Brexit, for once some facts.

[Zlatan]

Strategy? what Strategy?
I wasn't aware we even had one, or would that be to make threats, and if there is any opposition pretend it was all a misunderstanding?
Been there, and we've done that.
Why not try something that might work... let's see, how about using

"The old Navajo Indian trick of Screaming and Begging?"

What is this about ? Have you got threads crossed OG ?
Not been away just loads to sort here...hopefully will be spending 10 weeks a year in Caribbean and sorting things from this end..
But back to Topic....
I was lead to believe once Art 50 is triggered our leaving EU is inevitable ? Is that not the case KTM ?? ( I,m not saying you are wrong but "THOUGHT" we now had to leave ???
ps
When I,m working haven't got time to waste putting OG , Tom and KTM straight, but then again nobody has enough time to do that..

 

[Woosh]

So what if the EU has foreign policy and army?? Where is the harm in that?

A country can compel its citizens to take up arms and fight.
I can't see myself fight for the flag on oldtom's avatar.

 

[oldgroaner]

the "we" is currently the house of commons.

Oh Dear, if that is so why are we hearing so much about the illusory "Will of the people?"
The general feeling around Hull is that the reason for the Brexit vote was if the Government wanted it, they didn't to spite them. Great things were promised and expected.
They want what was on the side of the bus and a geat deal more
And really the general mood is that people are not happy with the way things are going, as firstly they were told it was simple and would be quick, release a lot of money into the NHS and now are being told it will all take time,and there is likely to be a big bill as well.
Imigration isn't necessarily going to change and already the Government is "putting the screws" on with welfare and other cuts.
Sorry but the promises that have been made of Better times have got to come true, or we are all in danger.
The people voted for Brexit as they had lost faith in elections to change anything and the referendum seemed like a once in a lifetime opportunity to make things change.
Now it seems change will be for the worse.
Why don't the Politicians realise that Brexit is the Public putting them on Probation, not encouraging them to do their worst?

 

[oldgroaner]

A country can compel its citizens to take up arms and fight.
I can't see myself fight for the flag on oldtom's avatar.

Yet we did just that with the Commonwealth and Empire troops for hundreds of years including the two world wars ,expecting them to do it for "The Mother Country and The Union Jack"

Explain the differerence to me if you can.

 

[Zlatan]

OG
I,ve got another theory as to why Brexit has happened ...The real power players know full well our finances will be better out the EU. The ones pulling the strings who we think aaren,t controlling everything but they are..Not the powerless fascists or the anti immigration mob or the Farages. Not them but the ones with real money power and persuasion...

 

[Zlatan]

Yet we did just that with the Commonwealth and Empire troops for hundreds of years including the two world wars ,expecting them to do it for "The Mother Country and The Union Jack"

Explain the differerence to me if you can.

You are off the wall again again. Just take a deep breath before you post...read the post again and try and think.. Have a go OG, surprise us.

 

[oldgroaner]

What is this about ? Have you got threads crossed OG ?
Not been away just loads to sort here...hopefully will be spending 10 weeks a year in Caribbean and sorting things from this end..
But back to Topic....
I was lead to believe once Art 50 is triggered our leaving EU is inevitable ? Is that not the case KTM ?? ( I,m not saying you are wrong but "THOUGHT" we now had to leave ???
ps
When I,m working haven't got time to waste putting OG , Tom and KTM straight, but then again nobody has enough time to do that..

I think you are correct on that,as that would require more mental agility than you could summon to the task, even if you had temporarily made your mind up about something without contradicting yourself.

 

[KTM Bike Industries UK]

A country can compel its citizens to take up arms and fight.
I can't see myself fight for the flag on oldtom's avatar.

Do you think they'd want you to?

I think if there was a EU army it would be made up from the individual national armies, much like the UN peace keeping force is. I don't suspect they'll be looking at the eBike industry in the UK for their sign up.

 

[oldgroaner]

You are off the wall again again. Just take a deep breath before you post...read the post again and try and think.. Have a go OG, surprise us.

What are you on about? I have simply reported historical fact, and you call that off the wall?
Were you out in the sun a bit too long?

 

[KTM Bike Industries UK]

I was lead to believe once Art 50 is triggered our leaving EU is inevitable ? Is that not the case KTM ?? ( I,m not saying you are wrong but "THOUGHT" we now had to leave ???

Your thought's are incorrect. We can back out of A50 whenever we want as long as everyone agrees, and as it'd be us wanting to, and the EU doesn't want us to leave in the first place, there would be no issue with us changing out minds. Nothing is inevitable in politics.

Edited.

Just to add - clearly no one really knows, but its certain, that A50 doesn't set in stone we have to leave, its just us stating our intention that we want to.

"
Professor Catherine Barnard, senior fellow at The UK in a Changing Europe, said: “The answer is no-one knows because the Article does not make this clear and it has never been tested before but most lawyers think once triggered the Article 50 process can be reversed."

 

[oldgroaner]

OG
I,ve got another theory as to why Brexit has happened ...The real power players know full well our finances will be better out the EU. The ones pulling the strings who we think aaren,t controlling everything but they are..Not the powerless fascists or the anti immigration mob or the Farages. Not them but the ones with real money power and persuasion...

You mean think THEIR FINANCES not OUR FINANCES will be better off.
I'll agree to that.
Brexit is not being pushed or done for the benefit of the people.

