Brexit, for once some facts.

tillson

Esteemed Pedelecer
May 29, 2008
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Not yet it isn't! nothing has changed.
Every day that passes adds to the uncertainty as the other side is showing no sign of being willing to negotiate, and our Parliament is terrified to push the red button.
Given half a chance they will come up with reasons not to and it will gradually founder and be forgotten.
A really good sign would be if they find some new war to wage to divert public attention away from it, first adding a delay and finally in due course when enthusiasm dwindles it will evaporate.
Nor should they push the button. This needs to drag on through the election periods for other EU countries, in particular France. Whilst this is hanging in the air, it will fuel the appetite for referendums across the EU and see its eventual demise.

The EU are desperate for us to pull the trigger on 50. Each day we don't strengthens our position.
 
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oldgroaner

Esteemed Pedelecer
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Nor should they push the button. This needs to drag on through the election periods for other EU countries, in particular France. Whilst this is hanging in the air, it will fuel the appetite for referendums across the EU and see its eventual demise.
Do you really believe that? and not question the motives of the source of that news? tell me where is your reliable source?
It wouldn't be this rabid pack would it?
Europe of Freedom and Democracy had 34 elected members between 2009–2014,
A fringe group but lionised by the Murdoch press.
 

derf

Esteemed Pedelecer
Aug 4, 2014
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Seriously derf it isnt by any means over, this is the only the introduction to a far bigger event than is visible at this time.
I agree,also with what flec says about this thread being cathartic. one thing that's clear to me and obvious - I know many on the thread will disagree - is that the majority of voters were misled during the referendum by leave - in ways I think perhaps warrants legal prosecution given the damage done. bu there is also caveat emptor, voters evidently didn't and don't know the facts involved in whats probably been one of the biggest decisions they will have made in their lives. like you I hope it isn't over, and article 50 never happens, but there is an almost 100% void of leadership, and the level of reflective awareness of whats happened isn't always helpful, so jurys out I think as to whether this becomes a step into an abyss.
 
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flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
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We're still leaving. It's happening.
I agree, I don't see an extension beyond two years likely, so then we'll be out. That's when things get interesting though, since only then will we start to see who gets any satisfaction from the move. That might take years to be fully revealed.

We seem to have exchanged one rocky road for another.
.
 

trex

Esteemed Pedelecer
May 15, 2011
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...
The EU are desperate for us to pull the trigger on 50. Each day we don't strengthens our position.
there is another school of thought - nationalist movements in other EU countries are waiting for the brexit process to complete before asking for their own referenda. For every loser, there are winners. At the moment, the uncertainty in the UK is benefiting other EU countries as far as investment decisions are concerned. It also suits the USA because of the possibility of reversal of brexit. So a lot of them don't mind how long it's going to take.
 

derf

Esteemed Pedelecer
Aug 4, 2014
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there is another school of thought - nationalist movements in other EU countries are waiting for the brexit process to complete before asking for their own referenda. For every loser, there are winners. At the moment, the uncertainty in the UK is benefiting other EU countries as far as investment decisions are concerned. It also suits the USA because of the possibility of reversal of brexit. So a lot of them don't mind how long it's going to take.
yes, I find it hard to imagine any sensible voter in the eu is observing the haemhorrage that is brexit with anything other than growing apprehension/aversion of considering anything similar
 

oldgroaner

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 15, 2015
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Admittedly there are indeed Nationalist Movement in other countries, the deciding factor for them will be a question of the environment they operate in, for instance has there been a continuous policy of blaming all ills for Government failures, on the EU and nonsense claims of it being domineering and overbearing, backed up by a hostile press distorting everything involving the EU ever since they joined as has happened here?
If that is not the case then their populations are likely to be better informed and less likely to listen to the siren calls of the Farages of this world.
And with regard to evidence for the prosecution of liars you can do no better than to look here
http://blogs.ec.europa.eu/ECintheUK/euromyths-a-z-index/
 

tillson

Esteemed Pedelecer
May 29, 2008
5,252
3,197
there is another school of thought - nationalist movements in other EU countries are waiting for the brexit process to complete before asking for their own referenda. For every loser, there are winners. At the moment, the uncertainty in the UK is benefiting other EU countries as far as investment decisions are concerned. It also suits the USA because of the possibility of reversal of brexit. So a lot of them don't mind how long it's going to take.
I think they are desperate for us to trigger the exit process. Once Andrea Leadsom takes over, I'm confident she will be more than capable of playing them at their own game. The goodness will start to flow.
 

