Brexit, for once some facts.

[oldgroaner]

This is what leave are all about

This has been distributed in the constituency of a Conservative MP that voted for May's deal Gillian Keegan.
The UKIP should be classed as a Proscribed organisation and ordered disbanded

Isn't it fascinating that the leave camp invariably try to portray the remain camp as being and behaving exactly as they do?

 

[Nev]

Sad news about Nissan, can the car workers sue Leave.EU?

No I think they should be allowed to sue the remain campaign for their complacency and the hopeless effort they made. You have to admit even though the Leave campaign was based on half truths and down right lies, they fought an excellent campaign.

 

[oyster]

Mrs May's propaganda machine is in top gear now, even recruited the Guardian
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/feb/03/queen-to-be-evacuated-if-brexit-turns-ugly-reports
Cold war plans revived to move royals to safe locations away from London if unrest follows no deal

British officials have revived cold war emergency plans to relocate the royal family should there be riots in London if Britain suffers a disruptive departure from the European Union, two Sunday newspapers have reported.


“These emergency evacuation plans have been in existence since the cold war but have now been repurposed in the event of civil disorder following a no-deal Brexit,” the Sunday Times said, quoting an unnamed source from the government’s Cabinet Office, which handles sensitive administrative issues.


The Mail on Sunday also said it had learnt of plans to move the royal family, including Queen Elizabeth, to safe locations away from London.

Pathetic!

Brexit bonus for Wales!

When they install the Windsors in those caves. I guess they will also have been dusting the cobwebs off the National Gallery relocation plans - more caves in Wales. Or will it be salt mines in Cheshire?

Who owns those caves now?

Leaving the big question of how they will deliver lettuces and oranges to north Wales?

 

[Woosh]

Because you did, made promises, lied and took bribes from illegal sources, and here you are making a comical attempt to say food will be cheaper, the biggest lie of all.
You have absolutely no proof as usual behind yet another lying leave promise, why do you persist?

Peter Ungphakorn who wrote that blog makes promises that no sane government can deliver without negotiation.
It follows in the footstep of other hard brexiters, making promises.
If we don't charge duty on Spanish oranges then what do we get in return without a deal?

 

[oldgroaner]

Another day and while the future of the nation hangs in the balance, the Remain supporters provide up to date information on the plots that are going on, and what do the self styled champion of leave come on here to do?

One whinges about French Petty officialdom upsetting his pals
Another keeps making fictional apologies
And weirdest of all, OJ has his knickers in a twist in a crusade about the price of oranges.(but can't get his facts right as usual)

Why don't you collectively get your act together and do something useful? you know, such as debate the hugely important political situation that is the purpose of the thread, or open up a thread of your own if you can agree on something to witter about?
Have a nice day in Never never land
Sorry but I'm laughing,at the thought that these are the best leave can provide that imagine they are doing a good job in promoting Brexit.

Please folks don't encourage them, they have damaged Brexit enough already without your help.

 

[oldgroaner]

Like I say - try engaging with the argument itself rather than criticising the perceived source.

You haven't got an argument to engage with, that's the problem, why should I engage in your silly diversionary posting?
You represent enemies of the state, what is there to debate about that? you will post anything you think you can get away with, to steer the debate away from Brexit itself into pointless little ill informed spats, as usual without success.

 

[OxygenJames]

No I think they should be allowed to sue the remain campaign for their complacency and the hopeless effort they made. You have to admit even though the Leave campaign was based on half truths and down right lies, they fought an excellent campaign.

Nev - you've obviously not read Fleccs response - read it:

"There's an element of dieselgate in this, it's not all Brexit.

Basically, after Nissan had received some sort of guarantee from the government, they announced that they would plan to build the new X-Trail version at Sunderland, in addition to the Qashqai, Micra and Leaf models that are currently built there.

So it's only a cancellation of an additional model that would have needed more employees, not a threat to the existing workers building the other three models.

Dieselgate has already cost them previously, once having 9000 direct employees at Sunderland, it's currently some 7000."

 

[anotherkiwi]

Oranges harvested too early or which spend long times in transit have much lower vitamin C content. Just saying...

 

[OxygenJames]

Peter Ungphakorn who wrote that blog makes promises that no sane government can deliver without negotiation.
It follows in the footstep of other hard brexiters, making promises.
If we don't charge duty on Spanish oranges then what do we get in return without a deal?

Are you deliberately being thick? We won't charge duty on Spanish oranges as they will already be more expensive than we will then be able to get from other sources.

The only line or argument - and one I thought you may pick (but haven't so I will help you out) - is that the government could CHOOSE to put a tariff on those other sources so that the price in the shops would be about the same - and thus make some money in the process.

Never mind.

