Brexit, for once some facts.

Danidl

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That's fine flecc. Personally feel much happier vaccine is getting rolled out and do think we, ll got on top of this now. Wasn't convinced before... And I, m thankful daughter got her first jab... Could have been so different... Had government stuck to 3 week delay I doubt she'd have had vaccination. So, in a way thanks to all those waiting patiently for second jab..
I, ve been pleasantly surprised infection rate went down so quickly but I, m afraid with all calls to open society up before we, ve actually got hold of this will lead to another wave. Doesn't seem to have to be much good news before some business leader is calling to open pubs etc etc. There doesn't seem to be enough folk calling for "let's just get on top of this fully"... Its more "oh, we, ve had under 20k infections today, when are pubs opening"... Wrong attitude IMO..Think that's more dangerous than vaccine strategy.
Fully agree with you. The only good Covid strategy is zero Covid. If the double jab at the RECOMMENDED interval works to reduce fatality rates and also reduces the infection rates..even if not super at this , bring it on;!!!. The Israeli are also suggesting they have aa treatment for existing infections which seems to work..which is also very good news.
 

Danidl

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I asked my wife today if she knew of anyone in her area that had been given the vaccine and had died sometime later. She said yes she knew of two people. Both of them were in their 80s but a few weeks after getting the vaccine they both died. Cause of death was said to be Covid, I don't think either of these deaths was reported either nationally or locally.

All NHS staff have been warned about posting things about Covid on social media or about talking to media so I will not be going into great detail about all this as I would not want her to get into trouble with her employers. What I would say is that we do not live in an area with huge populations, so if she is aware of two people dying of Covid after having the vaccine then I would imagine this is happening all over the country.

Having said all this when I get the chance to have the vaccine I will certainly take it, but I suspect some information about deaths of people from Covid who have had the vaccine are being kept quiet.

If we think about it I am sure I have read the AZ vaccine is only around 50 to 60% effective after the first dose so it stands to reason that people will go on to catch the virus even after getting the vaccine, and some of those are likely to go on and die.

The trials only had a few hundred over 65s taking part we are now vaccinating millions of them, so some deaths are almost certain to take place.
With respect, many people in their 80 s will have metabolisms just basically ticking over and it takes very little to drive them over the edge.. and that may even include even the relatively benign effects of a vaccination .
 

oyster

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Having said all this when I get the chance to have the vaccine I will certainly take it, but I suspect some information about deaths of people from Covid who have had the vaccine are being kept quiet.
Which, if (or rather, when) it leaks out actually undermines our faith in the vaccines.
 

oldgroaner

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Which, if (or rather, when) it leaks out actually undermines our faith in the vaccines.
Once again the government has made promises above and beyond what is reasonably attainable.
They are following the good old Maxim if at first you don't succeed try hiding the evidence ,but if that doesn't work
Find something else to confuse the public with
 
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Zlatan

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Nov 26, 2016
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They asked her when she thinks she will have her shot.
"I don't actually know"
Rather a telling indictment.
But I suppose our Europhiles will tell her jab is useless so don't worry,whilst awaiting their own second jab.
 
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oldgroaner

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Fully agree with you. The only good Covid strategy is zero Covid. If the double jab at the RECOMMENDED interval works to reduce fatality rates and also reduces the infection rates..even if not super at this , bring it on;!!!. The Israeli are also suggesting they have aa treatment for existing infections which seems to work..which is also very good news.
Logical point of view would be the best option is likely to be the inhalable chemical treatment that kills the virus on the spot immediately denying it the time to mutate
Used in conjunction with vaccinations we should be able to wipe it off the face of the Earth at least temporarily
 

oldgroaner

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Nov 15, 2015
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They asked her when she thinks she will have her shot.
"I don't actually know"
Rather a telling indictment.
But I suppose our Europhiles will tell her jab is useless so don't worry,whilst awaiting their own second jab.
Will you never give up on this anti-eu campaign of yours? I don't know when I'm going to have my second shot, is that the fault of the EU as well?
And are you in a position to tell me I can be absolutely sure of getting a level of protection that will save my life if until I have that second job?
From the start I've been saying there is no such guarantee, and more and more evidence is indicating that is actually the case
 
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oyster

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Logical point of view would be the best option is likely to be the inhalable chemical treatment that kills the virus on the spot immediately denying it the time to mutate
Used in conjunction with vaccinations we should be able to wipe it off the face of the Earth at least temporarily
Except that at least one inhalable substance is based on iodine. And has pronounced effects on thyroid hormone levels.

