Brexit, for once some facts.

[Zlatan]

I hate to say it, but Britain's doing OK. Even Germany envies us...

For diehard Remoaners like me, all this endless good news about jabs and carbon emissions is pretty hard to take

www.theguardian.com

It's written for OG and Flecc. Brilliant... And in Starmer’s Guardian..
Frothing remoaners...!!!
And from Ed Cummings. I had to break my exile to share the thought. Going back now.
Who emboldened Polly? He, s got rather vocal lately.
Think I, ll just repost the article for OG to reread every now and then. Or pop it in Co op window for him to read at his leisure.

 

[Nev]

it's the other way round.

No JHC I think is correct, from memory that Scottish trial showed that the AZ was slightly more effective at reducing hospitalisations than the Pfizer one.

It had not yet been peer reviewed so I think we need to wait for more information, but I am not too bothered which one is slightly better. They are both excellent at reducing the chance of people becoming seriously ill and having to go into hospital.

 

[oldgroaner]

Boris Johnson is a one world government puppet

And which one world would that be?

 

[Zlatan]

And which one world would that be?

Come on OG, even I, ve read that conspiracy. Google "New World Order". Bill Gates is operating a massive eugenics programme with plans to be World chief poobar aided and abetted by pharma companies putting tracking devices in vaccines. Makes total sense. Boris is playing a sort of Petain roll setting up a puppet government here. Seems we have a few believers. Polly, Agnew and Suzan? How do folks minds work? World has gone mad.
Its more believable than Ed Cummings applauding Tories in Guardian. Now that is unbelievable

 

[oldgroaner]

I hate to say it, but Britain's doing OK. Even Germany envies us...

For diehard Remoaners like me, all this endless good news about jabs and carbon emissions is pretty hard to take

www.theguardian.com

It's written for OG and Flecc. Brilliant... And in Starmer’s Guardian..
Frothing remoaners...!!!
And from Ed Cummings. I had to break my exile to share the thought. Going back now.
Who emboldened Polly? He, s got rather vocal lately.
Think I, ll just repost the article for OG to reread every now and then. Or pop it in Co op window for him to read at his leisure.

First, welcome back! second
Mt wife just received a long over due notice
"Government guidance for clinically vulnerable people"
Which contains a line that demonstrates their lack of faith in the efficiency of vaccines to protect her.
"Even if they have had both vaccination doses, they should continue to follow these shielding measures as we continue to assess the impact of vaccination among all groups"

And of course this has emerged

Antibody Test for IgG
This test detects IgG antibodies that develop in most patients within seven to 10 days after symptoms of COVID-19 begin. IgG antibodies remain in the blood after an infection has passed. These antibodies indicate that you may have had COVID-19 in the recent past and have developed antibodies that may protect you from future infection. It is unknown at this point how much protection antibodies might provide against reinfection.

Be careful what you gloat about Zlatan, this is not a football match, and we are at risk as I have said all along with this interference with the dosing period

 

[oyster]

pharma companies putting tracking devices in vaccines

They just don't know whether to put five, six or seven in a vial of Pfizer vaccine...

(I actually suspect that "they" could reached more people with trackers by putting them into McD, KFC, etc., food than the vaccines.)

 

[Zlatan]

First, welcome back! second
Mt wife just received a long over due notice
"Government guidance for clinically vulnerable people"
Which contains a line that demonstrates their lack of faith in the efficiency of vaccines to protect her.
"Even if they have had both vaccination doses, they should continue to follow these shielding measures as we continue to assess the impact of vaccination among all groups"

And of course this has emerged

Antibody Test for IgG
This test detects IgG antibodies that develop in most patients within seven to 10 days after symptoms of COVID-19 begin. IgG antibodies remain in the blood after an infection has passed. These antibodies indicate that you may have had COVID-19 in the recent past and have developed antibodies that may protect you from future infection. It is unknown at this point how much protection antibodies might provide against reinfection.

Be careful what you gloat about Zlatan, this is not a football match, and we are at risk as I have said all along with this interference with the dosing period

Agreed, make allowances for my poor attempts at humour.
I see your point but suspect its more a logistics issue and delayed immune response. We have vaccinated 20 million folk (single dose), at about a rate of 2. 5 million per week. 3 week delay for any worthwhile protection means at moment we only have about 13 million with any protection. That's around 20% of population and since even those can still catch it and spread it its not surprising advice. Common sense really.

