Experiences with Open Source Firmware on the Tongsheng TSDZ2

[pedalfettal]

Topic creep - I thought this thread was about Open Source Firmware?

Yup. But can be nice to rest the eyes on a different nugget of information (sparingly).

I use folding pedals on my folding bicycles - very good for wheeling through office corridors - also good for not scratching car doors.

I use Time ATAC clipless on my other bicycles - the commuter uses Time LINK which has a flat side for normal footwear.

 

[Andrewlee1]

I’m now about three months into OSF and it’s been a very positive experience. Smoother, more powerful and a better range of boost levels with little impact on effective range.

I have a question regarding the settings in the configurator for the Battery Charge Display. When I used the default values the battery seemed to empty too quickly - I've never managed to run it until it stops so I/m not certain of its actual state of charge when its being used. I've played with the values slightly and it feels to be a bit more representative now.
On start up the display reads 63.5 which I assume is the battery voltage when fully charged. Is this correct?
When riding the bike the first Bar in the display is used at about 10 miles. This is OK for range and if I re-start the system the display now reads 62.5.
Its a 48v system with a VLCD5 display.
Checking the configurator I have the following:
Cell Voltage full - 3.9
Cell Voltage 5/6 - 3.75
Cell Voltage 4/6 - 3.60
Cell Voltage 3/6 - 3.50
Cell Voltage 2/6 - 3.40
Cell Voltage 1/6 - 3.20
Cell Voltage Empty 3.0
The default values were higher - I did a rough calculation to get these values. Assuming that a fully charges cell is 3.9v and an empty one will be 3v.

The manual simply states:
'Voltage value to display intermediate charge states.
From 1 to 5 bars, for VLCD5 displays.'

Do these values seem reasonable to other users? With the default values on the same boost I would loose a bar after about 5KM now its more like 18km which is more in line with the standard firmware we have on another identical bike.
Is there any risk to the motor/battery with these settings?

Many thanks

 

[Nealh]

48v battery is 54.6v .
The 63.5 sounds like motor temp have you enabled this on start up in Tab 3 Adv settings ?
3.9v is too low for a charged cell and 3v is too low for a drained cell, typicaly should be 4.15 - 4.2v and 3.2 - 3.3v respectively.

Try setting these;
over volt 4.3
reset soc% 4.15
cell full 4.15
5/6 3.95
4/6 3.8
3/6 3.65
2/6 3.5
1/6 3.35
empty 3.25

and then play around with the values.

 

[Nealh]

Make sure in Tab 1, the motor voltage is set correctly under motor settings.
Under batt settings makes sure battery wh is set correct for the battery and the cell number should be 13 for 48v.

 

[Andrewlee1]

Many thanks Nealh
"in Tab 1, the motor voltage is set correctly under motor settings.
Under batt settings makes sure battery w/h is set correct for the battery and the cell number should be 13 for 48v." It is.
"The 63.5 sounds like motor temp have you enabled this on start up in Tab 3 Adv settings ?" I've screenshot tab3 with your suggested settings - Will save and flash later on.

When I power on I should see state of charge % Remaining (63.5 is displayed)

I also don't seem to be able to access walk assist. I have walk Assist checked in tab1, I have a debounce time set and it is checked to be available in street mode (which is off on startup) on tab 2.

Scratches head . . .

 

[Nealh]

The reset SOC % is to high, it should be 4.2v or less, also insert the full voltage values so 4.3 is 4.30 , 3.8 is 3.80 etc,etc.

 

[kiwisibk]

Hi, I will be flashing the custom emmebrusa software soon as I received my speed sensor extension cable today as well as the ST Link USB stick.

Just one (stupid) question: once I have checked the connection with STVP by reading each tab and saving the stock file as backup, can I flash the emmebrusa firmware directly using the TSDZ2 Parameter Configurator java software already for the first time?

Thanks for your help!!

 

[Bikes4two]

............ can I flash the emmebrusa firmware directly using the TSDZ2 Parameter Configurator java software already for the first time?

Thanks for your help!!

Yes.

 

[kiwisibk]

Yes.

Okay, great, thanks!

So just to confirm the correct procedure:

First I read all three tabs with STVM to verify the correct connection, then I save them all as a backup. Then I close STVM and open the TSDZ2 Parameter Configurator Java Script, set the correct parameters for my configuration, then click "Compile & Flash"?

Thanks again for any confirmation or correction!!

 

[Bikes4two]

Okay, great, thanks!

So just to confirm the correct procedure:

First I read all three tabs with STVM to verify the correct connection, then I save them all as a backup. Then I close STVM and open the TSDZ2 Parameter Configurator Java Script, set the correct parameters for my configuration, then click "Compile & Flash"?

Thanks again for any confirmation or correction!!

