Actually only the 1.5million Irish in the northern six counties had an opportunity to do so.. the 4.5million in the remaining 26 counties had of course no such opportunity. Of the group which could vote, a convincing majority were remainders. Despite this the policy of the first minister is to support the Westminster position.
Brexit, for once some facts.
- Thread starter flecc
- Start date
Please be more charitable: there is always room for all views here: I rather enjoy being exposed to foolish ideas as well as sensible ones.
If someone is determined to make themselves look foolish, it would be churlish not to help them achieve their mission in life after all.
Sorry,what has the capital gains in property anything to do with Brexit? Really you have identified that the Brexit vote was used by many as a protest vote identifying the north-south divide. I hope you are pleased for your mate who has probably made more money out of his flat than he has working.
Buying in London has also been about timing,I remember when a housing slump came along and interest rates rocketed,there were many who went bankrupt trying to afford their London property.
But a vote for Brexit will not change the wealth between London and the poorer parts of our country
London has the big salaries,it makes lots of money,it is also the obvious home for foreign money. But hurting the London bank trading will not improve the rest of the country,more it will erode the pot available to all.
Don't forget that you when you bought you had a 3 bedroom home in the Midlands against your friends small flat in London,you enjoyed a lot more space than him for many years. My daughter has just bought a wonderful house in the West Midlands,that would be many millions in London,she has no thoughts of capital gain more a family house,the capital gain is not important the lifestyle takes priority.
Life is not all about money!!!
KudosDave
I agree and disagree....it is becoming obvious that Theresa May will prioritise people border control,she made a mess of that as Home Secretary so this is a chance to have another go.
It is also becoming obvious that we are going to leave the single market and the customs union,maybe she will find a way to keep bank passporting.
That will mean that everything from the EU will cost more and we will find it more difficult to sell our goods in Europe,all German cars will cost more but we will still buy them. The UK e-bike customers could find German made bikes just too expensive,so Chinese with no tariff could look more attractive.
I don't think the Scots will break from the UK,that is a threat by Sturgeon but the current economy in Scotland appears to be fragile. The Irish would not want to invite the troubles back.
Selling our wares to the world,grasping the opportunities,is a Theresa May pipe dream,we will end up a smaller and poorer country post Brexit,but maybe that's what many Brexiters want.....a return to 70's Britain,my memory of that time it wasn't that good.
KudosDave
There was talk about new EU ebike law (seen a while ago on NL site) this was to mean the 15 mph max staying but more amps for better hill assist allowed, & the ability to run the motor without turning the pedals, & was thought to perhaps come out in 2017 or later. This bike still needed no tax or insurance & rider needed to be 16 I think. The original bike std remained available & also a 'road going licenceable moped'- much faster, was mooted. I wondered what the upshot of the Brexit on all this was. I think it was to promote E bike riding as against car use? When the £ crashed it made things a bit expensive & I built no further machines/expements anyway.
There was an attempt by the European Parliament to scrap power limits on pedelecs, relying only on the assist speed limit, but the EU commission refused to accept that.
The moped changes you mentioned are already there in the Netherlands, the S class high speed e-bikes permitted and some moped access to cycle paths, though the latter is contentious.
Otherwise the only EU changes for 2017/2018 are the type approval rules for L1e-A and L1e-B mopeds being finalised. There's been talk of having throttles on the L1e-A bike based 25 kph mopeds, but no changes accepted so far and none likely to be.
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Rather an interesting observation from a Reader's letter in the idependent, regarding Article 50
"
It's purposely vague because it was never intended that it would be invoked. The irony is that the British had requested this mechanism in a treaty, whereas previously there was never any obstacle to leaving the EU. Messier, perhaps, but no "triggering" or 2 years' negotiations, etc. Had it not been for the insistence of the UK government, we could have simply withdrawn from the treaty at a time of our choosing, and taken as long as was needed to sort out the exit arrangements and negotiate new ones.
Something along the lines of "Hoisted with his own Petard" springs to mind!
