Brexit, for once some facts.

PeterL

Esteemed Pedelecer
Aug 19, 2017
998
172
Dundee
Nor me, sobriety is best when making complex judgements. It has its disadvantages in relation to Brexit though, an alcoholic haze is helpful in seeing any good in that.
.
It's well known that a couple of drinks increases the thought process, even better, social interaction helps further.
 

PeterL

Esteemed Pedelecer
Aug 19, 2017
998
172
Dundee
True....the goodship Brexit is testament to that.
Or should it be a leaky hulk,best get off quick,it certainly doesnt know which way to go.
KudosDave
I take it that we assume that the boat is called the SS Europe and the passengers the EU? Tories of course would get first call for the life-boats being posh, First Class and all that. And the first to notice that all was not well on SS Europe.
 

oldtom

Esteemed Pedelecer
Catalans have declared independence from Spain
Yes 'MikelBikel', that is an interesting turn of events from Spain today and all eyes of the world will now be upon Spain to see how the Catalan issue unfolds in the days and weeks ahead.

While your post is relevant to this thread, there is another thread entitled, 'Fascism returns to Spain', initiated by Mike Killay in September which might be more appropriate.

Tom
 

MikelBikel

Esteemed Pedelecer
Jun 6, 2017
849
318
Ireland
"Passport to Pimlico", a friend has just reminded me of that film. Hehe. :)

Quite right Tom, but its still another nascent secession from the EU.

Wouldn't obsess about ideology.
Maybe "follow the money" reveals more.
 
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oldgroaner

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 15, 2015
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It's well known that a couple of drinks increases the thought process, even better, social interaction helps further.
Alcohol is quite simply a poison that interferes with the brain.
If you are intending to engage in Social interaction, best leave it to other fools to drink and watch them perform.
Too many people are hooked on alcohol and incorrectly think they are in control when it actually is.
 

oldgroaner

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 15, 2015
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More news of how well organised the Government is from the Independent
"
Theresa May has not read of secret Brexit reports, says David Davis
Brexit Secretary claims the Prime Minister only looks at summaries
Theresa May has not read secret Whitehall reports that look into how Brexit will hit the economy, David Davis has said.

“She’ll know the summary outcomes of them,” the Brexit Secretary told a parliamentary committee meeting. “She won’t necessarily have read every single one, they are in excruciating detail.”

Asked whether the rest of the Cabinet had seen the fulll assessments, Mr Davis said they had also only read the summaries.


To sum up: the Secret Reports are so secret even the Government don't read them

What could possibly go wrong when our negotiating position cannot be accidentally revealed for a EXCELLENT REASON.

THOSE WHO RUN THE COUNTRY ONLY HAVE A VAGUE IDEA OF WHAT OUR POSITION REALLY IS AND RELY ON GUESSWORK.

DON'T BOTHER HER WITH FACTS, SHE'S MADE HER MIND UP
 

oldgroaner

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 15, 2015
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From the BBC
"
PFI: five firms avoid tax despite £2bn profits, BBC learns
he five companies specialised in lending money through Private Finance Initiatives (PFI).

They own hundreds of public assets including schools, hospitals and even police stations.

The BBC has also learned that a small number of big offshore companies are currently on a buying spree.

They are buying up a number of the UK's public buildings.

Research carried out by the think tank that investigates PFI deals, the European Services Strategy Unit, reveals the extent of the buy-up in Britain.

  • Nine off-shore infrastructure funds own between 50% and 100% of the equity in 335 PFI/Public Private Partnership (PPP) projects. This amounts to 45% of all 735 current projects
  • 12 offshore companies have bought equity in 74% of the 735 current projects
  • Education and health projects, including schools and hospitals, account for two-thirds of the purchases by offshore companies
The University College London Hospital's NHS Foundation Trust (UCLH) told the BBC that its PFI debt was far too high, mainly due to interest rate charges of between 7% and 8%.

This meant an annual bill of £30m, at least double what he believes UCLH could be paying if the debt was re-scheduled.