I know many would be pretty much unaffected, but there seems to be no realistic way of identifying in advance those who are likely to have problems.

Many might tolerate one dose, but if they have to repeat and repeat, it is likely more and more will end up with problems.
 

Woosh

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But I suppose our Europhiles will tell her jab is useless so don't worry,whilst awaiting their own second jab.
I like the idea of Europe and dislike the machinery at Brussels.
Does it make me a hypocrite?
 

Zlatan

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Will you never give up on this anti-eu campaign of yours? I don't know when I'm going to have my second shot, is that the fault of the EU as well?
And are you in a position to tell me I can be absolutely sure of getting a level of protection that will save my life if until I have that second job?
From the start I've been saying there is no such guarantee, and more and more evidence is indicating that is actually the case
Not me making decision OG, and no nobody can guarantee anything. Folk still die even after 2nd jab... But thanks, your second jab probably saved my daughter from being severely ill. Which sums up precisely situation we are in. You getting your second jab on time would have meant others in vulnerable or demanding situations go about their business with zero protection.
As for anti EU sentiment, no I was not at all. They have managed that on their own.
Screenshot_20210208_095050.jpgScreenshot_20210208_095050.jpg
 
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Zlatan

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I like the idea of Europe and dislike the machinery at Brussels.
Does it make me a hypocrite?
Ask OG, he's an expert in this field. (and every other)
BTW we are still in Europe. I love Europe. See myself as European. So if you are, so am I.
 

flecc

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Oct 25, 2006
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They may be the luckiest ones and indeed are more likely to be with the latest news.

Getting their jabs later makes it likely theirs will be fully effective against the resistant new strains. Not only that, many of the newer vaccines are likely to be single dose for full effectiveness so less hassle.

Meanwhile like nearly all of us they are at very little risk from Covid-19 if they follow the precautions.
.
 

Danidl

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Not me making decision OG, and no nobody can guarantee anything. Folk still die even after 2nd jab... But thanks, your second jab probably saved my daughter from being severely ill. Which sums up precisely situation we are in. You getting your second jab on time would have meant others in vulnerable or demanding situations go about their business with zero protection.
As for anti EU sentiment, no I was not at all. They have managed that on their own.
View attachment 40667View attachment 40667
Zlatan, very few people in the UK have been immunised , and even less in the EU. That is the fact. These are 2 sequenced jabs not single jabs. Would you ay you had been fed when you went to a banquet and had just got the soup course.?
 

oldgroaner

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Ask OG, he's an expert in this field. (and every other)
BTW we are still in Europe. I love Europe. See myself as European. So if you are, so am I.
For some reason an image of the worm Ouruboros springs to mind:D
I have never claimed to be an expert just to be an independent thinker ,you should try it sometime .Of course it might blow the odd fuse here and there ,and unlike some occasionally I get things right :D
 
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oyster

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Nov 7, 2017
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When it comes to the EU's performance re vaccines, I think it interesting (even if utterly futile) to consider what might have happened without brexit.

If the UK is so well respected and competent in this regard, perhaps the best parts of the UK implementation could have been achieved across the whole of the EU? Resulting in even greater levels of vaccination by now - and better availability for the rest of the world into the future.
 

Danidl

Esteemed Pedelecer
Sep 29, 2016
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They asked her when she thinks she will have her shot.
"I don't actually know"
Rather a telling indictment.
But I suppose our Europhiles will tell her jab is useless so don't worry,whilst awaiting their own second jab.
Zlatan, that is close to insane. Read the article. What she really said is ... I am a resident here in Belgium, I will be informed by the Belgian health authorities of when 62 year olds get vaccinated,and I am not jumping the que.. I would expect others to do the same.
 

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