 

[oyster]

First, welcome back! second
Mt wife just received a long over due notice
"Government guidance for clinically vulnerable people"
Which contains a line that demonstrates their lack of faith in the efficiency of vaccines to protect her.
"Even if they have had both vaccination doses, they should continue to follow these shielding measures as we continue to as of vaccination assess the impact of vaccination among all groups"

And of course this has emerged

Antibody Test for IgG
This test detects IgG antibodies that develop in most patients within seven to 10 days after symptoms of COVID-19 begin. IgG antibodies remain in the blood after an infection has passed. These antibodies indicate that you may have had COVID-19 in the recent past and have developed antibodies that may protect you from future infection. It is unknown at this point how much protection antibodies might provide against reinfection.

Be careful what you gloat about Zlatan, this is not a football match, and we are at risk as I have said all along with this interference with the dosing period

Is IgG a good measure of effectiveness against Covid-19? Both of its ability to protect from infection and to minimise severity?

 

[Jesus H Christ]

it's the other way round.

No.

 

[oldgroaner]

Agreed, make allowances for my poor attempts at humour.
I see your point but suspect its more a logistics issue and delayed immune response. We have vaccinated 20 million folk (single dose), at about a rate of 2. 5 million per week. 3 week delay for any worthwhile protection means at moment we only have about 13 million with any protection. That's around 20% of population and since even those can still catch it and spread it its not surprising advice. Common sense really.

What is a worry is that there are liable to be some recipients of the warning notice to say, "well if I still can't go out after having the second jab, what's the point of having it? I'll just wait for the lockdown to end."
The author of the document should have stressed the need to have that second shot and detailed the reason why.

 

[oldgroaner]

Is IgG a good measure of effectiveness against Covid-19? Both of its ability to protect from infection and to minimise severity?

Lets say it's far better than an Ouija board, but not by a convincing enough margin to be really reliable.
Let's reduce that
"Dunno" (and neither does anyone else)

 

[flecc]

AZ is around 94% effective and PB around 85% effective against hospitalisation. That’s according to a study by Public Health Scotland.

The Scottish samples were far too small for that conclusion to be anything other than jab promoting propaganda. No bad thing to promote having the jab, but it doesn't warrant promoting these as scientifically reliable figures. They aren't.
.

 

[Nev]

A neighbour of mine in his early 60s caught Covid a few weeks ago. He is a retired mental health nurse, very fit does a lot of cycling and walking. He started getting a strange cough which felt different to a normal cold, caused him to cough a couple of times every 10 mins or so. He didn't think anything of it, but his daughter suggested he have a test just in case.

It came back positive, he was very surprised, anyway he isolated for 10 days, cough disappeared, he felt fine. He did not have any aches or pains or head aches.

A couple of days after coming out of isolation he went on his usual 15 mile cycle ride and was a minute slower than he normally does it in. He felt fine, and considered himself lucky, but also wondered if Covid had been rather over played.

I was talking to him last Friday and asked if he was still feeling fine, he told me no. That he was now feeling really lethargic had not been on the bike for over a week and even short walks were leaving him out of breath. He is now really worried that he might be suffering from long Covid.

I told him to find the latest Horizon programme on line that showed one day last week. There was a section on long covid in it. It mentioned that several people who had either very mild or virtually no symptoms from Covid still needed to take things very easy for up to a month after having the disease. Failure to do so was resulting in some people experiencing long covid type symptoms.

 

[oyster]

A neighbour of mine in his early 60s caught Covid a few weeks ago. He is a retired mental health nurse, very fit does a lot of cycling and walking. He started getting a strange cough which felt different to a normal cold, caused him to cough a couple of times every 10 mins or so. He didn't think anything of it, but his daughter suggested he have a test just in case.

It came back positive, he was very surprised, anyway he isolated for 10 days, cough disappeared, he felt fine. He did not have any aches or pains or head aches.

A couple of days after coming out of isolation he went on his usual 15 mile cycle ride and was a minute slower than he normally does it in. He felt fine, and considered himself lucky, but also wondered if Covid had been rather over played.

I was talking to him last Friday and asked if he was still feeling fine, he told me no. That he was now feeling really lethargic had not been on the bike for over a week and even short walks were leaving him out of breath. He is now really worried that he might be suffering from long Covid.

I told him to find the latest Horizon programme on line that showed one day last week. There was a section on long covid in it. It mentioned that several people who had either very mild or virtually no symptoms from Covid still needed to take things very easy for up to a month after having the disease. Failure to do so was resulting in some people experiencing long covid type symptoms.

Here's a post I prepared earlier (for another place!):

Last night (Thursday 25/02/2021) there was a program on BBC2.

Horizon
2021: Coronavirus Special - What We know Now

In this third Horizon special, Dr Chris Van Tulleken is joined by his brother Xand and Dr Guddi Singh to take us through the latest developments and answer current concerns.

Though the effect of the coronavirus pandemic has been devastating to many, the team reveal the breakthroughs in genetics, medicine and modelling that have provided a way out of this situation and given hope and confidence that, in the event of a future pandemic, we can take it on and win.