Professor Marcel Levi, UCLH Chief Executive, told the BBC: "If we spend an enormous amount of money on paying interest rates and this PFI debt, then that's money we cannot spend on patient care, on nurses, on treatment and management systems."

And it's money that is not being spent on achieving targets for A&E and cancer waiting times, he added.

Ah the Glory of Tory Policies, Profit for the few, debt and distress for the Many.
 

oldgroaner

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 15, 2015
23,461
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Some interesting observations from the "Another Angry Voice " Blogger
"
imagine that Corbyn and the Labour Party were colluding to undermine parliamentary democracy at every turn, and their supporters in the media were busy orchestrating witch hunts against anyone who stood in his way (judges, opposition politicians, campaigners, university lecturers ...).
  • Imagine if Jeremy Corbyn hadn't been (twice) elected Labour Party leader in massive landslide victories, but instead had been crowned party leader when his allies in the party and the mainstream media bullied his rival out of the leadership contest.
  • Imagine if Corbyn supporters in the media then used this McCarthyite letter as inspiration to launch a hate-fuelled public witch hunt against any university staff who dare to oppose Corbyn's position.
Of course this is only a hypothetical exercise because Jeremy Corbyn is an elected democratic socialist who has actually been working hard to democratise the Labour Party so that ordinary members have much more say over the direction the party takes, so he would hardly behave in the same profoundly illiberal and anti-democratic manner as Theresa May has been.

But just imagine Corbyn and his supporters had done any of these things. We all know that the Tories and their bully boys in the mainstream media would be shrieking "red terror", drawing parallels with the Stalinist purges, and posing as if they're principled liberals who are determined to stand up for stuff like democracy, academic independence, parliamentary sovereignty, the rule of law, and freedom of speech.

But because these attacks on democracy, academic independence, parliamentary sovereignty, the rule of law, and freedom of speech are being orchestrated by Theresa May and the pro-Tory bully boys in the right-wing press, there's absolutely no talk of "the blue terror" whatever, no parallels being drawn with right-wing tyrants and dictators, and in fact the majority of the mainstream press insist on covering these extraordinary political circumstances as if there's nothing wrong at all, and these continual Tory attacks on democracy, freedom, and the rule of law are just business as usual.

The fact that there's virtually no condemnation from the mainstream media, and absolutely no efforts to frame the profoundly illiberal and anti-democratic scheming of the Tories as "the blue terror" tells us an lot about the attitudes of most of the people who work in the mainstream media.

The appalling thing is that no one can really deny the truth of theses allegations, can they?
 

Woosh

Trade Member
May 19, 2012
20,323
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Southend on Sea
wooshbikes.co.uk
The appalling thing is that no one can really deny the truth of theses allegations, can they?
that blog is wildly exaggerated.
The reason we are in this mess is because of the voting system.
All we need is a coalition government to stop a few MPs making a mokery of our democratic system.
 

oldgroaner

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 15, 2015
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that blog is wildly exaggerated.
The reason we are in this mess is because of the voting system.
All we need is a coalition government to stop a few MPs making a mokery of our democratic system.
Which of his allegations are untrue?
But I do agree about the Voting system as my belief is that all MP's of all parties should be represented in the Government, not in a neutered opposition role, or absolute power.

Sent from my XT1032 using Tapatalk
 
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Steb

Esteemed Pedelecer
Jul 15, 2017
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613
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london
the boat is shipshape and sound but a minority of the crew haven't learn't to sit down and stop continually rocking it.
Too true, brexiters don't like democratic discourse, dissent (a bit like Ledsom when she accused media of treason for questioning it). What can I say, this isn't North Korea. As it becomes ever more apparent what an unbelievably stupid, misguided decision it was there will be consequences.
 
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oldgroaner

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 15, 2015
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Too true, brexiters don't like democratic discourse, dissent (a bit like Ledsom when she accused media of treason for questioning it). What can I say, this isn't North Korea. As it becomes ever more apparent what an unbelievably stupid, misguided decision it was there will be consequences.
Unfortunately for those of us who wanted to remain too!
 
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