Brexit, for once some facts.

[oldtom]

the best course would be for brexiters to call a second referendum, and the question will be: do you want real brexit?

That's a fair point Trex!

On reflection, it may have been better to postpone the referendum till there was a plan or two in place. Perhaps, two or three scenarios from which to select would have attracted more sensible responses?

Really, none of us should have the right to exercise our vote in such a way on a major issue without all the facts laid out plainly prior to the event. That no-one from the proponents of 'Brexit' ever explained any of the information that has come to light since the referendum is almost criminal. What we are faced with now seems to me like booking into Dignitas at Zürich when all that's wrong with you is a touch of flu.

Tom

 

[oldtom]

What do members think of my brilliant idea,should I suggest it to Hammond???
KudosDave

I love it Dave! Better still, find yourself an agent and a marginal seat somewhere and stand as an independent.

Tom

 

[flecc]

BREXIT TAX.
We should add 2% to all forms of taxation....income tax,capital gains tax,vat,corporation tax,booze and fag tax,petrol duty,green taxes etc etc,we should take 2% out of all benefit payments,out of pension payments etc etc.
This money should be given directly to the NHS,not filtered by any government black hole.

No. The NHS is incredibly inefficient, wasting vast sums of money. This would just make it even easier for them to squander more.
.

 

[anotherkiwi]

What the EU got wrong about fishing:

As I have said the EU has gotten some things wrong and one that bugs me and which is in relation to the fishing thing is "modernising" the European fleet. Basically they subsidised the destruction of small traditional wooden fishing boats. This had for immediate effect the change to larger trawlers from the traditional line fishing boats here in the Basque Country.

As well as the effect on stocks the other negative effects are:

- quality of fish coming to market. Fish caught in nets stress more releasing hormones into the flesh and they are bruised by being crushed together when removed from the water. You can actually taste the difference.
- removing wooden boats destroyed jobs on the shore, wooden boats require regular maintenance.
- less secure boats. Of course if you go onto the hard with a wooden boat the hull will be breached more easily than with steel. But wooden boats don't catch fire like plastic or even metal boats, we had a recent death here on a GRP boat that burnt so quickly one man didn't get off in time.

Sorry to go on about this but it is related to the EU and your current sorry state of affairs, and living in a fishing port it is important to me too.

 

[Kudoscycles]

No. The NHS is incredibly inefficient, wasting vast sums of money. This would just make it even easier for them to squander more.
.

Flecc....but you are forgeting the people voted,we must uphold the will of the people and our government are going to deliver on Brexit....Brexit means Brexit and we are going to make a success of it,Commissar May has decreed it....I cannot see how we are going to support Boris's £18billion pledge without digging in our pockets. No Brexiter would be against it,after all that is what he voted for.
KudosDave

 

[Kudoscycles]

The Nissan deal revealed so much about where the governments negotiations are headed,its a million miles away from May's speech at the Tory conference.
The following lifted from the FT says it all,the Nissan deal pretty much guaranteed we are staying in the customs union or maybe even the full single market,but where does that leave immigration control???

Say, for argument’s sake, that the UK chooses a hard Brexit with no transitional regime. Nissan would then surely have to reverse last week’s decision. There would be no industrial logic in expanding its UK car production capacity in this scenario.

So if you want Nissan and other manufacturing companies to expand in the UK, the only option is to remain in the single market — either as part of a permanent deal or as part of an interim one with an extended transition period. In the case of a car company, that period would have to exceed the life cycle of vehicle model — five to 10 years. During that period the EU will ask the UK to respect free movement of labour and abide by rulings of the European Court of Justice.

And,I expect,continue making EU contributions,which because of the weakness of the £ v the Euro have now gone up by £2.5 billion.

KudosDave

 

[oldgroaner]

What the EU got wrong about fishing:

As I have said the EU has gotten some things wrong and one that bugs me and which is in relation to the fishing thing is "modernising" the European fleet. Basically they subsidised the destruction of small traditional wooden fishing boats. This had for immediate effect the change to larger trawlers from the traditional line fishing boats here in the Basque Country.

As well as the effect on stocks the other negative effects are:

- quality of fish coming to market. Fish caught in nets stress more releasing hormones into the flesh and they are bruised by being crushed together when removed from the water. You can actually taste the difference.
- removing wooden boats destroyed jobs on the shore, wooden boats require regular maintenance.
- less secure boats. Of course if you go onto the hard with a wooden boat the hull will be breached more easily than with steel. But wooden boats don't catch fire like plastic or even metal boats, we had a recent death here on a GRP boat that burnt so quickly one man didn't get off in time.

Sorry to go on about this but it is related to the EU and your current sorry state of affairs, and living in a fishing port it is important to me too.

Just one problem with that theory of yours, I live in Hull and we had the most modern and one of the biggest stern fishing trawler fleets, to get enough fish for it we had to go to Bear island and the Cod wars ended that.
Now all we have left are the old fashioned small wood and steel boats, GRP never caught on on the East Coast as it is too fragile.
And our fleet of wooden Cobles are disappearing fast as they fail through extreme old age, and lack of skilled people to make more.
Great sea boats,mind. Times around here are so hard that they burn recycled chip frying oil rather than red diesel, and can only go out after Crabs and Scampi most of the year.

 

[oldgroaner]

I shall write a personal letter to the Prime Minister asking for her assurances that I will not personally face any losses incurred by Brexit and cite this Forum thread and my many posts as proof of commitment against it.
That will worry her!
Now I just have to get the other 16 Million odd (and more) to do the same thing.
Power to the people!

