Brexit, for once some facts.

oldgroaner

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Sir Charles Benedict Ainslie CBE (born 5 February 1977) is a British competitive sailor. Ainslie is the most successful sailor in Olympic history.

He chucks his wastes out of portholes.
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No doubt to increase marine bio diversity?

That could explain the strange behaviour Zlatan mentioned he thinks happens in Hull
This is what happens when you unquestioningly emulate an expert role model.

I'm glad mine was a relatively non controversial one by the name of Guy Fawkes, a man keen on the noble cause of raising parliamentary standards
:cool:
 
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oyster

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In case you hadn't heard, there is a trial:

Com-COV trial mixing first and second doses of Pfizer and AZ - both ways round.

Have heard from someone who is on it and does not know which way round they have received them.
 

Zlatan

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You really must learn to read, I've said nothing different.

Your sentence contains two different things, the chance of mutation and the overall risk of not controlling the virus.

I only posted about the risk of creating more mutations, and in that Chris Whitty and I are in total agreement. As he acknowledged and is widely known among experts in this field, his strategy of delay between the doses INCREASES that mutation risk, but he felt it an acceptable risk if it gave some protection against infection and severe illness for many more by delaying second half vaccinations.

He potentially swapped more mutations for less severe Covid, a gamble once again but with the odds in his favour. Hopefully he'll continue to be lucky, but heaven help us if he isn't and a lethal mutation is the outcome.
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OG how in God's name can you now agree with Flecc. You are disagreeing with each other over Witty. Flecc is saying he rarely disagrees with him, you say he says whatever govt want him to. Make your mind up FFS. (OG agreed with this post as I did, apart from bit about me learning to read)
 

Danidl

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In case you hadn't heard, there is a trial:

Com-COV trial mixing first and second doses of Pfizer and AZ - both ways round.

Have heard from someone who is on it and does not know which way round they have received them.
Well I understood was to stick them with the pointy bit
 

flecc

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Oct 25, 2006
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You are disagreeing with each other over Witty. Flecc is saying he rarely disagrees with him, you say he says whatever govt want him to. Make your mind up FFS.
I don't know what it is with your mind, but there is something wrong when your views are so child like and black and white. This is a world of lots of shades of greys with few simple black and white answers, so two differing views of things can be and often are compatible. For example, there are two options for a vaccination program, oldest first or youngest first and both are correct according to one's desired outcome. Therefore two of us can agree on this truth while disagreeing on which to choose.

As Woosh and I have pointed out, no professor gets these exalted positions without being very political animals who know exactly how to tailor what they say to please their political masters. We have literally many hundreds of professors on every subject under the sun trying to get to the top or even to get a job, so any who don't please don't get. That's the harsh truth and you shouldn't be so gullible as to think it's in any way idealistic. It never is.

As you know or should know, there's never only one right answer to difficult problems like Covid-19, so I can agree with Whitty or any other expert on the medical facts of choices while disagreeing with which one is chosen, believing it the political choice. It's because of the political choices made and often supported by the experts that we keep losing control of Covid.
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Jesus H Christ

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FTFY

I wonder what number of primary school class and teacher shootings you feel is acceptable to allow some people to engage in their hobby.
I‘ve never been interested in recreational shooting, so don’t know what type of character it attracts. However, I really don’t think banning responsible firearms certificate holders from owning a handgun has contributed anything to classroom safety. Anyone intent on murder / mass killings will get access to a gun by illegal means.
 
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Jesus H Christ

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As I do. Usually I agree with Whitty, but on the balance of risks of mutations against reducing the consequences of the illness I'm far from fully convinced, despite the odds being in his favour.

On his strategy there is a large reduction of suffering, but only for the few who do contract a severe case of Covid. So some deaths are avoided with it, often those who would die soon anyway. For all those who only get a mild case or don't catch it at all, his strategy makes no difference.

The downside is the greater risk of occurrence of variants and a small chance that one could be lethal enough to be horrific, causing many millions of deaths. That albeit tiny risk is a truly terrifying possibility.
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The virus is most likely to mutate into a more infectious but less lethal strain.
 