"
It's purposely vague because it was never intended that it would be invoked. The irony is that the British had requested this mechanism in a treaty, whereas previously there was never any obstacle to leaving the EU. Messier, perhaps, but no "triggering" or 2 years' negotiations, etc. Had it not been for the insistence of the UK government, we could have simply withdrawn from the treaty at a time of our choosing, and taken as long as was needed to sort out the exit arrangements and negotiate new ones.
Something along the lines of "Hoisted with his own Petard" springs to mind!
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Also from the Independent
Gollum is attempting to creep back into the limelight sensing an opportunity to appear the "once and future king" in Brexit, the Comic opera
"
Michael Gove says not leaving the single market would be 'fake Brexit'
Failure to strike a deal could require £9bn in subsidies to forms, a separate report also warns
"
Writing for the BrexitCentral website, Mr Gove said: “We need to deliver a full Brexit, not settle for fake Brexit.
“Once Article 50 is triggered, we should be very clear about our simple, straightforward, generous approach to leaving.
“We don’t want or need to be in the single market – outside we can control our own borders, laws and taxes. Inside we’re trapped.
“We don’t want to be bound by being members of the customs union. Outside we can negotiate new trade deals with emerging economies. Inside we’re trapped.
“And we don’t need to waste months talking about new tariffs. We don’t have any at the moment with Europe, we don’t want to impose any and attempts to over-complicate the issue are a trap.”
Fine words from the man who's statistical competence included the classic phrase that he wanted
All schools to be above average.
When considering anything this "man" says it is well to remember the words of the Greek Philosopher Euripides
Man's most valuable trait
is a judicious sense of what not to believe.
Gollum is attempting to creep back into the limelight sensing an opportunity to appear the "once and future king" in Brexit, the Comic opera
"
Michael Gove says not leaving the single market would be 'fake Brexit'
Failure to strike a deal could require £9bn in subsidies to forms, a separate report also warns
"
Writing for the BrexitCentral website, Mr Gove said: “We need to deliver a full Brexit, not settle for fake Brexit.
“Once Article 50 is triggered, we should be very clear about our simple, straightforward, generous approach to leaving.
“We don’t want or need to be in the single market – outside we can control our own borders, laws and taxes. Inside we’re trapped.
“We don’t want to be bound by being members of the customs union. Outside we can negotiate new trade deals with emerging economies. Inside we’re trapped.
“And we don’t need to waste months talking about new tariffs. We don’t have any at the moment with Europe, we don’t want to impose any and attempts to over-complicate the issue are a trap.”
Fine words from the man who's statistical competence included the classic phrase that he wanted
All schools to be above average.
When considering anything this "man" says it is well to remember the words of the Greek Philosopher Euripides
Man's most valuable trait
is a judicious sense of what not to believe.
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All members states have been pushing so long for an ideal Europe with little regard to costs.Something along the lines of "Hoisted with his own Petard" springs to mind!
expected reaction to Mrs May's yesterday interview: the Pound drops sharply today - down to $1.21 this morning.
Would it change some brexiters' resolve?
Would it change some brexiters' resolve?
I'm surprised you mention that as I don't understand any concerns the tory government puts out about the nation's finances. Neither do I understand when the BofE governor issues warnings about the economy.
Why don't I understand? Simply because since the financial collapse of 2007-8, our governments have ordered the BofE to create billions of pounds to inject into the exchequer. That has continued at intervals since yet those who actually pay income tax - those who are subject to PAYE via a company payroll along with the unemployed - have had to suffer austerity measures and if they are lucky enough to have savings, see virtually nil growth while the bankers, (huge friends and supporters of this tory government), still receive ludicrous bonuses for just doing their job.
My point is, given QE, why should anyone be concerned about cost? More pertinently, why should we worry about the cost of the EU? Cost is never mentioned when governments decide to fire some really expensive missiles at some far-off country to 'help them bring about or restore democracy.' Surely it has to be worth paying whatever it costs to belong to the EU in a relatively peaceful European continent than to pay both the economic and human costs of engaging in another war?