 

[Kudoscycles]

I have already written to my MP demanding the same assurancies as Nissan,for I am a employer in a depressed part of Kent and everything I sell is ultimately attached to wheels,sometimes 2 or 4 !!!
KudosDave

 

[Kudoscycles]

We are officially the worst performing currency in the world,behind 150 peers,we are below the Romanian Leu and Colombian Peso....The president of Colombia is in parliament today,do you think he will tel May..... 'yaboo,we're doing better than you!!!'......but you can always rely on a Leaver to see the upside............

Typical remainer gloom and doom!
May be Pound sterling is the worst performing currency in the world in October 2016.
But let's have a look at the whole year. We will see that Pound sterling is not at all the worst performing currency in the world. It's the 3rd worst currency, even better than the Mozambique new metical and only a few percent worse than the Angolan kwanza and the Nigerian naira.
Well thats a relief,hehe
KudosDave

 

[derf]

We are officially the worst performing currency in the world,behind 150 peers,we are below the Romanian Leu and Colombian Peso....The president of Colombia is in parliament today,do you think he will tel May..... 'yaboo,we're doing better than you!!!'......but you can always rely on a Leaver to see the upside............

Typical remainer gloom and doom!
May be Pound sterling is the worst performing currency in the world in October 2016.
But let's have a look at the whole year. We will see that Pound sterling is not at all the worst performing currency in the world. It's the 3rd worst currency, even better than the Mozambique new metical and only a few percent worse than the Angolan kwanza and the Nigerian naira.
Well thats a relief,hehe
KudosDave

there, as a complete aside, is a blast form the past, I have fond memories of the street markets (and rather astonishing Portuguese coffee), carrying thick disintegrating wads (and paying for a meal of ginormous king prawns with a several hundred) meticals in Maputo. and having an old Russian uaz. life in Africa can be astonishing good. if only the UK could have an ambient temperature rise of ten to twenty C and be surrounded by a tropical ocean I'd say this brexit transformation into a third world country is a lovely thing.

 

[derf]

The Nissan deal revealed so much about where the governments negotiations are headed,its a million miles away from May's speech at the Tory conference.
The following lifted from the FT says it all,the Nissan deal pretty much guaranteed we are staying in the customs union or maybe even the full single market,but where does that leave immigration control???

Say, for argument’s sake, that the UK chooses a hard Brexit with no transitional regime. Nissan would then surely have to reverse last week’s decision. There would be no industrial logic in expanding its UK car production capacity in this scenario.

So if you want Nissan and other manufacturing companies to expand in the UK, the only option is to remain in the single market — either as part of a permanent deal or as part of an interim one with an extended transition period. In the case of a car company, that period would have to exceed the life cycle of vehicle model — five to 10 years. During that period the EU will ask the UK to respect free movement of labour and abide by rulings of the European Court of Justice.

And,I expect,continue making EU contributions,which because of the weakness of the £ v the Euro have now gone up by £2.5 billion.

KudosDave

so, on a bit of a tangent, what to make of carney resisting may and Hammond's pleas to stay
http://news.sky.com/story/mark-carneys-compromise-shows-the-power-held-by-the-governor-10640143
?
one big fat thing that occurs to me is the basis of carney's fame
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Carney#Goldman_Sachs
cutting interest rates in Canada fifty basis points in the mdist of the 08 crisis when others did not. he pre-empted the slowdown and minimised the damage Canada took as a result. now in brexit uk he is doing exactly the same (cutting interest rates) and taking flack from may for it. so shall we trust the bloke with a phd in economics on what's best for the economy or submarine may?

 

[Croxden]

Foreigners coming here cutting our interest rates.....

 

[oldgroaner]

Foreigners coming here cutting our interest rates.....

It's called "Taking Back Control of our Sovereignty"

 

[trex]

Mrs May is playing both sides, after Nissan now Carney staying until June 19.
I wonder how the 4 brexiteers are going to react.
Soon, it will be clear that the level of immigration left to market demands will remain same, brexiters will feel cheated. Remainers also feel cheated. Paying 20% more for imports for what?
What will become of brexit?

 

[oldgroaner]

Mrs May is playing both sides, after Nissan now Carney staying until June 19.
I wonder how the 4 brexiteers are going to react.
Soon, it will be clear that the level of immigration left to market demands will remain same, brexiters will feel cheated. Remainers also feel cheated. Paying 20% more for imports for what?
What will become of brexit?

Mrs May will tell us we have left the EU even though we haven't?
Just get the press to say what she wants it to?
It has after all worked every time so far.

 

[Kudoscycles]

there, as a complete aside, is a blast form the past, I have fond memories of the street markets (and rather astonishing Portuguese coffee), carrying thick disintegrating wads (and paying for a meal of ginormous king prawns with a several hundred) meticals in Maputo. and having an old Russian uaz. life in Africa can be astonishing good. if only the UK could have an ambient temperature rise of ten to twenty C and be surrounded by a tropical ocean I'd say this brexit transformation into a third world country is a lovely thing.

Well that will be good as a developing nation like China (??????) we will have another 10 years to meet our global warming targets,so we can keep our old coal burners going like China (??????).
KudosDave

 

[trex]

As Boris linked deleting EU contributions to increase in NHS funding,the £350 million per week down the side of the big red bus.

apparently, 'written down on the side of a red bus' now means politically 'it's a lie'.

 

[Kudoscycles]

apparently, 'written down on the side of a red bus' now means politically 'it's a lie'.

I think the Liberals have decided to rent the big red bus....will they spray it yellow?
KudosDave

 

[anotherkiwi]

I was reading a short list of the promises made. It seems that 52% of people in the UK believe in Father Christmas and thinks he comes in June now?