Your description of what to do looks correct to me.

 

[doctoral]

Have any tsdz owners carried out the heat sink mods internally as well as the osf tweaks ?

Chiming in late on this one I realise, but hope it helps.

Have experience with several TSDZ2 motors (and most Bafang mid drives), from stock to heavily modified, temp sensor, heatsinks, displays, metal gears etc.

If these motors are run at over 500w for extended periods they will internally get hot rather fast. Too hot and they will die. (So will the BBSxx motors if run at elevated power levels for extended periods)

The temperature controlled amperage reduction * is a must if you're going to push the limits at all. Secondary to this thermal plates, paste, pads * etc are a must if you want to have a reliable motor putting out 500w plus for rides that involve load over time. Load x time = heat = dead motor.

*(documented elsewhere)

Greetings from Eire,

Hope this helps,

Allen

 

[Bikes4two]

Have experience with several TSDZ2 motors ........

If these motors are run at over 500w for extended periods they will internally get hot rather fast. Too hot and they will die. (So will the BBSxx motors if run at elevated power levels for extended periods).

Thanks for posting your experiences regarding the potential overheat problems.

'Potential' is the right word in that some folks get in a bit of a state worrying about this, especially after reading posts on the Endless Sphere forum. There's then a rush to fit heat pads, temperature sensors and so on, all actions in themselves which could bring problems from careless motor disassembly/assembly.

From my own experiences with my 250w 36v TSDZ2 during the recent UK heatwave (2022), and riding mostly on ECO, the motor never even got near to hand hot.

So for 250w motor users I feel confident to say that (IMHO of course), there is no overheat problem for you what ever mode you ride in.

 

[Nealh]

If one keeps the current in the setting at 12a or less then heat may not be an issue, it may depend though on the terrain. Most of the ES issues one suspects is they push the current to high and want 700w or more continuously from the drive.
The heat mods may not be totally needed though I would look at the bearing additions which is a 5 -10 second job before fitting the cranks.

Also with the three parameter tabs one can set up the ini. files without having to have the bike connected, configure and play around with them on the PC/Laptop in comfort and one can make up various files for future uploading to the bike.

 

[doctoral]

Thanks for posting your experiences regarding the potential overheat problems.

'Potential' is the right word in that some folks get in a bit of a state worrying about this, especially after reading posts on the Endless Sphere forum. There's then a rush to fit heat pads, temperature sensors and so on, all actions in themselves which could bring problems from careless motor disassembly/assembly.

From my own experiences with my 250w 36v TSDZ2 during the recent UK heatwave (2022), and riding mostly on ECO, the motor never even got near to hand hot.

So for 250w motor users I feel confident to say that (IMHO of course), there is no overheat problem for you what ever mode you ride in.

I think this is fair comment. These motors will go on for a very long time at 250W. My reply was to a direct question about the open source firmware and heat dissipation, reasonably assuming that the user in question is interested in exploring the limits of the motor.

 

[kiwisibk]

Your description of what to do looks correct to me.

Sorry if I insist, but in this tutorial

Eco Cycles – Opening Soon

cycles.eco

describes how to flash custom .hex files using STVP for open source software. Is this only needed for non-emmebrusa versions? Thanks

 

[Nealh]

Sorry if I insist, but in this tutorial

Eco Cycles – Opening Soon

cycles.eco

describes how to flash custom .hex files using STVP for open source software. Is this only needed for non-emmebrusa versions? Thanks

Yes, that was for Casainho's earlier OSF work which in the main is all now merged with emmebrusa's work, which has moved it all on a pile .

 

[kiwisibk]

Yes, that was for Casainho's earlier OSF work which in the main is all now merged with emmebrusa's work, which has moved it all on a pile .

Wow, amazing, thank you so much for easing my last doubts. Now I feel really confident to make it!!!

 

[kiwisibk]

Hello, could someone explain me in a simple way if it is possible and if so how to change the different assist modes (power, torque, cadence, emtb, hybrid...) on the VLCD5 display after flashing? I read the tutorial but it's still not clear for me.... thanks in advance!!!

 

[kiwisibk]

Wow, amazing, thank you so much for easing my last doubts. Now I feel really confident to make it!!!

Today I tried for the first time to read the memory in STVP. But I get this error:
Does anyone have a hint as to what it could be? I have checked all cable connections properly for correct connection and with the multimeter for conductivity.

 

[kiwisibk]

Today I tried for the first time to read the memory in STVP. But I get this error: View attachment 49333
Does anyone have a hint as to what it could be? I have checked all cable connections properly for correct connection and with the multimeter for conductivity.

Update: everything solved. Two cables were connected incorrectly. Programmed everything like a charm. Will see if the open source firmware is that much better than the standard firmware.