Brexit, for once some facts.

[Woosh]

Woosh,Shemozzle how do we overcome this lot ???,dont forget May and Co are still committed to leaving the single market and the customs union.

the implication of whatever deal will come to parliament for approval in October 2018.
If the deal is too bad then we'll have to either tell the EU we need more time or walk away with no deal, no doubt the government will fall if there is no deal, the problem will be solved by the next government.

Remainers, just concentrate on winning the heart of the brexiters.
You have a long way to go yet.

 

[Steb]

In a nutshell, the BoE is correct. Brexit does mean, at least for the next 5-10 years, lower growth, weaker pound and higher prices compared to what they would be otherwise.

The amplitude of these things: they are estimated at 3%.
Not enough to sink the ship.
and enough to keep this country green a little longer.
When you look at JC's last manifesto, it represents only 6% extra spending and look at the reception. 6% will make a huge difference.
some will say 3% inflation means 3% less rubbish in our streets.

why do it (obvious question, I know). If one of your employees came to you and said - I want you to cancel any agreements you have with a (make that your largest) customer - and you said why? and he said look on the bright side, you'll survive without him, in any case a cut in your turnover will be good for you, it will help you get in touch with your better side...what would you say? it's perverse logic and I cant believe you cant see it.

 

[Woosh]

Steb, you know as well as I do, brexiters believe they have the moral high ground. Talking about x% of inflation or y% of loss of trade is a) to invite the other side to tell you 'prove it' or b) they tell you that they don't care.
I have regularly to deal with disappointment, missing sales target, running out of stock, unexpected exchange rate movement etc they are less important than the primary goals such as making better bikes.

 

[Kudoscycles]

Steb, you know as well as I do, brexiters believe they have the moral high ground. Talking about x% of inflation or y% of loss of trade is a) to invite the other side to tell you 'prove it' or b) they tell you that they don't care.
I have regularly to deal with disappointment, missing sales target, running out of stock, unexpected exchange rate movement etc they are less important than the primary goals such as making better bikes.

Brexiters are protected in that their attitudes align with the 80 Tory 'bastards',without that fascist element in the Tory party then Brexit would be dead in the water.
I come back to my previous posting that May could decide on a second referendum,she would be supported by Hammond and Rudd and probably 400 plus in parliament.
It would get rid of Boris and Gove at a stroke,it would throw Labour into turmoil...they could no longer sit on the fence. She knows that the public attitude for Brexit has changed by the lack of support in the recent GE and she is the mistress of the U-turn.
She must be viewing the obstacles of Brexit,which are getting worse daily,some of these like the Irish border look impossible,it must be so stressful for her.
It would certainly be a better way to leave than being kicked out or resigning.
Would be good fun watching Farage,IDS and Rees-Mug throwing tantrums.
After Trump anything is possible,hehe.....
KudosDave

 

[Steb]

Steb, you know as well as I do, brexiters believe they have the moral high ground. Talking about x% of inflation or y% of loss of trade is a) to invite the other side to tell you 'prove it' or b) they tell you that they don't care.
I have regularly to deal with disappointment, missing sales target, running out of stock, unexpected exchange rate movement etc they are less important than the primary goals such as making better bikes.

well, by analogy, its also about importing chickens washed in chlorine - what i mean is that having to pay much more for Chinese pedelecs would I imagine equate to reduced quality given that consumers wouldn't want to pay 20 to 30% more for the same product. the word shrinkflation comes to mind (you know, as with toblerones). that is my polite version of saying I don't quite believe your assertion that brexit and market fluctuation is a price you feel you stoically prepared to pay while selflessly striving to give the noble consumer a better ride. which im afraid leaves me as flummoxed as ever about your assertion that brexit is "a price worth paying". for what? it is as mentioned before a solution looking for a problem. im at a loss as to why you really support it?

 

[Woosh]

well, by analogy, its also about importing chickens washed in chlorine - what i mean is that having to pay much more for Chinese pedelecs would I imagine equate to reduced quality given that consumers wouldn't want to pay 20 to 30% more for the same product.

find me one brexit voters who would be bothered with the chlorinated chicken story. It is one of many stories that both sides use to rubbish the other. The amount of chlorinated chicken that would be imported here is totally insignificant. It's not as if that's the only choice of chicken after brexit. Which High Street chain would proudly claim that they serve up chlorinated chicken?
Again, the Pound is weaker, price of imported goods goes up, consumption of imported goods goes down a little, it's not catastrophic by any means.We have seen inflation peaked at 3%. How many voters do you think will change their mind on brexit because inflation goes up from 2% to 3%?

