiefy due to British Gas who wanted Bulb to try to be a dominating monopoly in the energy market.

The companies leading the challenge simply either didn't bid enough or weren't capable of taking over such a big company as Bulb UK, all known and above board. Whoever took it over would have to have had that already spent government subsidy transferred in free.

None of them could have taken on £6.5 billion as a debt to be paid to government, they are just jealous that Octopus Energy are the recipient. The media reporters really should learn a subject before trying to report on it.

As for that old man, I'm old too, I'm with Bulb and they are excellent. Their current prices are almost the same as others, identical to Shell Energy for example.
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PC2017

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. The media reporters really should learn a subject before trying to report on it.
All too common now-a-days, I try, although it is hard at times, to get the same news story from various parties before making up my own mind about the subject, its all to vague, one size fits all left or right narratives woven in a string of opinion segments more than just facts and two sides.

That Times article on strikes, a lot on how the Tory's should push through reforms and only a few words on the Gov hindering talks. It's like the "wage price spiral" inflation is here, it's entrenched & I fear it'll be a long time or extremely painful before it comes downs, that's not factoring that the already price increases will not go away; Folks need pay rises, but supermarkets jack prices on own brand foods some items by 132%, there's no intervention on that but ask for a pay rise - god forbid.

lot of debt being paid via his meter
Oh dear, that's not good - £20 per week will barely cover hot water, add debts to that mix, my heart bleeds, good idea checking in with neighbours. -6 degs(bike LCD) in the wind, just nipping to post office 5 mins away.
 
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