Tour of Britain – Stage 3 , eZee vs Kalkhoff

[Tiberius]

Hi Riggo,

Talk about trying to hit a moving target.

Yesterday this was restricted to a small number of people who were going to do the ride. I was one of them; I signed up to do this because I thought it was an interesting challenge, as well as being on my home turf, so to speak. I am not an athlete or a professional rider, I suppose I am one of flecc's risk group for the ambulance and defibrillator. For me, a big part of the interest was that it was the actual ToB course.

Yesterday we were having an email discussion among the participants. First we were given a set of rules which excluded me on multiple counts. That was solved by agreeing an open class.

This morning though, I wake up and find that the consultation period is over and the discussion has moved to a public forum. Lots of things have changed overnight - but worst of all is that it has moved to a date that I can't make. I will be in Italy on that Sunday.

Riggo, I don't think any of this is your fault. I think its just that there have been some confused objectives here, and it hasn't helped to have part of the discussions in several closed groups and part in public.

But I am bitterly disappointed. I have repeatedly on this forum suggested some kind of event in September that is a different format to Prestiegne. Now that seems to be happening, and on my doorstep. But you've chosen a set of rules that makes me a hanger on rather than a participant and a date that means I can't come.

Nick

 

[Wisper Bikes]

We would love to get involved.

Hi Riggo, excuse me but I have not read the complete thread.

Is this a private event or can anyone join in?

Best regards David

 

[flecc]

As Riggo hasn't come back in yet David, it's open to everyone, rules as above. Street legal only in the competition and subject to strict scrutiny, but also an open class for those wishing to ride uncompetitively for fun.

With 3 batteries allowed, your 14 Ah bikes might waltz around the course twice.
.

 

[riggo]

The rough outline of the route I should have ready in the next 7 days, the exact route will not be released until the actual day of the trial, this is to stop people dumping extra batteries or other possible devious behaviour. The distance will be much the same as the ToB stage, approx. 100 miles

The date of the event was decided between David Henshaw and myself as the most suitable, I know some will not be able to make it, but thats life, I can't please all the people all the time, If people wish to ride the ToB route on the 9/9/08 then there is nothing to stop them. If the majority still want the event to take place on the 9th Sept then I shall gladly step aside and let somebody else sort out the rules and logistics.

cheers

Riggo

 

[JohnofCambridge]

Back to the rules Riggo. If you get people signed up to these, it would be useful to collect some other data such as weight of bike and rider, age category of biker and rough mileage covered cycling in the preceding 6 weeks. Even this will not take out all the variables but should give us data for some good arguments for years!!!!!

I am not sure what you are proposing would turn into an annual counterbalance event to Presteigne - in fact it will be very difficult to do a Presteigne elsewhere.

However, do let us know if you see what you are doing as a possible repeatable event for the Autumn. If you are not thinking of it and there are some in the forum interested in doing something in the east midlands or east anglia then I would be happy to help.

John

 

[riggo]

If the event is successful then it could be annual and I see no reason that it could not move around the country, I for one am excluded from Presteigne because it is nearly impossible to get to using public transport, I went two years ago and felt very very guilty putting my bike in a car and driving it to a supposed environmental event!

To those that said the rules and dates should not have been decided behind closed doors I apologise, it is just that myself and David Henshaw wanted to get the event up and running within a short time frame.

John, I think collecting data on riders as well as bikes could be useful, we could do a brief fitness test using an excercise bike and heartrate monitor ? anybody with knowledge in this field? any workable ideas would be welcome?

Riggo

 

[Wisper Bikes]

Entr

As Riggo hasn't come back in yet David, it's open to everyone, rules as above. Street legal only in the competition and subject to strict scrutiny, but also an open class for those wishing to ride uncompetitively for fun.

With 3 batteries allowed, your 14 Ah bikes might waltz around the course twice.
.

Thanks Flecc

Still not sure how to enter

All the best David

 

[flecc]

Private message to Riggo announcing intention to enter I think would be best David:

If you click on the name Riggo you'll get a link to PM him.
.

 

[ElephantsGerald]

Street legal means exactly that, so no derestriction or assistance above 15mph, after all if the trial is taking place on the public highway the bike has to be legal.

If modified bikes want to join in they can just for fun, but their results will not be recorded and the bikes will not be scrutinized, they will be mass started after all the street legal machines have departed.

Would a bike like the Wisper 905SE qualify to take part under these rules (the standard production bike has a de-restriction button on the handlebars)?

So I assume it would pass the test for no modifications, but would it fail the "street legal" criteria? Unless you disabled the de-restrict button, but then it wouldn't be the standard production bike any more... Ho hum.

