Two boys die in "ebike" accident: Cardiff riot broke out after 'police prevented parents seeing fatal crash victims', close relative says

AndyBike

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 8, 2020
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but why is there so much vitriol against the police without the facts?
Because they appear to be lying. Something they are well versed in.
They put out an unsubstantiated statement and in most cases usually at odds with the truth that later comes out. They post this to the media and allow them to run with it.
First statement was not only was there no chase, but there were no police vehicles in the area at the time. Video comes out from someones cctv and oh look, there IS a police vehicle not only int he area, but following closely and at speed the ebike in question.

Their latest statement is that there was no police vehicle int he road the accident took place. So going from their earlier falsehood, its likely that the bike turned a corner or such into the path of another vehicle where the accident took place. Teh police following behind THEN turned into the same road and came across the accident. So mincing words that there was no police vehicle in the same road as the accident is strictly true, but highly misleading.

All police vehicles have forward facing cameras. so they have the footage of them following the bike and of the accident, but that footage will never ever
be released to the public because it will likely show them following the bike and the accident, which would be at odds to the truth of the scene.

Remember the Jean charlies de Menedez shooting ?.
The police statment they immediately put out as reported by their officers, was that Mr De Menedez was wearing a bulky jacket which made the officers suspect there was a tangible explosive device hidden underneath it.
They further stated that Mr De Menedez ran into the station and vaulted the barrier.
The truth came out later and showed that the statement they released to the press was a complete and utter fabrication.
Mr De Menedez was wearing a thin denim jacket over a t-shirt. He didn't run into the station but walked, he only ran when on the actual platform to get onto the train, and he didn't vault the barrier but instead used his oyster card to pay his fare, he also stopped to buy a newspaper.

Everything the police said and reported to the media was a lie. Only the police knew the facts and only the police were able to report what had happened.

And then we have James Ashley
" The Kent inquiry concluded that the basis for the raid was "not merely exaggerated, it was indeterminably false" and that the officers involved in its planning had "concocted" the evidence or planned to misrepresent it to justify the operation. "
 

guerney

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Sep 7, 2021
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" But the friend said: 'The reason why the police wasn't on the scene is because the boys have gone through a blocked street and the police knew they couldn't go that way so they have turned onto Grand Avenue, which led the boys to cut through onto Stanway Road onto Snowden Road.

'The police have already stated they were on Grand Avenue and they were not on the scene. They weren't on the scene because they lost them.' "

 

AndyBike

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 8, 2020
1,359
572
The police have already stated they were on Grand Avenue and they were not on the scene. They weren't on the scene because they lost them.' "
So despite their earlier statement ,they were in fact chasing them.
 

guerney

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Sep 7, 2021
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" A bike could have weaved through a pedestrian access point next to the bollards and then been driven then down a short stretch of hill on to Snowden Road. The bike crashed into a lamp post around 100 metres from the bollards.
Police have not given details of the route the boys took. "


Commissioner concedes Cardiff police may have chased boys before deaths
Alun Michael refuses to say he was wrong to initially claim no pursuit took place before fatal crash that sparked riots


 
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guerney

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" A police officer had a grudge against the two teenagers killed in a scooter crash before the Cardiff riots - and had previously tried to "run them off the road", a friend claimed. "

 

portals

Esteemed Pedelecer
Jul 15, 2022
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We are all making comments without knowing all the facts here – that happens but why is there so much vitriol against the police without the facts? I am sure there must be serving / retired officers who are members of this forum and they would be dismayed by some of the comments. We ask these people to police society for us but tie one hand behind their back. I am not / never have been / never will be a police officer but I feel comments on police behaviour should be kept to yourselves until the facts are known, AND I do accept that not every officer is squeaky clean and neither are we.
There is so much vitriol against the cops as an institution as they have been proven again and again nationwide over decades to be institutionally racist and more recently institutionally corrupt. They also like to rape and murder, you read the news, right, just look at the state of the Met...

Incidents likes this when the cops first reaction is to lie to the public when they swore an oath to uphold the law makes a total mockery of the police service. They're not fit for purpose and large majority of ppl who are currently cops should not be cops, they don't have the intelligence or temperament to be in the job, essentially just bullies/chavs in uniforms who scarily have some power and can f*kc ppls lives up at the drop of a hat if they see fit.

I'd make them all reapply for their jobs and have then psychologically tested for suitability.

If there are cops here then let them speak up for themselves and give their point of view.
 

portals

Esteemed Pedelecer
Jul 15, 2022
604
176
All police vehicles have forward facing cameras. so they have the footage of them following the bike and of the accident, but that footage will never ever
be released to the public because it will likely show them following the bike and the accident, which would be at odds to the truth of the scene.
A FOI request should yield that footage, isn't that the law? However yes they will try every trick in the book to try and stop it being released for reasons you say, it may come to light at some point though.

Similarly the bus will have had a camera, not heard much about the driver though, hope he recovers and can get back to work, that can't have been easy to see.
 

portals

Esteemed Pedelecer
Jul 15, 2022
604
176
Remember the Jean charlies de Menedez shooting ?.
The police statment they immediately put out as reported by their officers, was that Mr De Menedez was wearing a bulky jacket which made the officers suspect there was a tangible explosive device hidden underneath it.
They further stated that Mr De Menedez ran into the station and vaulted the barrier.
The truth came out later and showed that the statement they released to the press was a complete and utter fabrication.
Mr De Menedez was wearing a thin denim jacket over a t-shirt. He didn't run into the station but walked, he only ran when on the actual platform to get onto the train, and he didn't vault the barrier but instead used his oyster card to pay his fare, he also stopped to buy a newspaper.
I remember it well, I was working in London 2005 when De Menedez was murdered.

