Brexit, for once some facts.
- Thread starter flecc
- Start date
.. don't sound so disappointed, if the outcome is no or very little change in any material way to the status quo , both UK and EU will be better off.
Is OG secretely wishing for brexit to go very wrong?
The word is EXPECTING
But what can you expect when there wasn't really any feeling among the Public to leave the EU till Politicians and the Media rammed it down people's throats, and in the process unleashed a critical response to the way the country is Governed, along the lines if the Government want's it we don't?
If you don't believe that, go back and consult the graph KTM posted, which makes it abundantly clear.
Can anyone name one of the promises made by the leave camp that that will actually come true?
even one?
The Tory party has a proven record of harmful legislation especially where imrovements to the Environment, Safety or People's rights are concerned where they impinge on profit.
Once the Public see that they have been misled again, things don't get better, and their rights and Welfare go downhill, it won't be the EU they blame this time, it will be the people who have pushed for Brexit.
What makes matters worse is the Labour Party has gone along with this farce and now are tarred with the same brush as the Torys.
We were going downhill under these clowns even inside the EU, outside of it this the country will become nothing more than a larger version of a Car Boot Sale.
The Public has quite simply been Mugged by a bunch of crooks on a previously unprecedented scale.
Sadly as the graph shows, they simply fall for the propaganda without bothering to check how truthful it is, so this process is going to be a long slow, and painful decline in living standards, apart of course for the Elite that perpetrated the crime.
I would remind everyone that in times past when the Economy was Booming, the poor starved, and that is the future we face, and the nation is split down the middle, regardless of anything the Government might say to the Contrary.
If you voted for Brexit, suck it up, you lost, etc., etc.
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You may be wrong on this.
there is one thing that tory MPs value above brexit: holding on to power.
If a soft brexit keeps Mrs May in power, guess what we are going to get.
I reckon we'll have a hard brexit with 3 years of transitional arrangement.
That will satisfy both sides long enough until the next election.
They may as well fudge the divorce bill and label some of it as transition bill thus honour is satisfied on both sides.
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Are you really expecting the Tory party to reform and Govern well? even now they are cutting welfare benefits and damaging the NHS.
It really isn't as simple as you suggest.
It may satisfy the leave voters, but not the remain ones, for why should they be satisfied with less rights, EU free movement travel and influence in the future of Europe just to please the Government that wants to run an offshore insignificant little second division (or is it third) backward Tax Haven country?
Why settle for less? are we supposed to be happy about that?
What can they promise us that makes this seem less than a stupid backward step?
Put a name to it!
What's in it for the 48% ? that's the real problem isn't it? any fool can con the 52% and Fools or rather sinister people with an agenda of their own did exactly that leaving us all clutching at straws to make it seem like an opportunity.
The saying goes
"There are no such thing as Problems, only opportunities
But the number of opportunities is becoming a problem"
And who has been pursuing an opportunity to sell arms to the Saudis?
What a fate over the none legally binding Referendum, and a spineless House of Commons .
We are reduced to Gun Running to make ends meet.
No, I expect they'd do anything to cling to power.
Remainers are soft. You give them 3 years of transition to a hard brexit, they'll take the offer.
What offer are you referring to? a transition period wn't change anything simply delay matters as I pointed out.
The end result will be the same.
No, OG, it will be hard brexit. It won't be simple but straightforward for several reasons:
1. The EU is not going to give us an FTA until after brexit, for procedural clarity as much as anything else
2. We can't face the big wide world with so little preparation anyway.
3. The EU needs to prove that the UK is not better of after brexit - that will be true during the transition period.
4. We'll sign several FTAs with other countries in the transition period.
5. The EU will conclude an FTA that will be beneficial to both then, on the Canadian model.
What was true in the transition period needs not remain true after 3 years.
Everyone will claim victory.
Here is a suoerb sample of Murdochs Law when reporting something from the Express
'Proud to be in the UK' Ford backs Brexit declaring giant car firm is STAYING in Britain
INTERNATIONAL car maker Ford has shown its support for Brexit, announcing the company will be in the UK for “quite some time”.
