Brexit, for once some facts.

oldgroaner

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That's rubbish and dangerous OG. No government could have avoided this. Yes, perhaps lockdown earlier or stronger. Who knows. Starmer in charge?? Or perhaps IDS?
All the time Boris has been between devil and deep blue sea. One faction telling us Covid is no worse than flu and destroying economy is worse than cvd... to other extreme like Ferguson saying 500,000 deaths... And in mean time folk partying, ignoring isolation, burning down 5g masts and believing utter rubbish..
Or perhaps he should have listened to Sweden?? Or Brazil?? Or Trump.
Personally think Government have done well in an appallingly difficult time. Its easy to criticise, sitting here healthy, waiting for upcoming vaccine. Which, I, d guess you, ve had.
I haven't had any word on the vaccine at all, and frankly that comes as no surprise.
Sorry but Johnson has been everything I accused him of and one day I hope he stands trial for his negligence of duty to the nation
 

oldgroaner

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Its all going to revolve around what MHRA say about Astra Zeneca. Hopefully on 28th...
The 3 week delay sums up the problem with EU, its so large it can't make decisions quickly. USA have had same problem.
I already know more folk who have had the vaccine than who have had cvd 19..yep that's not as a result of government but they have played their part.
And Twitter and such have helped the anti vaccers with their rubbish... (rumoured 1 in 5 in London are refusing vaccine, I suppose that's Boris' fault too.???
OG stop reading Guardian. Its beyond useless.
It is certainly no worse than the Mail and Daily Excess is it?
 

Zlatan

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It is certainly no worse than the Mail and Daily Excess is it?
That's hardly a recommendation is it. And actually suspect Guradian is more biased.
The media throughout our current predicament have been appalling. Perhaps for right reasons, ie questioning government because opposition doesn't, but for a number of reasons mass swathes of public have disregarded any instructions blurting out reasons such as confusion over instructions, to opposing views proliferated on social media to Dominic Cummings.
We, ve all known for months exactly how to behave, many, to our cost, choose not to, then as is the way nowadays... Blame somebody else..
Mate of mine returned from holiday with instruction to isolate. Phoned me to see if I wanted to go for a drink in his house. Turned out he wasn't leaving home, as he should not have been, so was getting neighbour to shop for him, who was in house having a cuppa dropping off groceries... Also in house we're his parents. Visiting. He then chose to moan about the stupidity of government for making him isolate and not go back to work...???!!!
Then we wonder why virus is running amok and blame Boris. Stupid people, irresponsible media and social media are to blame.
 
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Barry Shittpeas

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I haven't had any word on the vaccine at all, and frankly that comes as no surprise.
Sorry but Johnson has been everything I accused him of and one day I hope he stands trial for his negligence of duty to the nation
There isn’t enough for everyone, be patient and think yourself lucky you aren’t in the EU where vaccination hasn’t even started. They are still talking about it. Soon you will have priority access to the Oxford vaccine too you lucky man.
 

oyster

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Nov 7, 2017
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And, just for info. After a very successful heart ablation a year last August my AF has returned in vengeance.
Hope it gets resolved. As someone who gets investigated for AF, then sees it disappear by itself, and never have any symptoms, I have become aware of the difficulties some have.
 

Zlatan

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Hope it gets resolved. As someone who gets investigated for AF, then sees it disappear by itself, and never have any symptoms, I have become aware of the difficulties some have.
Thanks Oyster. When mine arrives the drugs I end up on make me feel worse than the AF itself. Had 15 months clear so hoping next op gets a bit longer.. Good luck with yours.
 
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flecc

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And, just for info. After a very successful heart ablation a year last August my AF has returned in vengeance. Back on full medication awaiting further surgery.
Sorry to learn that Zlatan, I hope you are able to get the surgery. My problem is to actually get any treatment at all.

