Brexit, for once some facts.

[oldtom]

Rule or manage by consent? Might work but I have my doubts, but that can obviously be put down to my own background. I've never subscribed to talking shops - they never seem to get anything done.

You still haven't grasped the power of brainwashing, have you?

From your contributions in this thread, it is patently obvious that your thought processes and reasoning all stem from a one-track mind and you are probably too old now to understand and admit that you were one of those who were successfully manipulated by the masterful, mind-bending training programmes of the British military.

I am reminded very much of the character, General Buck Turgidson, played by George C Scott in the film, 'Dr. Strangelove'.

Tom

 

[flecc]

There's more to it than that: the whole structure of our Parliamentary system stopped being fit for purpose years ago.
It doesn't serve the public as a primary concern, only a Faction that pulls the strings.
A system where most of the elected Politicians have no effective power because their faction is not the most numerous is fatally flawed.
All elected Mp's should share power by an agreed proportion, not be excluded. from it.

There's another aspect too, one that's long concerned me, Select Committees.

The advantages of having those is obvious of course, but there have been disadvantages, the worst of which has been to remove much of the debating of issues in the House of Commons. We've seen that over time reducing MPs roles to that of rubber stamping select committee conclusions instead of over 600 minds examining all the issues. Many MPs have shared my concern about this dilution of their function.

If select committees were flawless it might be ok, but they are far from that, the main problem that they are too often populated by MPs with a bee in their bonnet about the select committee subject and they also tend to gather like minds to form the committee, birds of a feather etc. That doesn't make for good examination of issues

And select committees tend to be led by one person dominating and holding the post for a very long time, Frank Field in the Work and Pensions Committee being re-elected unopposed and Keith Vaz, Home Affairs Committee, who has finally stood down after sex offence allegations are examples of committee domination.

That's not all their failings, the bullying of witnesses is another, but it's enough for now in this post.
.

 

[oldgroaner]

There's another aspect too, one that's long concerned me, Select Committees.

The advantages of having those is obvious of course, but there have been disadvantages, the worst of which has been to remove much of the debating of issues in the House of Commons. We've seen that over time reducing MPs roles to that of rubber stamping select committee conclusions instead of over 600 minds examining all the issues. Many MPs have shared my concern about this dilution of their function.

If select committees were flawless it might be ok, but they are far from that, the main problem that they are too often populated by MPs with a bee in their bonnet about the select committee subject and they also tend to gather like minds to form the committee, birds of a feather etc. That doesn't make for good examination of issues

And select committees tend to be led by one person dominating and holding the post for a very long time, Frank Field in the Work and Pensions Committee being re-elected unopposed and Keith Vaz, Home Affairs Committee, who has finally stood down after sex offence allegations are examples of committtee domination.

That's not all their failings, the bullying of witnesses is another, but it's enough for now in this post.
.

Basically as the Americans say "it sucks!"

Sent from my XT1032 using Tapatalk

 

[Kudoscycles]

My reaction, probably like that of millions of others, on hearing the announcement about the appointment of a new Defence Secretary, was 'who?'

For the benefit of anyone still unfamiliar with Gavin Williamson, the member for South Staffs, here is a brief résumé:

View attachment 21984

So there you have it. Conservative politics in action!

Tom

He will fit well with the Tory right wingers,a clone of Rees-Mogg,they would see him as a guy from the ranks who could be manipulated if pushed into the top job. Perhaps Fallon was too moderate and his exit was manipulated.
Politics is a dirty business.
I read that Hammond is intending a reform of vat,rumour has it that he intends to drag every business into vat,whatever their revenue,that will go down well with white van man,like his NICs U-turn.
KudosDave

 

[oldtom]

After watching the activity round my bird feeders, I'm reminded of just how many variants exist of the tit family. Here are some:



Tom

 

[tillson]

I’ve just seen Harriet Harman’s picture on the front of a newspaper. She was looking very serious. What’s happening? Has Fallon smashed her back door in as well? The man Fallon is a machine.

 

[Steb]

What stops me maki

I’ve just seen Harriet Harman’s picture on the front of a newspaper. She was looking very serious. What’s happening? Has Fallon smashed her back door in as well? The man Fallon is a machine.

What stops me making light of it(and part of me could) is that it's not about sex or gender, more about petty narcissistic abuse of power. May is just fallon in drag. Either of the two care (and think) a very great deal more about what's between their legs than anyone else's lives. Wouldn't want him to make decisions about what happens to anybody elses lives. But don't let that interrupt any political incorrectness.

 

[Kudoscycles]

I’ve just seen Harriet Harman’s picture on the front of a newspaper. She was looking very serious. What’s happening? Has Fallon smashed her back door in as well? The man Fallon is a machine.

She made a very distasteful Jewish joke on This Week.....I must say it was a shock such a joke coming from such a learned lady. She was trying to explain concept but it all came out badly.
KudosDave

 

[oldgroaner]

I’ve just seen Harriet Harman’s picture on the front of a newspaper. She was looking very serious. What’s happening? Has Fallon smashed her back door in as well? The man Fallon is a machine.

No, what happened is that she tried to make a point by saying she had previously complained about a particular holocaust Joke and then repeated it, presumably to point out it was in bad taste, and should be avoided, and managed to get attacked for doing so.
Apparently even trying to make a point about something you had done CORRECTLY is taboo these days, but then isn't everything?

