Brexit, for once some facts.

PeterL

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Aug 19, 2017
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Dundee
you should read more on macro-economics. My first serious girlfriend did economics at uni, she needed a bit of help with maths, that's how I got interested in it and read some of her coursework over a couple of years.
I guess that I'm just old-fashioned, my wife is a farmers daughter from Indianapolis. I find the economics of land use to be both understandable and completely honest.
 

Woosh

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I guess that I'm just old-fashioned, my wife is a farmers daughter from Indianapolis. I find the economics of land use to be both understandable and completely honest.
you view is perfectly applicable in a micro-economic standpoint. The problem is you don't control the national currency or taxes.
Government has and use these powers. Government controls also the pensions.
National debts as percentage of GDP from our neighbours:
Germany: 69%
UK: 90%
France: 98%

There is nothing to be proud of about our national debts but nothing to be over worried about.
 

PeterL

Esteemed Pedelecer
Aug 19, 2017
998
172
Dundee
you should read more on macro-economics. My first serious girlfriend did economics at uni, she needed a bit of help with maths, that's how I got interested in it and read some of her coursework over a couple of years.
I truly believe that if something can't be explained in simple terms then whoever is doing the talking is either patronising or not of this world.
 

PeterL

Esteemed Pedelecer
Aug 19, 2017
998
172
Dundee
you view is perfectly applicable in a micro-economic standpoint. The problem is you don't control the national currency or taxes.
Government has and use these powers. Government controls also the pensions.
National debts as percentage of GDP from our neighbours:
Germany: 69%
UK: 90%
France: 98%

There is nothing to be proud of about our national debts but nothing to be over worried about.
To use your own figures. 90% is a lot higher than 75% and still rising last time I looked. You seem to think / suggest that we could spend (borrow) even more to get out of this spiral?
 

Woosh

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I truly believe that if something can't be explained in simple terms then whoever is doing the talking is either patronising or not of this world.
you can explain everything in the universe to a certain depth, beyond that, you need teachers. Try to explain the imaginary unit 'i' - most people will not be able to make the difference between the words 'number' and 'unit' in maths, leave alone an imaginary number. Yet, without understanding 'i', you can't calculate most of the physical interactions.
 

PeterL

Esteemed Pedelecer
Aug 19, 2017
998
172
Dundee
you can explain everything in the universe to a certain depth, beyond that, you need teachers. Try to explain the imaginary unit 'i' - most people will not be able to make the difference between the words 'number' and 'unit' in maths, leave alone an imaginary number. Yet, without understanding 'i', you can't calculate most of the physical interactions.
I too went to school, but I must admit that I took a break when girls came on the scene - you must have missed a lot with your nose stuck in a maths book.
 

Woosh

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To use your own figures. 90% is a lot higher than 75% and still rising last time I looked. You seem to think / suggest that we could spend (borrow) even more to get out of this spiral?
that depends on what to spend on. The investment multiplier is not constant, if you borrow money to pay for say increasing unemployment benefit, the IM is low, maybe 2. If you borrow to pay for HS2, the IM may be 3, if you borrow to add an extra lane to the M25, the IM may be 5.
 

PeterL

Esteemed Pedelecer
Aug 19, 2017
998
172
Dundee
you can explain everything in the universe to a certain depth, beyond that, you need teachers. Try to explain the imaginary unit 'i' - most people will not be able to make the difference between the words 'number' and 'unit' in maths, leave alone an imaginary number. Yet, without understanding 'i', you can't calculate most of the physical interactions.
Too serious, I, nor anyone else, needs to know 'how' to do everything, we pay others to do that and give us the information we need to make meaningful decisions. That's the secret to these guys that get educated in Eton, they know that. To get back on subject just because you know something in more depth thatn your boss does not make you smarter than him/her.

This is especially the case when it comes to money. A fool and his money is easily parted is as true now as it has ever been.
 

Woosh

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To get back on subject just because you know something in more depth thatn your boss does not make you smarter than him/her.
that is usually the case. They (my bosses) pay me for my brain, not for my nous. I worked many years as a software developer. My bosses don't have as many A levels as I have fingers.
 

oldgroaner

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 15, 2015
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OG
That's nonsense, and you know it is but you wont admit as such because Tom said it.
Excuse me, Tom's opinions are his to Express, I don't actually have to admit anything do I?
I'm not his apologist, even though I do at times extend that privilege to your comments.
 