The present apology for a government and the previous 'tory-lite' administration had no compunction about raiding the treasury for warmongering acivities in the middle-east and Afghanistan. Indeed, in 1982, the then increasingly unpopular Thatcher used the tactic of waging war on a smaller, weaker, less militarily-sophisticated nation to divert attention away from her shameful 'greed is good' policies. That kind of action demands that all citizens back the government lest they are seen as unpatriotic. Cost was never a consideration in going to war in the Falklands so why should we concern ourselves about the price of our EU membership?
Tom
Hi Tom, that was to add to OG's comment (Something along the lines of "Hoisted with his own Petard" springs to mind!). I meant costs to all net contributors to the EU budget that creeps up over the years.
The EU is a club whose members are bound by a common ideal: equal and prosperous for all. Members vote to spend forever more on common policies, to enlarge and to remove 'obstacles' like frontiers.
These things invariably cost more than projected. Brexit is one of the predictable consequences when some member gets fed up with paying.
Your comment about QE: I think we have QE as last resort really. Where else can we borrow the money from? We don't use QE to repair pot holes, we use QE to buy treasury bonds, like a credit card that we have no intention to clear.
The UK has a lot of rich people but is not exactly a rich country.
The EU is a club whose members are bound by a common ideal: equal and prosperous for all. Members vote to spend forever more on common policies, to enlarge and to remove 'obstacles' like frontiers.
These things invariably cost more than projected. Brexit is one of the predictable consequences when some member gets fed up with paying.
Your comment about QE: I think we have QE as last resort really. Where else can we borrow the money from? We don't use QE to repair pot holes, we use QE to buy treasury bonds, like a credit card that we have no intention to clear.
The UK has a lot of rich people but is not exactly a rich country.
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Frankly, I don't see that it would have made any difference. We would still have the same people dithering over how to play it so we get the 'best deal possible', hedging our bets every step of the way.
From the start, I have always believed that the best deal possible for the UK is full membership of the EU. Anything else is akin to having only those playing rights accorded to artisan, associate or country member at some fancy golf clubs - still pay quite a lot of money but can't play when you want to and probably not at weekends. Full membership provides many extra benefits.
Tom
Sorry, you lost me there.
Apart from the fact that such a 'policy' is diametrically opposed to the tory model of treating the nation's finances like a household budget, it makes no sense arithmetically, economically or logically.
If there is any sound reason to produce extra money from thin air, why should that money not be used to repair potholes or anything else deemed sufficiently important? In any case, we can save hundreds of millions by desisting from firing £1m missiles into sand and rubble in Syria and Iraq for the benefit of a debatable cause but certainly to the detriment of the many human beings who populate those areas. It's not as if anyone is impressed or frightened by such actions.
Tom
England voted out by a clear margin, Scotland and Northern Ireland voted to remain by an even clearer margin.
The UK is getting out of the EU, soon to follow, the possible break-up of the UK.
The Pound has been dropping since and will continue to drop until someone in our government figures out how to bridge the gap in the balance of payments, possibly putting up VAT.
I made the decision to only put up those prices which were affected by the weakening of the £ against the US dollar and the Euro. That has affected about 1200 products in my 11000 product range.
What concerns me is every time Theresa May indicates we are leaving the single market the £ goes south again. I am currently using 1.20 dollar to £,the way this is going we may be soon looking at parity with the dollar and Euro.
Its great for exports but the poor old UK consumer will soon be suffering badly.
Another 300 products went up this week.
KudosDave
What concerns me is every time Theresa May indicates we are leaving the single market the £ goes south again. I am currently using 1.20 dollar to £,the way this is going we may be soon looking at parity with the dollar and Euro.
Its great for exports but the poor old UK consumer will soon be suffering badly.
Another 300 products went up this week.
KudosDave
Sorry,cannot agree that the vote was a clear margin....it should have been a 10% minimum difference....if 16 year olds and expats had been allowed to vote it may have been the other way,especially considering that old people mainly voted leave,many have died since the vote and more young have come in...why the oldies voted leave I cannot understand when many workers in social care are EU migrants.
Putting vat up would be political suicide,like admitting that Brexit cost is aimed at the poor.
KudosDave
Woosh revise prices every month to reflect the exchange rate.
So far, brexit has a small positive impact.
So far, brexit has a small positive impact.