My heart problem never went away and came to a head in Autumn 2019, but at the time the local NHS was overloaded with consultant referrals and the health trust had appealed to GPs to avoid making any as much as possible. Accordingly my doctor, new at the time, wanted to keep me under observation for a while which I went along with to hang on into the next quarter.

But then Covid-19 arrived with London hard hit at first and my borough the worst affected then, scuppering that plan, so I haven't even had any consultation or tests. The doctor and I may know what's wrong since all the symptoms have been a carbon copy of the heart trouble symptoms my mother and brother suffered previously, both fixed with a replacement heart valve.

The chance of getting that done is vanishly small with Covid and the current waiting lists and I'm getting older all the time which may make it impossible shortly. My mother's op was at 64 giving her 14 extra years, my brothers at 78 giving him 9 more years until Covid-19 killed him, but I'm now in my 85th year and nearing a deadline for such major surgery.

I'm not bothered though, given the prospects in the next few years while we try to recover from the effects of Brexit and get past Covid and the damage it's done to the economy. The best years were in the past and future best years, if any, are too far ahead for an 85 year old to enjoy.
.
 
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Zlatan

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Sorry to learn that Zlatan, I hope you are able to get the surgery. My problem is to actually get any treatment at all.

My heart problem never went away and came to a head in Autumn 2019, but at the time the local NHS was overloaded with consultant referrals and the health trust had appealed to GPs to avoid making any as much as possible. Accordingly my doctor, new at the time, wanted to keep me under observation for a while which I went along with to hang on into the next quarter.

But then Covid-19 arrived with London hard hit at first and my borough the worst affected then, scuppering that plan, so I haven't even had any consultation or tests. The doctor and I almost certainly know what's wrong since all the symptoms have been a carbon copy of the heart trouble my mother and brother suffered previously, both fixed with a replacement heart valve.

The chance of getting that done is vanishly small with Covid and the current waiting lists and I'm getting older all the time which may make it impossible shortly. My mother's op was at 64 giving her 14 extra years, my brothers at 78 giving him 9 more years until Covid-19 killed him, but I'm now in my 85th year and nearing a deadline for such major surgery.

I'm not bothered though, given the prospects in the next few years while we try to recover from the effects of Brexit and get past Covid and the damage it's done to the economy. The best years were in the past and future best years, if any, are too far ahead for an 85 year old to enjoy.
.
Hang in there Flecc. This damned Covid has caused many unseen problems. I, m supposed to be going into hospital very soon for assessment. (echocardiofraph, scan, ECG) but with 27% of covid cases originating in hospital I, m not that happy about going in...
Thinking of staying home til I, ve had vaccine... But no idea how long that wait will be.
Take care Flecc. Stay safe matey.
 

oldgroaner

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Nov 15, 2015
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That's hardly a recommendation is it. And actually suspect Guradian is more biased.
The media throughout our current predicament have been appalling. Perhaps for right reasons, ie questioning government because opposition doesn't, but for a number of reasons mass swathes of public have disregarded any instructions blurting out reasons such as confusion over instructions, to opposing views proliferated on social media to Dominic Cummings.
We, ve all known for months exactly how to behave, many, to our cost, choose not to, then as is the way nowadays... Blame somebody else..
Mate of mine returned from holiday with instruction to isolate. Phoned me to see if I wanted to go for a drink in his house. Turned out he wasn't leaving home, as he should not have been, so was getting neighbour to shop for him, who was in house having a cuppa dropping off groceries... Also in house we're his parents. Visiting. He then chose to moan about the stupidity of government for making him isolate and not go back to work...???!!!
Then we wonder why virus is running amok and blame Boris. Stupid people, irresponsible media and social media are to blame.
The Pandemic would be less of a problem if Boris had behaved a effectively as New Zealand and Japan did
 
