This mornings Sunday Times

[anotherkiwi]

Imagine the picture: drunk man over 60 on pedelec in safety jacket and helmet chuckling to himself as he weaves his way 38 km homewards... not pretty...

The thing about riding a bike home from San Sebastian is that by the time I am off the cycle paths and on the open road I am half sober again. And I try not to go over 50 km/h down the big hills - quite easy, just sit up straight and let the air resistance do its job.

 

[flecc]

Do you have your own opinion on it?

Not on the speed, I only have three opinions on the law for pedelecs:

1) That given there's an assist speed limit, a power limit is unnecessary and the necessary power is a matter for designers, not legislators.

2) That I don't want changes that add motor vehicle style bureaucracy to pedelecs.

3) That there is no chance of the assist speed increase for bureaucracy free pedelecs that so many argue for in here. This last opinion is logically based on the facts of the situation.

What's your idea on why others use the term 'ebike' then?

Probably due to the inclination to think in terms of "electric bicycle" and a general aversion to the term assist which none seem to want to use. Thereafter it's one for the psychologists.
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[Artstu]

I haven't seen the video posted, I believe this is what sparked the investigation. that first bike looks familiar, forum member here perhaps? they really need to pedal.

 

[flecc]

The law is very black & white in its definition. Anything over 15.5mph (17mph, including 10% speedo inaccuracy allowance) and it's no longer classed as a bicycle.

Yes, but by who?

By the type approval regulations, specifying in article 1, section 2.1 (h) what a pedelec should be, anything else needing type approval as a motor vehicle. 168/2013 refers.
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[Gubbins]

By the type approval regulations, specifying in article 1, section 2.1 (h) what a pedelec should be, anything else needing type approval as a motor vehicle. 168/2013 refers.
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This is where it all falls down.. who is one likely to meet that knows all this type aproval stuff?
Absolutely no-one out there knows or cares about all these rules and numbers in sub section 4 paragraph 3 that don't mean a thing.

 

[flecc]

This is where it all falls down.. who is one likely to meet that knows all this type aproval stuff?
Absolutely no-one out there knows or cares about all these rules and numbers in sub section 4 paragraph 3 that don't mean a thing.

I agree, but I was answering your question.

Both we and the EU say it's the law, in the document quoted.
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[Will Tinker]

Sorry Will. I don't mean this to be personal, and I don't want to pick on you, but this is exactly the hysteria that we always get. Your argument sort of sounds valid, but it's completely out of proportion. When it comes to the morality and enforceability of the law, do you worry about the type of lights on your bike? Have you never ridden on the pavement? These things along with riding bikes that go over 15.5 mph, relatively, are flysh!t compared with deaths from drunk driving, speeding, mobile phones, etc. Every day in my street, there's a couple of kids riding their 50cc and 125cc motorbikes flat out up and down the road, which bends round and has parked cars on it. I don't see anybody recording/photographing it and putting an article in a national newspaper about it.

Ever since I've been involved in this forum, people have been making the same arguments as you, so you're not alone; however, we can still happily use our ebikes and nobody has been killed.

In summary, no need to get worked up. The politicians and regulators will do something in time. In the meantime, enjoy using your bike. If you want to make a fuss about something, choose something that's worthwhile.

I wasn't arguing this to begin with - I was stating that, whilst we have a law in place that clearly states what is and is not legally defined as a bicycle, we should respect those laws.

Your point putting the problem into proportion, I agree with by and large. But you and I know that the media do not operate on the same terms and therefore those who break the law (as is pretty clear in that video and others on this forum) are contributing to the type of media coverage we have seen today.

 

[LeighPing]

therefore those who break the law (as is pretty clear in that video and others on this forum) are contributing to the type of media coverage we have seen today.

Allegedly.

 

[Deleted member 4366]

A better link to the story above this.

That looks a lot like Cwah on his modified Dahon Jetstream!

 

[soundwave]

i can go faster than that and off road on the pavement why am i not in the news?

rubbish news papers lol

 

[Gubbins]

i can go faster than that and off road on the pavement why am i not in the news?

rubbish news papers lol

Best answer today [emoji605]

 

[Deleted member 4366]

Unbelievable, but that is Cwah. He made a video that he showed on Endless Sphere. If you stop it at exactly 3:00, you can see that white pillar with a clock (?) on it on the right and the arched building on the left. Just before that, you see the same tree on the left. Compare that with the beginning of the above video. He got rid of that bike some time ago and his video was uploaded 2 1/2 years ago.

If you synchronise the two videos, you'll see exactly the same pot-holes, monuments, buildings and trees in each one. They look a bit different because of the wide-angled lens used on the lower one.

 

[D8ve]

Cwah it is then defiantly illegal just never caught.
And it wasn't one of the over the counter pedelecs either.
SW would have some job keeping up with him too

 

[Ted B.]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3773787/The-souped-electric-bikes-kill-Speed-sensors-overwritten-make-capable-reaching-30mph.html

Extract:
====================
"Another retailer, 50Cycles, sells ‘speed ebikes’, which cost up to £3,595, with 350W motors capable of reaching 28mph.

The firm says they are technically mopeds and must be logged with the DVLA, but a member of staff at its London store told an undercover reporter the law was a ‘grey area’ and he was aware of only two customers who have registered their bikes.

Company director Tim Snaith later said the employee would be ‘retrained’."
======================

My own experience is as follow: when I went to one of the 50 Cycles stores a couple of months ago to try some Kalkhoff bikes, I saw a few S-Pedelec coming and leaving the store, and none of them had registration plates etc. Clearly, the store was not enforcing any of the regulation in place. I did ask the staff about those bikes, and the person said nobody could be bothered to register them properly, and it didn't matter anyway...

Well, apparently it does.

Surely, they knew it was going to come and bite them at some point. I guess Trading Standards are going to have a word with 50 Cycles, again...

 

[Nealh]

Here we are again going around in circles this topic and the like have been discussed time and time again on the forum and it gets very tedious, at the end of the day it's down to the user.

 

[Nealh]

Cwah it is then defiantly illegal just never caught.
And it wasn't one of the over the counter pedelecs either.
SW would have some job keeping up with him too

One up to Cwah .

 

[Smart eBiker]

Not a problem, all you need to do to have one is get it checked out for road legalities and register it with the DVLA, get a number plate, insurance, helmet and free tax then off you go. Just watch as the number plate can catch on people and cars as you weave in and out of traffic at speed, especially in London!

 

[Electrifying Cycles]

Unfortunately you would have to get the e-bike type approved which would require amendments to the bike. Hence why no-one has registered them, it is not an easy process. Works okay for self builds but not speed pedelecs built by manufacturers.

 

[Deleted member 4366]

Cwah it is then defiantly illegal just never caught.

Not is, but possibly was.

 

[flecc]

Here we are again going around in circles this topic and the like have been discussed time and time again on the forum and it gets very tedious, at the end of the day it's down to the user.

True of so many subjects in the forum though, there's only so much can be said about pedelecs, so the hardy annuals come back time and time again.
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