Regards,

Elephants

 

[Wisper Bikes]

De restric button

Good point Elephants, I will PM Riggo as Flecc suggests and put the question!

Regards David

 

[keithhazel]

So I assume it would pass the test for no modifications, but would it fail the "street legal" criteria? Unless you disabled the de-restrict button, but then it wouldn't be the standard production bike any more... Ho hum.

Regards,

Elephants

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i think this could end up quite amusing..i can see the "officials" on the starting line disallowing all sorts of combinations..from "unoficial nobbly tyres"... to all bikes that have a button thats "been added" no matter its use "just in case" it activates the nuclear reacter in the crossbar, and even if you disabled the de-ristrict button on starting who's gonna believe you wont "flick it" back...after all if they think there are some devious e-bikers amongst you who are gonna "stash batteries" along a pre-informed route then no way they gonna trust you swearing on the bible that you will be gentlemanly and "play the game" by being "legal"... ....

 

[riggo]

I don't want to get in to a protracted argument, but personally i would class a bike with a derestrict button as not UK street legal, if you caused an accident while your bike was in unrestricted mode i'm sure most courts would view that the machine was not legal. If you have a better idea let me know these are Draft rules after all.

Unfortunatly there are always people who will cheat or try and give themselves an unfair advantage, this year's two battery rumour at Prestiegne would be a good example.

Apologies for anybody trying to PM me, I have now enabled this facility

Riggo

 

[frank9755]

I'm not sure it's that clear cut. I believe the Wisper is street legal, as long as the button is not pressed. I'm sure David looked into this during design.
Then what about the Torq? Mr Ching says it assists to 16mph (and other ezee bikes I know will assist to 17 on fresh batteries). As 16 > 15 or 15.5, I don't know if that would pass an ultra-pedantic 'street legal'test. I think you have to allow production bikes to compete or it seems a bit contrived!

 

[john]

I'm not sure it's that clear cut. I believe the Wisper is street legal, as long as the button is not pressed. I'm sure David looked into this during design.
Then what about the Torq? Mr Ching says it assists to 16mph (and other ezee bikes I know will assist to 17 on fresh batteries). As 16 > 15 or 15.5, I don't know if that would pass an ultra-pedantic 'street legal'test. I think you have to allow production bikes to compete or it seems a bit contrived!

I think that is sensible. If it is classed as street legal by the supplier then that should be enough. Of course you would have to be confident that Wisper users didn't use the off-road button. To me, it would seem to defeat the point if they did, as surely the object of the exercise it to compare street legal bikes but I suppose others may have other motivations.

 

[frank9755]

I think that is sensible. If it is classed as street legal by the supplier then that should be enough. Of course you would have to be confident that Wisper users didn't use the off-road button. To me, it would seem to defeat the point if they did, as surely the object of the exercise it to compare street legal bikes but I suppose others may have other motivations.

Could you even insist they didn't use it, if you didn't also insist that the Torq users kept their bikes below 15.5mph? I think it has to be production bikes, used to their capabilities. Which means if you have a Wisper with a few spare 14Ah batteries, you might be hard to beat even if you don't do much pedalling!
I hope that this doesn't spoil the Ezee vs 50 Cycles rivalry...!

 

[keithhazel]

I hope that this doesn't spoil the Ezee vs 50 Cycles rivalry...!

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if i remember correctly there is NO Ezee vs 50 Cycles rivalry as 50 cycles said they where not even bothering to enter one as had nothing to prove........ this could turn out to be mr Ching first past the line breaking open the bubbly......... with ONLY HIM on the podeum...

 

[frank9755]

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if i remember correctly there is NO Ezee vs 50 Cycles rivalry as 50 cycles said they where not even bothering to enter one as had nothing to prove...

I interpreted that as part of the rivalry!

 

[flecc]

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this could turn out to be mr Ching first past the line breaking open the bubbly......... with ONLY HIM on the podeum...

Especially as he's riding on a different day.
.

 

[keithhazel]

Especially as he's riding on a different day.
.

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headlines in A&B magazine the following month as edited by a "bike maker"..

"i had been training heavily for weeks now just for this day,all went as planned and i "ezzeeily" led from the front and was first past the finishing line without another bike in sight, thus proving once and for all that my bikes are the best and i'm not all "tork" ....

 

[Tiberius]

Especially as he's riding on a different day.
.

Hi flecc,

You seem to know more about what's going on than the participants do, and to find out about the changes before we do. Could you tell us the latest, please?

Nick