 

[oldgroaner]

Remainers, just concentrate on winning the heart of the brexiters.
You have a long way to go yet.

Not interested at all, for what use is a heart that supplies oxygenated Blood to a Brain running of Fairy Dust?

Better for all of us that they learn in the only fashion they are capable of

Bitter experience.

A sort of Hard lesson

"Spare the Brexit and spoil the future"

This Brexit nonsense needs discrediting not pandering to, and it's instigators and promoters revealed for what they are and what they stand for.

 

[Woosh]

that is my polite version of saying I don't quite believe your assertion that brexit and market fluctuation is a price you feel you stoically prepared to pay while selflessly striving to give the noble consumer a better ride. which im afraid leaves me as flummoxed as ever about your assertion that brexit is "a price worth paying". for what? it is as mentioned before a solution looking for a problem. im at a loss as to why you really support it?

I support soft brexit as the only practical solution to bring two sides together.
That is a fairly distant position from any stoicism.

 

[anotherkiwi]

From the Express
"
Brexit BONUS: Australia to make it easier for Britons to travel there after EU exit"

What FUN!

They have these little Island holiday camps up in the north for refugees. Kind of basic accommodation, the staff isn't too friendly but hey the weather is great!

 

[Woosh]

Brexiters are protected in that their attitudes align with the 80 Tory 'bastards',without that fascist element in the Tory party then Brexit would be dead in the water.

I think you will be surprised to know that tory grassroot wants TM to handover her PMship to David Davis or Michael Gove and that more than two third of tory MPs are now brexiters.
There is no chance that brexit can be reversed under these conditions.

 

[oldtom]

When you have nothing to barter with, what kind of deals can be achieved?

At this moment, the UK has already lost most of its cards and the other side knows full well it holds all the trumps. We are now further away from achieving any kind of trade deals with any country than we were at the outset of this nonsense.

It has always been the forte of the Civil Service to make things work in all the various departments of state but they have been placed in an impossible position by the stupid MPs who have no clue whatsoever about such matters yet it is the amateurs (MPs) who are fronting these discussions in Brussels.

The civil servants have their hands tied and having nothing to work with, cannot be expected to produce miracles and advise the MPs who, in any event would claim that any deal achieved is purely down to their genius in negotiations. These people are political dunderheads selected by the worst PM in living memory bar one, to front up our side at the secession talks yet it is obvious, even to the most unsophisticated, apolitical watchers that they are simply out of their depth.

The UK is being shamed by this incompetence which, if allowed to run its course, will set back British society 200 years. OG has stated many times that the only way the idiots will learn the lesson on this issue is when the pain really starts to hurt; starts to affect every aspect of daily life from the supermarket shop to the increasing unemployment; the wage stagnation to the fear of dying on a trolley in a hospital corridor. The list of problems is endless and it is precisely because this fascist government had no plan about how to proceed, relying on the oft-repeated cant about ensuring the will of the people is respected, as if that were an excuse for their failure to address properly the massive mistake their political class has made.

This is government irresponsibility and they should be removed from office. They would be out of office now, were it not for doing a shady deal with the Northern Ireland protestant mafia.

Now, the people continue to suffer under a cabal of fascists mixed with religious bigots, all with their self-interests placed before the interests of the decent, hard-working tax-paying class.

Tom

 

[Kudoscycles]

I think you will be surprised to know that tory grassroot wants TM to handover her PMship to David Davis or Michael Gove and that more than two third of tory MPs are now brexiters.
There is no chance that brexit can be reversed under these conditions.

How do you know that '2/3 rds of Tory MP are pro Brexit' ????
KudosDave

 

[oldgroaner]

Here's something to make you smile
"British student's simple device that reduces the weight of washing machines by a third could cut thousands of tonnes of carbon emissions each year"
(Since the weights come to 25 kg adding to shipping costs)
Simply put it uses water filled plastic containers to replace the concrete weights and they are Applying for a Patent.