I thought when you said you saw a string of factual errors in Tim's original article that you might be onto something - instead you're actually like OG who has a point of view and will bend reality to fit those facts or who is so blinded by his own opinion as being unable to think rationally anymore about the situation.

 

[OxygenJames]

Oranges harvested too early or which spend long times in transit have much lower vitamin C content. Just saying...

Then people will pay extra for the high Vit C ones - or not. But. They will have the choice.

Market forces.

 

[OxygenJames]

You haven't got an argument to engage with, that's the problem, why should I engage in your silly diversionary posting?
You represent enemies of the state, what is there to debate about that? you will post anything you think you can get away with, to steer the debate away from Brexit itself into pointless little ill informed spats, as usual without success.

I've made the argument many many times but you ignore it. My argument is simple. Free trade. Remove ALL tariffs. Let the market decide. Stop bailing out the farmers. Get our food and other stuff cheaper where we can. You ignore all this and don't engage.

 

[oyster]

Nev - you've obviously not read Fleccs response - read it:

"There's an element of dieselgate in this, it's not all Brexit.

Basically, after Nissan had received some sort of guarantee from the government, they announced that they would plan to build the new X-Trail version at Sunderland, in addition to the Qashqai, Micra and Leaf models that are currently built there.

So it's only a cancellation of an additional model that would have needed more employees, not a threat to the existing workers building the other three models.

Dieselgate has already cost them previously, once having 9000 direct employees at Sunderland, it's currently some 7000."

However, Nissan have already made a big thing about the 2019 X-trail having hybrid propulsion. (I haven't found anything which says whether that would be diesel or petrol.)

 

[oyster]

Then people will pay extra for the high Vit C ones - or not. But. They will have the choice.

Market forces.

Which gets back to what I have already pointed out. We need labelling so we KNOW how much vitamin C is present (or at least, a reasonable likely range). Otherwise we end up relying on rumour and guesses.

You only have a real choice if you can access the information.

 

[OxygenJames]

I did and you are still wrong.

in the absence of a trade deal, our government has to apply tariff to protect local producers and charge at least the current tariff.

HOW MANY ORANGE GROVES DO YOU KNOW OF IN THE UK?

Dear oh dear.

 

[OxygenJames]

Which gets back to what I have already pointed out. We need labelling so we KNOW how much vitamin C is present (or at least, a reasonable likely range). Otherwise we end up relying on rumour and guesses.

You only have a real choice if you can access the information.

What if we don't give a sh*t about how much Vit C is in our orange juice but buy it for the taste?

 

[OxygenJames]

Which gets back to what I have already pointed out. We need labelling so we KNOW how much vitamin C is present (or at least, a reasonable likely range). Otherwise we end up relying on rumour and guesses.

You only have a real choice if you can access the information.

You really do have this weird idea that people are rational creatures and buy things based on 'information' they can read on a label.

 

[OxygenJames]

This is what leave are all about

This has been distributed in the constituency of a Conservative MP that voted for May's deal Gillian Keegan.
The UKIP should be classed as a Proscribed organisation and ordered disbanded

Isn't it fascinating that the leave camp invariably try to portray the remain camp as being and behaving exactly as they do?

One leaflet from one specific location and you claim this is what the entire 'Leave' ethos is all about.

OG - you're an [removed by admin: OK so I've read worse and you're not the only one by a long shot, but can everyone please disagree with ideas politely and not be inflammatory by attacking other members]

 

[OxygenJames]

However, Nissan have already made a big thing about the 2019 X-trail having hybrid propulsion. (I haven't found anything which says whether that would be diesel or petrol.)

When in doubt - change the subject.

 

[OxygenJames]

Peter Ungphakorn who wrote that blog makes promises that no sane government can deliver without negotiation.
It follows in the footstep of other hard brexiters, making promises.
If we don't charge duty on Spanish oranges then what do we get in return without a deal?

What 'promises' did he make in that blog? None.

This is his concluding paragraph:

"So establishing the UK’s WTO commitments won’t be quick but whether it will take more than, say, two years, depends on so many unknowns that it is impossible to tell right now.

On each of the three tests — the UK’s own position, and the reactions of the EU and non-EU countries — we still have to wait and see."

 

[Woosh]

HOW MANY ORANGE GROVES DO YOU KNOW OF IN THE UK?

Dear oh dear.

you can't separate producers of oranges from those of other fruits, vegetables, grains, milk, cheese, sheep and cows etc.
that's why brexiters lack of credibility in peddling for WTO.
You pick and choose one product to make a policy on it then choose another product to make a different policy. No consistency.

WTO is the common denominator. Trade deals improve it.
there is no point going back to year zero like Pol Pot did in Cambodia, killing 2 million Cambodians to make way for his revolution.