 

[oldgroaner]

She made a very distasteful Jewish joke on This Week.....I must say it was a shock such a joke coming from such a learned lady. She was trying to explain concept but it all came out badly.
KudosDave

With help from a certain BBC attack dog it has to be said.
If Boris had said it the outcome would have been very different......

 

[Kudoscycles]

Carol Malone is to me the archetypal Brexiteer...whatever programme she appears on at the mention of any discussion about Brexit she changes into a screaming ranter that will not allow any other to discuss this subject.
On the Pledge TV an MP pointed out that most university graduates voted Remain,most young people voted Remain,most Remainers were positive about immigration this triggered Malone into a screaming maniac,other members of the team gave up trying to join the conversation.
At the mention of a second referendum she went on the attack with the default Brexiteer position 'the will of the people'.....the fact that the will of the people,based upon a lot more knowledge,may have changed is not to be given any consideration.
If we have another vote will the expats living in the EU be allowed to have a vote?
KudosDavr

 

[Kudoscycles]

There was an article about Citgroup who,10 years ago,compiled a report aimed at making the rich richer by targeting products at the poor....looking at the adverts on the TV they are dominated by funeral cost saving,quick loans,mobile deals etc . The theory was that if you can milk the poor,the wealth trickles up and selling investments to the rich was easy. This theory became the bundling of dodgy mortgages,the secitisation of same and the resultant credit/banking crash.
All obvious once it's pointed out.
KudosDave

 

[flecc]

There was an article about Citgroup who,10 years ago,compiled a report aimed at making the rich richer by targeting products at the poor....looking at the adverts on the TV they are dominated by funeral cost saving,quick loans,mobile deals etc . The theory was that if you can milk the poor,the wealth trickles up and selling investments to the rich was easy. This theory became the bundling of dodgy mortgages,the secitisation of same and the resultant credit/banking crash.
All obvious once it's pointed out.
KudosDave

True Dave, but if only the poor stopped falling for it, stopped buying junk they don't need and were more sensible about products like funerals. Mine is arranged, £1095 and nothing else to pay. That's far more sensible than a fabulously expensive coffin for the body to rot in and a convoy of luxury cars to take it more expense. What's so bad about a van and a cardboard box?
.

 

[Steb]

True Dave, but if only the poor stopped falling for it, stopped buying junk they don't need and were more sensible about products like funerals. Mine is arranged, £1095 and nothing else to pay. That's far more sensible than a fabulously expensive coffin for the body to rot in and a convoy of luxury cars to take it more expense. What's so bad about a van and a cardboard box?
.

I go even further, as far as I'm concerned my body's biodegradable waste (once I'm done with it) if the state wishes to pay for incineration it's decidedly its problem.

 

[flecc]

I go even further, as far as I'm concerned my body's biodegradable waste (once I'm done with it) if the state wishes to pay for incineration it's decidedly its problem.

I'd do the same except I know how hospitals, mortuaries etc harrass relatives to take the body away. Being unprepared and embarrassed by such an event they could then find themselves lumbered with an expense they can hardly afford. So I've arranged the cheap disposal to avoid that happening.
.

 

[oldgroaner]

True Dave, but if only the poor stopped falling for it, stopped buying junk they don't need and were more sensible about products like funerals. Mine is arranged, £1095 and nothing else to pay. That's far more sensible than a fabulously expensive coffin for the body to rot in and a convoy of luxury cars to take it more expense. What's so bad about a van and a cardboard box?
.

I paid for both our funerals when I was diagnosed with Cancer in 2009

 

[oldgroaner]

secitisation

That's a new word on me! perhaps you meant securitisation?, if not my apologies.

 

[oldgroaner]

From the Guardian
"
Harman dismisses Tory MP's claim of sexual harassment 'witch hunt'
Senior Labour MP says revelations are long overdue and not out of proportion, as claimed by men such as Roger Gale"

Can we ask, Please, please, please. leave all this till after Brexit is sorted out? we need the country to be Governed wisely with luck or even as badly as usual would be better than this stupidity.

That's what you are all paid to do
Far too much I might add!

Stop pratting about like a bunch of spoilt children!

Govern or Resign, and that goes for all of you from every party.

 

[tillson]

From the Guardian
"
Harman dismisses Tory MP's claim of sexual harassment 'witch hunt'
Senior Labour MP says revelations are long overdue and not out of proportion, as claimed by men such as Roger Gale"

Can we ask, Please, please, please. leave all this till after Brexit is sorted out? we need the country to be Governed wisely with luck or even as badly as usual would be better than this stupidity.

That's what you are all paid to do
Far too much I might add!

Stop pratting about like a bunch of spoilt children!

Govern or Resign, and that goes for all of you from every party.

flecc alluded to this earlier in the thread. Dealing with BREXIT is difficult, whereas shouting, “he grabbed me tits back in 1986” is easy. Those without talent gravitate towards easy. That’s why they are all doing easy and not addressing BREXIT.

I find it all quite amusing. It’s like dining in a cesspool full of turds whilst simultaneously complaining about a speck of dirt on the cutlery.

 

[oldtom]

It's the new 'coming out'!

Tom