Brexit, for once some facts.

flecc

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Interesting - as I have previously said, I see lots of patient reports. I think the majority have said the second AstraZeneca vaccination has had less impact that the first. Whereas for Pfizer it seems the other way round.

It is, of course, wrong to apply population statistics, even if accurate and valid, to individuals.
I wonder if the lateness of the second has had an effect? Over 14 weeks is very far from the original 3 weeks recommendation.
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oyster

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I wonder if the lateness of the second has had an effect? Over 14 weeks is very far from the original 3 weeks recommendation.
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Have to say, I too was wondering.

Partner had a somewhat rough time with her first. And is due second next week - which works out exactly 11 weeks.

I certainly hope she doesn't get a worse impact than the first. But even her unpleasant experience wasn't the worst I have read about.
 
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Zlatan

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I had my first vaccine 12 feb. Second 27th April.. Between those dates unfortunately my entire immediate family, including yours truly, were found to be covid positive. (all within a few days of each other) That was around 5 weeks ago.(We are blaming grandson bringing it home from school but who knows)
I am having another heart op on 28th May and visited consultant yesterday for preassessment. ECG, blood tests etc. Told him I, d had covid 5 weeks ago. He was immediately interested and asked how I d coped. How had heartrate/blood pressure /O2 levels been? (I have to monitor them all time)Told him fine. Just like a mild cold, no fever but prolonged cough, fatigue, headache, etc for 10 to 14 days or so, and heart issue no worse than normal with O2 levels never dropping below 96%. His response.
"good job you'd had vaccine, would have been a different story without".
???
Yet, when I enquired January time I wasn't seen as a priority...
And, prior to op I have to isolate for 14 days.
Ahwell, don't feel like doing much anyway.

So, perhaps I, m in the group for whom vaccine has saved their lives. Hypothetical of course but I was glad I, d had vaccine when 2 lines appeared on the lateral flow test.
 
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Danidl

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I had my first vaccine 12 feb. Second 27th April.. Between those dates unfortunately my entire immediate family, including yours truly, were found to be covid positive. (all within a few days of each other) That was around 5 weeks ago.(We are blaming grandson bringing it home from school but who knows)
I am having another heart op on 28th May and visited consultant yesterday for preassessment. ECG, blood tests etc. Told him I, d had covid 5 weeks ago. He was immediately interested and asked how I d coped. How had heartrate/blood pressure /O2 levels been? (I have to monitor them all time)Told him fine. Just like a mild cold, no fever but prolonged cough, fatigue, headache, etc for 10 to 14 days or so, and heart issue no worse than normal with O2 levels never dropping below 96%. His response.
"good job you'd had vaccine, would have been a different story without".
???
Yet, when I enquired January time I wasn't seen as a priority...
And, prior to op I have to isolate for 14 days.
Ahwell, don't feel like doing much anyway.

So, perhaps I, m in the group for whom vaccine has saved their lives. Hypothetical of course but I was glad I, d had vaccine when 2 lines appeared on the lateral flow test.
Good luck with the heart op. I think your consultant has the right of it, and had you not been vaccinated, we would no longer be trading insults. I also was lucky. Had I got CV19 before my stents in September October , I would certainly have singing in Celestial Choir. Probably at 95% chance. . 3 occlusions each of 95% in a single artery . With the stents I reckon it was a 10% chance. But now with the first Pfizer , I think down to 0.1% ..with the second it will be 0.05% .. Those are odds I can live with.
 

Danidl

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I wonder if the lateness of the second has had an effect? Over 14 weeks is very far from the original 3 weeks recommendation.
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I suspect that it has. The AZ seems to give a greater reaction to those people whose immune systems have already been shocked .. As my sons has been over decades. He had an extremely violent reaction , but then has had massive infections over the last three decades. The longer delay is likely reducing the protection level and increasing the sensitivity.
 

Zlatan

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Good luck with the heart op. I think your consultant has the right of it, and had you not been vaccinated, we would no longer be trading insults. I also was lucky. Had I got CV19 before my stents in September October , I would certainly have singing in Celestial Choir. Probably at 95% chance. . 3 occlusions each of 95% in a single artery . With the stents I reckon it was a 10% chance. But now with the first Pfizer , I think down to 0.1% ..with the second it will be 0.05% .. Those are odds I can live with.
My sailing buddy has just had stents fitted post heart attack.. Only last week.. We, ll be convelessing together, trading insults and hopefully back on water around same time....
Good luck with yours too.
 

flecc

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Nice article..
Yes, great article. I will pick up on one omission though, the failure to mention electric and steam cars and the e-car's early success:

The gentleman's car of choice in the 1900s and 1910s was the electric car, very reliable and far more civilised than the petrol cars and steam cars of the era, even though it was mainly confined to town use due to the limitations of lead-acid batteries. However that mattered less than it might seem since the petrol cars would often break down before the electric one ran out of juice!
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flecc

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And an interesting one.
Yes, makes sense, 2030 isn't our cut off for ICE since hybrid sales are permitted to 2035.