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Danidl

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I‘ve never been interested in recreational shooting, so don’t know what type of character it attracts. However, I really don’t think banning responsible firearms certificate holders from owning a handgun has contributed anything to classroom safety. Anyone intent on murder / mass killings will get access to a gun by illegal means.
Except it has. The chances of me making an atomic bomb are limited .. I know the theory, I have even done experiments on neutron activation , but the materials are rather hard to find. .. And that is no accident. The chances of me getting my hands on a shotgun are high. So yes I could get down an blow away 2 or maybe 4 kids before the single barrel gun is pulled away. Getting my hands on a handgun, would not be easy.. Not as difficult as getting nuclear materials ,but a lot harder than getting a licenced shotgun. You can rest easy... I am not interested in gunning you down.
Availability leads to normalisation ,leads to more shootings.
 

Danidl

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The virus is most likely to mutate into a more infectious but less lethal strain.
Generally yes. Survival of the fit , means that for viruses , the ability to keep the host live and producing copies is the best strategy. But the CV19,is already very good at that. Its trick of being infective while in stealth mode , is masterly. But what if a mutation decides to over drive the cell and produce a thousand times more particles even at the cost of 10% mortality, rather than the current 3%. And or actually become airborne? Rather than the current droplet borne.
 

oldgroaner

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Indeed, as I posted, only a very small chance of the reverse.

But the chance exists.
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After all the chance that one from how many billion sperm would fertilise an egg and result in Johnson wasn't more than a chance in many billions, across the Atlantic too, you can add the odds to he being brought here, and then even less probable there would be enough daft beggars among 50 millions would vote for him.
Yet here we are and vaccination against the Covid disaster he made worse being used as Cover the his Brexit disaster.

It's almost enough for an atheist like me to ponder whether isn't an evil god at work
extracting the urine out of humanity.

My experience in life includes high spots like being told that a prostate cancer biopsy only has adverse effects on one person in 20,000.
Then ending up at deaths door with sepsis and in hospital for 11 days before I escaped their clutches and staggered home.

From this I had an epiphany that in fact the laws of odds had somehow inverted and what was previously been regarded as nigh on impossible
Was now pretty much a dead cert .
"Laws of odds?" more like the Pirate code really
:D
 
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Jesus H Christ

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Except it has. The chances of me making an atomic bomb are limited .. I know the theory, I have even done experiments on neutron activation , but the materials are rather hard to find. .. And that is no accident. The chances of me getting my hands on a shotgun are high. So yes I could get down an blow away 2 or maybe 4 kids before the single barrel gun is pulled away. Getting my hands on a handgun, would not be easy.. Not as difficult as getting nuclear materials ,but a lot harder than getting a licenced shotgun. You can rest easy... I am not interested in gunning you down.
Availability leads to normalisation ,leads to more shootings.
If someone wants a hand gun to commit a murder, it’s not that difficult. There are many in circulation. Banning them had contributed nothing to classroom safety.
 
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Jesus H Christ

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Dec 31, 2020
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Generally yes. Survival of the fit , means that for viruses , the ability to keep the host live and producing copies is the best strategy. But the CV19,is already very good at that. Its trick of being infective while in stealth mode , is masterly. But what if a mutation decides to over drive the cell and produce a thousand times more particles even at the cost of 10% mortality, rather than the current 3%. And or actually become airborne? Rather than the current droplet borne.
You make it sound like the viruses hold strategy meetings to decide upon their next tactic. Would this be via Zoom or is it safe for viruses to meet face to face in a convention centre?

You are being a knob-head. Stop.
 

oldgroaner

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As proof of I'm not sure quite what we have this
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Attempting to take a holiday abroad will result in a £5,000 fine under new coronavirus laws.

The legislation covering COVID-19 restrictions includes a ban on leaving the UK without a reasonable excuse - with the hefty fine for those breaking the rule.


The new rules will also mean protests will be considered a permitted exception to the ban on mass gatherings.

Does anyone else wonder how the hell you can ban protests and say they are a permitted exception at one and the same time?
 
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