Having actually had something patented in America, I thought, hang on, this is familiar and easily found this
http://www.google.com.pg/patents/WO2010133511A1?cl=en
here is the relevant text
"[0003] In the state of the art, various solutions are developed for balancing the unbalanced load. Of these, a widely used solution is adding immovable weights to the washing machine thereby increasing its inertia. However, as the immovable weights complicate the transportation of the machine, in some of the embodiments in the state of the art, adding a fluid, mostly water, to the washing machine is suggested. Water is filled in the chambers secured on the tub or the drum. In a group of embodiments, the fluid is added to the washing machine once after the transportation and the same liquid is used continually.

Don't they do patent searches these days? we had lawyers employed by the company to do exactly that.
Imagine the company's embarassment when it discovers the Patent application gets rejected?
And of course you have to ask just how many Washing machines have to be shipped to equate to even one tonne of Carbon Emissions? never mind thousands!!

 

[Woosh]

How do you know that '2/3 rds of Tory MP are pro Brexit' ????
KudosDave

this recent (22-07) analysis of the state of the conservative party on brexit.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/jul/22/david-davis-theresa-may-conservative-leadership

before the EURef:

'Two-thirds of Tory MPs want Britain to quit European Union'
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/jan/09/tory-mps-britain-european-union-eu-brexit

There is plenty more material at the conservative home website.

 

[Mal69]

Not more plastics please, they have been doing damage to the eco structure for too long, Google hormonal conditions and cancers in all sorts of animals, humans and birds and the link to plastics or plastic containers, the amount dumped at sea is disturbing.

Might be early eighties but I think the late seventies, that's when plastics were introduced into food containers, bottles etc etc, the rise of all sorts of conditions from thyroid to cancer has increased, coincidence, maybe not.

I think bulk delivery costs means there are little savings to be made for something weighing 18kg or something that is 25kg, might be wrong on that but I imagine large companies would not see much of a saving compared to the deals they currently strike, maybe if they got them under 10kg, here's a novel idea, a U.K. Company that makes washing machines, televisions, fridges and other products completely in the U.K. British designed using British workers and makes them to such a high standard they are in demand all over the world, hang on it's 2017, that'll never happen.

 

[oldgroaner]

this recent (22-07) analysis of the state of the conservative party on brexit.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/jul/22/david-davis-theresa-may-conservative-leadership

There is plenty more at the conservative home website, plenty of poll data.

Well that was enlightening, wasn't it? I haven't laughed so much in ages.
It's rather like an imaginary scene on the titanic with the Tory Politicians playing musical chairs around a row of sliding sun loungers as the deck disappears at an increasing angle under the waves.

Great stuff: the Monty Python crew would do it better, though.

 

[Woosh]

Well that was enlightening, wasn't it? I haven't laughed so much in ages.
It's rather like an imaginary scene on the titanic with the Tory Politicians playing musical chairs around a row of sliding sun loungers as the deck disappears at an increasing angle under the waves.

Great stuff: the Monty Python crew would do it better, though.

unfortunately, not you nor me but this bunch of less than 100,000 people elects the PM of this country..

 

[Mal69]

They picked a guy who did something gross to a dead pig, that tells me all I need to know about these people, the sooner the class system is gone the better, might take another hundred years but it should go.

P.S. I refer to David Cameron in the above post, I don't know what the other David has done, or if he has done anything, but I'm sure it was just as bad, oh wait he joined the Tory party, it is just as bad.

 

[flecc]

this recent (22-07) analysis of the state of the conservative party on brexit.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/jul/22/david-davis-theresa-may-conservative-leadership

before the EURef:

'Two-thirds of Tory MPs want Britain to quit European Union'
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/jan/09/tory-mps-britain-european-union-eu-brexit

There is plenty more material at the conservative home website.

That's relying on a January 2016 article!

A week is a long time in politics, getting on for two years is ancient history.
.

 

[oldgroaner]

unfortunately, not you nor me but this bunch of less than 100,000 people elects the PM of this country..

Even more unfortunate than that, the Voters, due to some mad self destructive urge, repeatedly hand them the opportunity to do so!