Brexit, for once some facts.

[Danidl]

The EU had lost 4 days

Multiply that by 3 and say weeks, not days and you will be somewhere near.

Over 30 million Covid vaccination procedures have now been carried out in the U.K.

Nope!.
The EU started a month behind the UK with Pfizer .
The EU started about a month behind UK with AZ.
From the get go the AZ was in short supply. Because it did nor exist.
From the get go the Pfizer and Moderna was in limited supply because the EU allowed Pfizer to honour its commercial contracts with the UK and with the USA and even with Australia...1.2 M doses . The EU still continues to so do, but patience is wearing thin. The EU has exported 42M doses in the last 6 weeks. The UK zero, the USA zero.
The EU is at 10% of population jabbed , ..which is 45M , the UK is at ,by your word 30M . But would be only at 20M except for the behaviour of the EU.
Had the EU been bloody minded, and behaved like either the UK or the USA it would have vaccinated at least 87M by now.

 

[oldgroaner]

And you do. Or, infact you are saying Chris Witty doesn't.
Yet again OG and Flecc not only professing to know more than I do, which to be honest wouldn't be difficult, they know more than Chris Witty and combined knowledge of Sage and JCVI. It is quite unbelievable.
Yep, like I know more about sailing than Ben Ainsley.
Chris Witty has forgotten more about epidemiology than us lot combined could ever know.
OG has spent his life designing toilets yet for some unknown reason he happens to have more knowledge about disease control than entire combined knowledge of all our UK experts. And Flecc knows even more than OG...
Only on a pedelec forum.Its actually quite funny.
Think I, ll phone Ineos and tell them Sir Ben knows nowt. I, m their man. I, ve sailed a foil board. It's easy. I bet they, d put phone down on me... Perhaps if I get OG or Flecc to phone for me. Honestly, I, m really good at sailing. I, ve read everything there is on Internet to read. I had years of practice one weekend.

Tell me since I know so little about hygiene, why do we design toilets rather than do our business out of the window?

 

[wheeler]

The ban has made no difference other than preventing people who legally held firearms from engaging in their hobby of target shooting, losing the plot and killing a class of 5 year olds and their teacher.

FTFY

I wonder what number of primary school class and teacher shootings you feel is acceptable to allow some people to engage in their hobby.

 

[flecc]

The chances of mutation are much less risk than risk we, d be taking vaccinating slower.

You really must learn to read, I've said nothing different.

Your sentence contains two different things, the chance of mutation and the overall risk of not controlling the virus.

I only posted about the risk of creating more mutations, and in that Chris Whitty and I are in total agreement. As he acknowledged and is widely known among experts in this field, his strategy of delay between the doses INCREASES that mutation risk, but he felt it an acceptable risk if it gave some protection against infection and severe illness for many more by delaying second half vaccinations.

He potentially swapped more mutations for less severe Covid, a gamble once again but with the odds in his favour. Hopefully he'll continue to be lucky, but heaven help us if he isn't and a lethal mutation is the outcome.
.

 

[Zlatan]

Tell me since I know so little about hygiene, why do we design toilets rather than do our business out of the window?

I can't guess but in Rotherham we use the toilet, the windows thing is one of reasons I, m not fond of Hull.

 

[Zlatan]

You really must learn to read, I've said nothing different.

Your sentence contains two different things, the chance of mutation and the overall risk of not controlling the virus.

I only posted about the risk of creating more mutations, and in that Chris Whitty and I are in total agreement. As he acknowledged and is widely known among experts in this field, his strategy of delay between the doses INCREASES that mutation risk, but he felt it an acceptable risk if it gave some protection against infection and severe illness for many more by delaying second half vaccinations.

He potentially swapped more mutations for less severe Covid, a gamble once again but with the odds in his favour. Hopefully he'll continue to be lucky, but heaven help us if he isn't and a lethal mutation is the outcome.
.

So you are agreeing with him now.
Yes, he made decision to delay 2nd jab fully aware of mutation. Because that route was (in his opinion) less risky.
Perhaps you should read my posts as well.
I,ve said all along, and only repeating Witty and JCVI, there is no route risk free. All have risks.
All they are trying to do is plot the least risk route, which so far they have done well.
Not having delay would have made other risks higher. So they chose delay.
Seems OG has rather a lower opinion of Witty, even tho he initially insisted he'd never heard of him...

 

[flecc]

So you are agreeing with him now.

I usually do. I've only ever disagreed with Chris Whitty once, that was when he momentarily supported that herd immunity might help, something I've always said was was a silly idea.

What I have often disagreed with is your strange interpretation of what Whitty says, as you've done with confusing mutation risk with vaccination benefits

Not having delay would have made other risks higher. So they chose delay.

Almost but not quite. Having the 12 week delay increases the risk of mutations evolving, so not having that delay reduces that risk. Chris Whitty knows that too.
.

 

[wheeler]

I can't guess but in Rotherham we use the toilet, the windows thing is one of reasons I, m not fond of Hull.

Gardez l'eau.