Zlatan

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Nov 26, 2016
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that is usually the case. They (my bosses) pay me for my brain, not for my nous. I worked many years as a software developer. My bosses don't have as many A levels as I have fingers.
Cleverness and A levels are inverse proportional..except for the gifted student.
Students who accept without questioning, rote learn the fundamentals, have teachers who give tricks showing when to apply the learnt algorithms do well now ...
Real , questioning education died years ago.. ( I lectured in Maths for over a decade)
 

Zlatan

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 26, 2016
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Excuse me, Tom's opinions are his to Express, I don't actually have to admit anything do I?
I'm not his apologist, even though I do at times extend that privilege to your comments.
But you never apply same standards to either his insults or his occasional ridiculous post. You are biased OG..stands out like a sore thumb.
 

oldgroaner

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 15, 2015
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There was a phrase to treasure in there
"The tragic reality is that supporters of real, free-market capitalism are politically homeless,"
Incomplete as it should have tacked on at the end
Before they have succeeded in their life long quest to destroy the environment and Humanity along with it, events are turning against their evil influence,but like a sticky toffee wrapper we still haven't reached that glorious day when we are finally shut of them, and sanity reigns.

Lets complete it now
"The tragic reality is that supporters of real, free-market capitalism are politically homeless
Before they have succeeded in their life long quest to destroy the environment and Humanity along with it, events are turning against their evil influence,but like a sticky toffee wrapper we still haven't reached that glorious day when we are finally shut of them, and sanity reigns."

Doesn't that just sing?
 

Danidl

Esteemed Pedelecer
Sep 29, 2016
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Ireland
you should read more on macro-economics. My first serious girlfriend did economics at uni, she needed a bit of help with maths, that's how I got interested in it and read some of her coursework over a couple of years.
.. by "it" did you mean economics or was it something more personal?
 
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oldgroaner

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But you never apply same standards to either his insults or his occasional ridiculous post. You are biased OG..stands out like a sore thumb.
The problem is, that despite the robustness of Tom's method of delivery, much of what he says is the unvarnished truth.
Usually I make no comment, but that's not good enough for you is it?
You seem to take a lack of criticism as implying enthusiastic support.
Why are you biased in this way?
 
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Woosh

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rote learn the fundamentals, have teachers who give tricks showing when to apply the learnt algorithms do well now ...
speak for yourself.
in my case, it certainly wasn't rote learning.
 

Woosh

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.. by "it" did you mean economics or was it something more personal?
economics of course.
John Maynard Keynes & Adam Smith.
 

oldgroaner

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 15, 2015
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Cleverness and A levels are inverse proportional..except for the gifted student.
Students who accept without questioning, rote learn the fundamentals, have teachers who give tricks showing when to apply the learnt algorithms do well now ...
Real , questioning education died years ago.. ( I lectured in Maths for over a decade)
One of your better circular personal arguments, there is a faint hope that I understood what you meant, assuming of course it was your intention not to confuse all and sundry.
Just kidding as God help me (Remember I'm an Atheist) I agree with you., at least to this bit "Real , questioning education died years ago."
And I'm sure that an education system that works on "Tick Box" performance and reaching quotas by any means fair or foul doesn't help.
Have I stumbled accidentally on what you intended to convey?
 

Woosh

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And I'm sure that an education system that works on "Tick Box" performance and reaching quotas by any means fair or foul doesn't help.
multiple choice questions exams were not invented yet in my days, nor the electronic calculators..
We were allowed the slide rule in some exams, not all.
 
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oldgroaner

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Nov 15, 2015
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That's the secret to these guys that get educated in Eton,
No it's not, the secret they have is no one realises how stupid they actually are as they stand in awe of the fact that they were born into money and privilege, and have an incredibly insular attitude of superiority that covers up the fact that they are simply no better than anyone else, and in many case like Boris , Cameron and Jackass Grease Smog arrogant and incompetent as well.
 

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