oldgroaner

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 15, 2015
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I think they are desperate for us to trigger the exit process. Once Andrea Leadsom takes over, I'm confident she will be more than capable of playing them at their own game. The goodness will start to flow.
You'll no doubt be pleased to know that the goodness has started to flow already a mere handful turned out for the Anti Brexit protest.
Only 30,000 or so.

"“All EU Need is Love” indeed! :D
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/07/02/theresa-may-prime-minister-conservative-leadership-brexit-vote/
Chicken feed, of course and by the way, who's this Andrea Leadsom person have they found a willing mug? shouldn't someone warn her what she is getting into?
Don't tell me she is being as mislead as the public.
"“All EU Need is Love” doesn't it just sing? can't wait for the song to come out, straight into the top ten I reckon.
 
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oldgroaner

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 15, 2015
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The Brexit camp do not approve of protest and have commented and the question asked was "if they have won why does the protest bother them?"
This was my two pennorth

"They're worried that more than half of their support has vanished already, the leaders have quit and it probably wont happen because parliament has no interest in pushing the Red button in case it is connected to the outlet of an overhead septic tank." :D

Speaking as an impartial observer of course....:rolleyes:
 
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tillson

Esteemed Pedelecer
May 29, 2008
5,252
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The Brexit camp do not approve of protest and have commented and the question asked was "if they have won why does the protest bother them?"
This was my two pennorth

"They're worried that more than half of their support has vanished already, the leaders have quit and it probably wont happen because parliament has no interest in pushing the Red button in case it is connected to the outlet of an overhead septic tank." :D

Speaking as an impartial observer of course....:rolleyes:
No worries. It's happening get used to it.
 

tillson

Esteemed Pedelecer
May 29, 2008
5,252
3,197
You'll no doubt be pleased to know that the goodness has started to flow already a mere handful turned out for the Anti Brexit protest.
Only 30,000 or so.

"“All EU Need is Love” indeed! :D
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/07/02/theresa-may-prime-minister-conservative-leadership-brexit-vote/
Chicken feed, of course and by the way, who's this Andrea Leadsom person have they found a willing mug? shouldn't someone warn her what she is getting into?
Don't tell me she is being as mislead as the public.
"“All EU Need is Love” doesn't it just sing? can't wait for the song to come out, straight into the top ten I reckon.
Do we need Boris's water cannons? :)
 
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oldgroaner

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 15, 2015
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Do we need Boris's water cannons? :)
Too late a mug was found that bought them, but a nice idea typical thoughtful and diplomatic stuff, Tillson, kudos and all that.
Style of
"There goes a man who can snatch defeat from the very jaws of victory"
Excellent Brexit logic : highly commendable:D
 
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trex

Esteemed Pedelecer
May 15, 2011
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Tillson
I don't think it will make much difference who is leading the negotiation. There will be enough pressure from big US businesses to go for 'Norway Plus'. The plus is there to pacify brexiters, a bit like Cameron's special concession.
 

flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
53,152
30,567
Your's and the UK's future leader. I think she will make a good job of it.
I listened to Michael Gove's campaign launch speech, and although he stands for the diametrically opposite to my beliefs, I was impressed by the speech and he earned my respect.

It seems to me that he stands strongly for the full Brexit position, so I find it disappointing for them that he's meeting so much opposition.
.
 

oldgroaner

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 15, 2015
23,461
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I listened to Michael Gove's campaign launch speech, and although he stands for the diametrically opposite to my beliefs, I was impressed by the speech and he earned my respect.

It seems to me that he stands strongly for the full Brexit position, so I find it disappointing for them that he's meeting so much opposition.
.
My respect too, but only for a Bravura performance of the Confidence Tricksters art of appearing to make a great personal sacrifice while robbing you blind!
Not so much Robin Hood as Robin Anybody.
 

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