Ford will defy doom-mongers and continue to trade in Britain, despite concerns about the impact of Brexit on the economy.
The US firm has slowly been reducing its manufacturing capacity in Europe and stopped making vehicles in the UK in 2013 after more than 100 years.
“We are very proud to be in the UK and we are going to be in the UK for quite some time but it’s going to be really important, particularly because Article 50 is now triggered, that from our standpoint there needs to be free trade between the UK and the Continent.”
Challenged on whether Ford will continue in the UK, Mr Fields added: “I can’t guarantee anything, nobody can guarantee anything over many, many years.”
In other words he gave absolutely no Guarantee of continuation whatsoever
'Proud to be in the UK' Ford backs Brexit declaring giant car firm is STAYING in Britain
INTERNATIONAL car maker Ford has shown its support for Brexit, announcing the company will be in the UK for “quite some time”.
Ford will defy doom-mongers and continue to trade in Britain, despite concerns about the impact of Brexit on the economy.
The US firm has slowly been reducing its manufacturing capacity in Europe and stopped making vehicles in the UK in 2013 after more than 100 years.
“We are very proud to be in the UK and we are going to be in the UK for quite some time but it’s going to be really important, particularly because Article 50 is now triggered, that from our standpoint there needs to be free trade between the UK and the Continent.”
Challenged on whether Ford will continue in the UK, Mr Fields added: “I can’t guarantee anything, nobody can guarantee anything over many, many years.”
In other words he gave absolutely no Guarantee of continuation whatsoever
The only victor as you outline it is the EU and you have clearly explained what a damn fool move Brexit really is
"We can't face the big wide world with so little preparation anyway"
That is almost right it should read any amount of preparation rather than so little.
Didn't the Idiot in Chief shout no Deal is better than a poor deal? is she suicidal by nature?
that means simply that we deal with one issue at a time.
Brexit will succeed in its own way, less global/integrated more keynesian economy.
... No no no .. the EU will not be a Victor. There aren't any Winners here just degrees of losing. I would like to associate myself with that Spanish mep as posted earlier. Every single one of his sentiments I agree with.
I really cannot see the benefit of demoting ourselves from being a major partner in Europe into being a second class offshore island economy in order to further benefit the rich as being a worthy future for this nation.
What is the point? if we can't get our own way among 28 other nations that are prepared to co-operate with us, then our chances of successfully competing not only with them but the rest of the world must be close to zero.
Brexit will not succeed because the odds are stacked against it and we are governed by one group of incompetents that we can only replace with another group who are equally incompetent.
Sorry but that isn't true as it is a matter of scale, and also the EU have got rid of a deadweight namely us preventing progress.
We have enabled their progress by sacrificing ours on a wager, and gone from major player to subservient client state.
I can't see us slowing down the ascendancy of a reunited Germany at the centre of the EU, at least in my lifetime. They have already overtaken us economically for a number of years, now the French have also overtaken us. With an ageing population and an education system that favours more 'personal development' to the detriment of the basic 4Rs, we won't reverse the trend. It won't be long before we lose our seat at the UN security council. Landwise, we are a small island, our natural resources are nearly exhausted.
Frankly, I think we are better off with brexit, keeping our waters as the principal natural resource.
An end I've long been forecasting, as a country depending on tourism, while attempting to support ourselves from the local food resources.
There are many such countries, and they are all very poor with only low standard service employment for their people and their young emigrating for better lives.
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and our universities.
Our top students are as bright as you can find anywhere else.
... Agreed. There is nothing wrong with your brightest 2% of students, they are the cream of a 60 million population and are just as bright and able as the top few percentage in France or Germany. Or as bright as the top 6% from India or 2% from Brazil etc. . But they then enter into a culture which does not value engineering expertise, manufacturing or agribusiness. How many of the brightest and best move into finance and banking or politics all of which are basically zero sum games?.
What resource? they are fished out and North Sea Oil is on it's last legs! And as the icing on the cake we have scrapped our inshore fishing fleet anyway.
Oh dear!