Add to that the life of an ICE car is reckoned to be 22 years on average and they'll be with us until at least 2057.

I don't approve though, so I'll be tut-tutting in here then at 121 years old.
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Zlatan

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Or continue with this government, it kills more than any enemy has
Are you reading Guardian again? You should know better at your age.
And laying blame of Covid deaths at feet of politicians is just not going to stick. This is what Lancet has to say about Bolsonaro, never mind Boris.
 
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flecc

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And laying blame of Covid deaths at feet of politicians is just not going to stick. This is what Lancet has to say about Bolsonaro, never mind Boris.
Agreed. In fact I looked at these death rates a couple of days ago:

Ours: 0.19%

Brazils: 0.19%

Swedens: 0.13%

However, I definitely blame the Swedish government for that result, a third less deaths than us without spending £400 billions.
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Zlatan

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Agreed. In fact I looked at these death rates a couple of days ago:

Ours: 0.19%

Brazils: 0.19%

Swedens: 0.13%

However, I definitely blame the Swedish government for that result, a third less deaths than us without spending £400 billions.
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To be fair tho we should really compare Sweden with Norway and Denmark, both of whom have had even lower death rates than either ourselves or Sweden.
UK now stands 15th in world death rates, likely to be passed by Croatia, Spain and Poland in near future.
Does beg the question why has Hungary fared so badly. It has experienced almost 3000 deaths per million. Almost double our alarming figure. It's the worst death rate by some margin and has a population approaching 10 million so the argument about smaller societies faring worse with regards rates can't really apply? Is it demographics, social injustice, poor decisions, poor health care, or what? What has happened?
 
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flecc

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To be fair tho we should really compare Sweden with Norway and Denmark, both of whom have had even lower death rates than either ourselves or Sweden.
Not really, they had lockdown type restrictions so they aren't a comparison. My point with the UK comparison has always been that Sweden didn't bully their people with massive fines and threats, mess up their lives, wreck childrens education or spend their way into decades of future financial problems. All with a third lower death rate than us

Does beg the question why has Hungary fared so badly. It has experienced almost 3000 deaths per million. Almost double our alarming figure. It's the worst death rate by some margin and has a population approaching 10 million so the argument about smaller societies faring worse with regards rates can't really apply? Is it demographics, social injustice, poor decisions, poor health care, or what? What has happened?
It's entirely down to prime minister Viktor Orbán, another Bolsonaro type figure.

He used Covid from the outset for political advantage while deliberately messing up on Covid protection. Orbán is a dictator who only cares for himself, though he is good on Hungary's economy.

Historic Information Link
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oldgroaner

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Are you reading Guardian again? You should know better at your age.
And laying blame of Covid deaths at feet of politicians is just not going to stick. This is what Lancet has to say about Bolsonaro, never mind Boris.
Still lying for the Government?
 

oyster

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Have to say, I too was wondering.

Partner had a somewhat rough time with her first. And is due second next week - which works out exactly 11 weeks.

I certainly hope she doesn't get a worse impact than the first. But even her unpleasant experience wasn't the worst I have read about.
A little later, I got a call - my second one is also next Wednesday, same day as partner. Which was a bit of a surprise as my first was nine days later than hers.
 
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flecc

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A little later, I got a call - my second one is also next Wednesday, same day as partner. Which was a bit of a surprise as my first was nine days later than hers.
There's lots of variations it seems, I've come across anything from 9 weeks to 12 weeks, leaving out my 14+ weeks since mine was being left off the lists, both times, so both had to be prompted.
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Zlatan

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Still lying for the Government?
No fact check is.
The austerity deaths were a silly lie dreamed up by Corbyn. It shows his normal awareness as a political clown.
Had he had evidence proving the claim, then fine use it. He had none, in fact quite the reverse it can be shown (as link explains) claim is pure supposition. Then it's only effect is to make him look bitter and desperate. Both Corbyn and Starmer go down this road and never learn. Both should just say on subjects where Tories have performed poorly (wall paper, curtains, mixed messages?) "we wouldn't go down that road" and no more. Playing the insult game is deriguer for many and for politicians is counter productive.
 
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Zlatan

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And, back to Labour's descent to oblivion. This is an old article, reproducing an article from 2019.Yes,I know it's the Express and all that entails, but the message is essentially correct. The chief architect of Labour's current position is McCluskey. Not Starmer or Corbyn, both actually decent men. McCluskey's control over Party should be illegal. He, s ruined it.
 
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