 

[Zlatan]

I usually do. I've only ever disagreed with Chris Whitty once, that was when he momentarily supported that herd immunity might help, something I've always said was was a silly idea.

What I have often disagreed with is your strange interpretation of what Whitty says, as you've done with confusing mutation risk with vaccination benefits



Almost but not quite. Having the 12 week delay increases the risk of mutations evolving, so not having that delay reduces that risk. Chris Whitty knows that too.
.

But that quite obviously is not the only risk. Witty must look at the overall picture for all risks.
Its like me avoiding a Leeshore, yep obviously you keep away but if you are likely to hit a rock outcrop you might have to go nearer.

 

[Woosh]

Why is France /Italy/Germany now suffering a further wave???
Your arguments are hypothetical and irrelevant.
We have a good vaccine, we know its safe, we know it works. Let's make it and get on with vaccinating people. It's not complicated.

Our Kent variant invaded their countries.
Added to that, France has now a new variant.
If our variant crossed the channel then the likelihood is their Breton variant will come over here in a month or two.

 

[flecc]

But that quite obviously is not the only risk. Witty must look at the overall picture for all risks.

As I do. Usually I agree with Whitty, but on the balance of risks of mutations against reducing the consequences of the illness I'm far from fully convinced, despite the odds being in his favour.

On his strategy there is a large reduction of suffering, but only for the few who do contract a severe case of Covid. So some deaths are avoided with it, often those who would die soon anyway. For all those who only get a mild case or don't catch it at all, his strategy makes no difference.

The downside is the greater risk of occurrence of variants and a small chance that one could be lethal enough to be horrific, causing many millions of deaths. That albeit tiny risk is a truly terrifying possibility.
.

 

[Woosh]

The chances of mutation are much less risk than risk we, d be taking vaccinating slower.
They knew about mentioned risk straight away.It's not new,and it was answered in briefing at least 3 weeks ago,probably more.
Its quite obvious really, had it been a significant risk, they would not have extended delay.

there is a chance that a vaccine resistant mutation occurs here, in UK because the level of antibodies is lower with a single dose. It's like taking half your prescribed antibiotics.
It is also likely that other variants come here too.
The best strategy is to build up some stock and vaccinate very quickly everyone.
What we do here is OK-ish. We started with around 100k jabs a day, then increase to 200k a day etc. You can see that we could have vaccinated 800k a day if we had stock.

 

[Jesus H Christ]

Congratulations for unintentionally proving my point about the delay between jabs being a risk of this happening

I didn’t mention a link to the delayed second jab did I ?

 

[oldgroaner]

If Johnson has a really stupid idea and acts on it, what does he do next
Do the same again

Government acquires second, brand new ‘Brexit jet’ for Boris Johnson painted red, white and blue Exclusive: Six-month-old Airbus A321 has same ‘Global Britain’ livery as RAF Voyager, which cost taxpayer £900,000 to repaint
I remember someone saying he "Dodged a bullet" when Corbyn lost the election and I responded
"Only to stop a round from a German 88mm"

The first aircraft has only been used once, what the hell does he need a second one for?
Of course there is always the possibility Corbyn might have done the same had he been elected
but somehow I think there is reason to doubt that , don't you?

 

[oldgroaner]

I didn’t mention a link to the delayed second jab did I ?

No but you really should read what you did post, try again

 

[oldgroaner]

I can't guess but in Rotherham we use the toilet, the windows thing is one of reasons I, m not fond of Hull.

My goodness do you do it out of the window when you come to Hull?
You could ruin the good name of Rotherham.. oh, well perhaps not. For obvious reasons.

 

[oldgroaner]

I, ll get Chris' number for you OG. Give him a ring,or email.. I, ll vote for you on Sage.
You really are making this thread a joke. In your own ways you are no different to Chainring and Polly. It's just same.

You really do think you can advise Chris Witty.. Crazy.
Good luck OG. Barmy old bugger.

There is of course the point that if I had posted that you would have spun it to mean that I had claimed to advise Chris Witty and called him a Barmy old bugger?

Sorry but it's you and the rear gunner of the pantomime horse that are making the thread look a joke with this refusal to bother thinking attitude you have.
I can confirm that "You really do think you can advise Chris Witty"
Indeed I can and the advice I give would be to do a runner before you get knifed in the back by Johnson and Gove and co.

Are you saying that that isn't excellent advice?
You comedian you!

 

[oldgroaner]

Seems OG has rather a lower opinion of Witty, even tho he initially insisted he'd never heard of him...

You've misread my post yet again! I did not say any such thing

Here is your post and my response

Yep, like I know more about sailing than Ben Ainsley.

I have no idea who the fella is, and why should I?

Care to apologise?

 

[oldgroaner]

I'm shocked I tell you, shocked! this is in the FT

Tory MPs block Greensill inquiry by Treasury select committee

Why on Earth was anyone stupid enough to vote for these parasites?

 

[flecc]

I have no idea who the fella is, and why should I?

Sir Charles Benedict Ainslie CBE (born 5 February 1977) is a British competitive sailor. Ainslie is the most successful sailor in Olympic history.

He chucks his wastes out of portholes.
.