The reason for posting is nothing to do with Covid-19 and the virus! It is everything to do with a short interview with Dr David Strain of University of Exeter Medical School who is the BMA's lead on the NHS's long Covid task force.

Specifically the references to CFS/ME.

The interview starts at: 43:02
The CFS/ME bit starts at: 47:00
Ends: 48:20

https://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/m000slmx/horizon-2021-coronavirus-special-what-we-know-now

 

[Jesus H Christ]

The Scottish samples were far too small for that conclusion to be anything other than jab promoting propaganda. No bad thing to promote having the jab, but it doesn't warrant promoting these as scientifically reliable figures. They aren't.
.

You may resist acknowledging how good the AZ vaccine is, but it’s futile. It’s a very affective vaccine across all age groups.

 

[flecc]

You may resist acknowledging how good the AZ vaccine is, but it’s futile. It’s a very affective vaccine across all age groups.

You're right there with this Freudian slip, the side effects are very affective.
.

 

[oyster]

You're right there with this Freudian slip, the side effects are very affective.
.

Seasonal Affective Disorder - will resolve as spring really gets going.

 

[Woosh]

Jesus, here is the data of the Scottish study:

https://poseidon01.ssrn.com/delivery.php?ID=510070086111087083119116010089017117020035053080091016022060003104044053017124072017079085047094109121094012070070087027000001071018121087098055116097127084017071009101124005067042019086101103059037104107057085067065001069098001026016001096026092017106124119007008119107092069083009008069070&EXT=pdf&INDEX=TRUE

Read the table 2 on page 2.
for the 42+ days group, they only had the Pfizer vaccine. Vaccine Effect is 64%.
Of course if they had two doses, that number would be about 90%-95%.

Talking about selective quote 'peak Vaccine Effect' at 3 weeks, not 42+ days vaccine effect.


Someone has already looked at this:
E Daisy ALARICUS • 19 hours ago
It doesn't make sense to me why in Table 2, vaccine effectiveness for the 42 days+ cohort is 58% for the overall population and 64% for the Pfizer population, even though there cohorts are identical (minus 1). Is that a mistake?

 

[Danidl]

The single vaccine shot strategy is really off paying off now. After one dose, the AZ vaccine is proving to be slightly more effective at preventing hospitalisation than the PB vaccine. AZ is around 94% effective and PB around 85% effective against hospitalisation. That’s according to a study by Public Health Scotland. Both figures are fantastic.

Germany is currently struggling with its third wave of Covid yet they are sat on a stock of AZ vaccine they are refusing to use. They’ve only protected their citizens with less than 300000 doses of AZ. Appalling.

The problem they now face is that out of political spite, the leadership in the EU has publicly and clearly rubbished the AZ vaccine’s reputation. This is most likely because the AZ vaccine has the UKs fingerprints on it and they don’t want to be seen as reliant on, or giving credit to the U.K.

I think the EUs childish behaviour will have an adverse affect on vaccine uptake, particularly with the AZ vaccine. This is going to slow the already dismal vaccination programme administered in the EU. Silly people.

I am tempted to quote your pal Polly!!. . But I will refrain an confine myself to FACTs. The reduction in hospital admissions in the UK is very welcome and due mainly to the Pfizer vaccine. Why?. Because the AZ has not been in use long enough for its effectiveness to have affected the statistics significantly..
At no stage have any EU personnel rubbished the AZ vaccine. What you are stating as fact is selected quotations in a UK redtop papers ,not what was actually said. Unfortunately there are redtop papers in Germany also, which are even more rightwing than the UK versions, and they are parroting and regurgitating the British tabloids
The strategy of disregarding the designers protocol of the double jab at the specific 21 day interval, remains an extremely dangerous experiment, The Israeli data confirms the wisdom of the original protocols, and the reduction in protection as a single dose wanes.
We don't have warehouses full of the AZ vaccine waiting ,unwanted and unused...they were missing when we went for them ..see back only 3 weeks ago. Any AZ vaccine is being injected into health care workers, front line staff eg anyone below 60 , for which evidence data of efficiency and efficacy exists. We showed shipments arriving in Ireland as the first shipment about 10 days ago.

 

[sjpt]

The Scottish samples were far too small for that conclusion to be anything other than jab promoting propaganda. No bad thing to promote having the jab, but it doesn't warrant promoting these as scientifically reliable figures. They aren't.

How big were the Scottish samples? I would expect any 'real world' sample numbers to be quite a bit bigger than numbers from trails. The data would almost certainly be less scientifically collected than the data collected in a formal trial, so larger numbers would be needed for the same overall reliability.