 

[flecc]

A country can compel its citizens to take up arms and fight.
I can't see myself fight for the flag on oldtom's avatar.

We already did in World War 2, declaring war on Germany in support of the countries of Europe.

And if someone invades any part of Europe, we will again as a part of Nato. So if you were eligible for military service, you'd have to fight too, whether under the Union flag or the Flag of Europe.
.

 

[Zlatan]

Your thought's are incorrect. We can back out of A50 whenever we want as long as everyone agrees, and as it'd be us wanting to, and the EU doesn't want us to leave in the first place, there would be no issue with us changing out minds. Nothing is inevitable in politics.

Edited.

Just to add - clearly no one really knows, but its certain, that A50 doesn't set in stone we have to leave, its just us stating our intention that we want to.

"
Professor Catherine Barnard, senior fellow at The UK in a Changing Europe, said: “The answer is no-one knows because the Article does not make this clear and it has never been tested before but most lawyers think once triggered the Article 50 process can be reversed."

Is that sort of like they thought result was wrong; only advisory; misplaced; anti democratic or a whole raft of things ?
But seriously can we withdraw Art 50 ? I thought not ?? Yes it might not be decree nisi but you,ve caught misis in bed with post man..paid the lawyers, looking for pastures new..and filed for divorce..not final but don't hold your breath KTM..

 

[KTM Bike Industries UK]

Is that sort of like they thought result was wrong; only advisory; misplaced; anti democratic or a whole raft of things ?
But seriously can we withdraw Art 50 ? I thought not ?? Yes it might not be decree nisi but you,ve caught misis in bed with post man..paid the lawyers, looking for pastures new..and filed for divorce..not final but don't hold your breath KTM..

are you ok?

 

[Zlatan]

are you ok?

No. I,m still weeping..

OG...Benefit of the people ??? You are really naive OG...your people's champion Tony Blair or Cameron or Major ?? Or Junkers perhaps...you really have been conned..but don't worry I,ve checked. There is a co op in Whitby, you can freewheel all way down from Fylingdales and show your wares in window when country isn't on its last legs ir Farage isn't spouting a little tash, going around breaking chandeliers...you,ll have to be quick tho OG...manager is expecting a big demand for space in his window over next couple if years...Old Tom and KTM will be alongside you...I,ll pop up and have a good gawp at all three of you..
He says you can wear your flat cap but nowt else..is that all reight chuck..
err what a vision....

 

[oldgroaner]

No. I,m still weeping..

OG...Benefit of the people ??? You are really naive OG...your people's champion Tony Blair or Cameron or Major ?? Or Junkers perhaps...you really have been conned..but don't worry I,ve checked. There is a co op in Whitby, you can freewheel all way down from Fylingdales and show your wares in window when country isn't on its last legs ir Farage isn't spouting a little tash, going around breaking chandeliers...you,ll have to be quick tho OG...manager is expecting a big demand for space in his window over next couple if years...Old Tom and KTM will be alongside you...I,ll pop up and have a good gawp at all three of you..
He says you can wear your flat cap but nowt else..is that all reight chuck..
err what a vision....

It look's like I was right about you having too much sun[emoji1]

Sent from my XT1032 using Tapatalk

 

[Woosh]

Yet we did just that with the Commonwealth and Empire troops for hundreds of years including the two world wars ,expecting them to do it for "The Mother Country and The Union Jack"

Explain the differerence to me if you can.

It seems that in recent history, wars are fought by proxies with the big boys supplying weapons to the ones who do the fighting. If the big boys start to get directly involved, they would use remote systems such as drones, long range rockets and high flying bombers.
It follows from that observation that the bigger the military might, the more belligerent the country is.
If the EU has its own army, it will be likely because Germany, France and Italy want to pool their armies leading to a might that is beyond our current comprehension.
Do we want to see a new military empire? I should think not.
And yet, that's within the scope of the EU's destination.

 

[KTM Bike Industries UK]

Do we want to see a new military empire?

You might have answered your own question.

I wonder which countries would like to see a smaller, not as organised europe.... maybe Russia, maybe China, maybe the USA.

Now who do we think might have funded and supported Brexit, and made us think it was for our own good?

 

[oldgroaner]

It seems that in recent history, wars are fought by proxies with the big boys supplying weapons to the ones who do the fighting. If the big boys start to get directly involved, they would use remote systems such as drones, long range rockets and high flying bombers.
It follows from that observation that the bigger the military might, the more belligerent the country is.
If the EU has its own army, it will be likely because Germany, France and Italy want to pool their armies leading to a might that is beyond our current comprehension.
Do we want to see a new military empire? I should think not.
And yet, that's within the scope of the EU's destination.

And this is one of the prime reasons we should have stayed in the EU as we could have worked against that very thing happening... and now?
We can only watch and hope that Military Force isn't used against us.
What a Brilliant strategic decision.. the very thing we have always fought against Military Hegemony on the other side of the Channel, and it is our fault that the main impediment (us) to this happening, has taken it's ball home and left them to it.
Another stupid outcome of Brexit.

 

[oldgroaner]

You might have answered your own question.

I wonder which countries would like to see a smaller, not as organised europe.... maybe Russia, maybe China, maybe the USA.

Now who do we think might have funded and supported Brexit, and made us think it was for our own good?

Difficult one that..........NOT