Guess who the Met's Gold Commander was on that operation, none other than Cressida Dick...she has blood on her hands
 
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guerney

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Sep 7, 2021
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Police release timeline of events in moments before crash that killed two teenagers in Ely, Cardiff
'We have been confirming that we have clear witness accounts, analysing tracking data from police vehicles and studying CCTV'

 

guerney

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Sep 7, 2021
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Grand avenue is on one of my cycle routes.

Not an area I would be happy cycling in after dark.
Night cycling through rough areas, is when I really am tempted to stop and derestict (I'd simply change wheel size to 6 inches)... but so far, whizzing past people who shout things like "Yo! What you doing with my bike blood?" seems to work - it's hard for them to formulate and execute a plan fast enough, and I doubt any would be able to run faster than 15.5mph for long. As a precaution, I veer away from pavements occupied by persons at night. I expect it'd be a little harder to stab through my cowhide leather biker jacket, might require a frenzied stabbing action.


"In a desperate bid to help protect members of the public, volunteers in the area have started handing out “stab” packs to stem the never-ending tide of bloodshed."

Most dangerous places to live in the UK ranked on new crime map
The northern county of Cleveland - which includes Hartlepool, Middlesbrough, Cleveland and Stockton-on-Tees - claimed the top spot

 
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guerney

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Sep 7, 2021
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New Cardiff video shows police van following teens moments before fatal crash
Police have denied they were chasing two teenagers on an electric bike moments before a fatal crash which sparked a night of rioting

" The police again insisted they were not following the teens in a radio interview this morning, but newly emerged footage obtained by the Mirror today shows the same police van driving behind them half a mile away just minutes later on Stanway Road at approximately 6pm.

Locals believe the boys rode up Stanway Road to flee the police van knowing it had bollards at the other end meaning the police could not give chase. Tragically they died just moments later on Snowden Road at about 6:03pm.
"





 
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StuartsProjects

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May 9, 2021
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From the article;

"A friend of Kyrees Sullivan, 16, and Harvey Evans, 15, claims they were targeted by police while out on e-bikes, with one officer in particular allegedly holding a grudge against them"

If the e-Bikes were legal, its difficult to see how the riders could be "targeted by police".

But what the heck, illegal eBikes are accepted as the norm by a lot of people, and as is often also said the consequences (of ignoring the rules) are very limited.
 
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guerney

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Sep 7, 2021
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Note to self: Glue wig to helmet



 
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guerney

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Police van following teenagers first on scene after fatal crash, chief confirms
The police officers pursuing two teenagers riding an electric bike minutes before they were killed in a crash were the first to arrive at the scene of the collision, a senior police chief has confirmed.



Police and crime commissioners are supposed to be the voice of the public, not hide from scrutiny
'It is hard to escape the idea that it is a cushy gig for politicians on tail end of their career'



Cardiff riot: Nine arrested since disorder that followed boys' deaths



Cardiff riot: Bus firm says its vehicles were not involved in crash that killed teen boys
Harvey Evans, 15, and Kyrees Sullivan, 16, were killed in the Ely area of Cardiff on Monday evening, sparking scenes of rioting in the area as locals blamed police for the tragedy





Ely riot: Drakeford defends police and crime commissioner’s ‘no chase’ comments
Mark Drakeford suggested Alun Michael was ‘entitled’ to rely on information supplied to him by South Wales Police in the aftermath of a fatal crash.

 
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StuartsProjects

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May 9, 2021
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This is almost on topic .........

One of the most significant corruption cases invoving the Cardiff\SouthWales police was the sorry case of the 'Cardiff Three'.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_of_Lynette_White

The murder took place at No7 James street, whilst at No25 was the goto bike shop in Cardiff run by Charlie Alexandar;


A dingy, very crowded shop, more like a junk workshop than a shop really, but heck the guy could build real quality wheels.
 
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mountainride

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May 24, 2023
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We are all making comments without knowing all the facts here – that happens but why is there so much vitriol against the police without the facts? I am sure there must be serving / retired officers who are members of this forum and they would be dismayed by some of the comments. We ask these people to police society for us but tie one hand behind their back. I am not / never have been / never will be a police officer but I feel comments on police behaviour should be kept to yourselves until the facts are known, AND I do accept that not every officer is squeaky clean and neither are we.
I didn't mean to discredit the entire police force with my comment and claim that they are all bad. As other users have said before, their statement is not credible because it is at odds with the facts. Apparently, they just want to protect their employees from punishment and at the same time their reputation, which is not the first time in this world.
 

Woosh

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May 19, 2012
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I still can't understand how an ordinary lamp post on a pavement could kill 2 people on a bike.
What kind of speed were they riding at?
 
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Chainmale

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May 13, 2020
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I still can't understand how an ordinary lamp post on a pavement could kill 2 people on a bike.
What kind of speed were they riding at?
Even if they were only doing 20mph a sudden impact with a solid object be it lamp post or pavement could easily cause catastrophic head injuries