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oldgroaner

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Countries we should be compared to are France etc.. Or look at Isle of Man... Life normal there. There are reasons.
And one is the stupidity of many on our shores.
Our local primary school had a report that a parent had had a +ve cvd test. Head approached the lady who insisted she had not. Feeling suspicious head phoned Tand T. Turned out lady in question had a +ve test 12 days earlier, along with all her 3 children,all of whom never missed a day in school. Children were told to stay home... For 2 days. Isolation was almost finished. And yet we blame Boris/ Government. Well some do.
We need an anti stupid Vaccine but the stupid would refuse it.
We actually needed the Anti Stupid vaccine in the early spring of 2016 :D
 

Zlatan

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Nov 26, 2016
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The Pandemic would be less of a problem if Boris had behaved a effectively as New Zealand and Japan did
You know full well neither of thos can be compared with UK.
Japan has a population willing and wanting to follow every single instruction. We have one wanting to do the opposite.
New, Zealand is isolated, has a relatively tiny population generally living miles apart. Look at what happens around Dover when the port is closed for 48 hours. Its an infantile silly comparison. Yes, we are an island but with millions of folk coming in and out from every corner of globe daily. What would you have done last March OG..? Closed everyborder, stopped exporting, stopped importing and let us all starve... For a while Germany appeared to be coping... Examine their health service now. As for death rates, nobody will know full extent for any countries for years. Yes, we, ve suffered. As as most the world almost irrespective of approach taken. Shame UK couldn't do what Isle of Man did. Think in their own way they have done better than New Zealand. But the UK is not the Isle of Man, neither is it New Zealand. Very simplistic argument at best OG.
Putting it in perspective OG, NZ is 10% larger than UK in area but has 60 million fewer people. (They have around 5 million,)
 
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Danidl

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Sep 29, 2016
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Hang in there Flecc. This damned Covid has caused many unseen problems. I, m supposed to be going into hospital very soon for assessment. (echocardiofraph, scan, ECG) but with 27% of covid cases originating in hospital I, m not that happy about going in...
Thinking of staying home til I, ve had vaccine... But no idea how long that wait will be.
Take care Flecc. Stay safe matey.
Zlatan, I was equally apprehensive in October, but they kept the Cat lab very well away from other locations , and insisted in CV19 tests prior to admission. We patients were the only ones unmasked, everything and everyone else was within very strict protocols. A dodgy ticker will stop you a lot quicker than CV19. And CV19 on top of a bad ticker is a death sentence.. Take the chance as soon as possible.
 
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Zlatan

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Nov 26, 2016
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Zlatan, I was equally apprehensive in October, but they kept the Cat lab very well away from other locations , and insisted in CV19 tests prior to admission. We patients were the only ones unmasked, everything and everyone else was within very strict protocols. A dodgy ticker will stop you a lot quicker than CV19. And CV19 on top of a bad ticker is a death sentence.. Take the chance as soon as possible.
I know, wife keeps saying same. Cheers.
 

Danidl

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Sep 29, 2016
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You know full well neither of thos can be compared with UK.
Japan has a population willing and wanting to follow every single instruction. We have one wanting to do the opposite.
New, Zealand is isolated, has a relatively tiny population generally living miles apart. Look at what happens around Dover when the port is closed for 48 hours. Its an infantile silly comparison. Yes, we are an island but with millions of folk coming in and out from every corner of globe daily. What would you have done last March OG..? Closed everyborder, stopped exporting, stopped importing and let us all starve... For a while Germany appeared to be coping... Examine their health service now. As for death rates, nobody will know full extent for any countries for years. Yes, we, ve suffered. As as most the world almost irrespective of approach taken. Shame UK couldn't do what Isle of Man did. Think in their own way they have done better than New Zealand. But the UK is not the Isle of Man, neither is it New Zealand. Very simplistic argument at best OG.
I must disagree. The UK was in the best position in Europe in February. It could legally have shut borders and airports ..it was out of the EU. They could have stopped all tourism in and out, a fumigated lorries at the ports . I did refer back to that at the time. Trade would have been hurt a little . What really really does annoy me is that certain boneheads in NI took a slavish attitude to BJs posturing and refused to action things which would have saved lives here.
 

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