Prices of the electricity we use to charge

AndyBike

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 8, 2020
1,388
588
Bright people on average have brighter children on average.
Utter nonsense.

That plays in to the concept that people from rich families should rule over everyone else. That thinking is so 19th century

My own father came from a humble background in a rough part of Glasgow but went on to become the principle engineer of BAESema.
Principle engineer is the top of the food chain so to speak.

He'd told me that on more than one occasion he had to reprogram the macintosh computers BAE were using at that time because they didnt confirm his own calculations as he was more the slide rule and jottings on the back of a fag packet.
Me, im as thick as 2 short planks - maybe thats why im a furniture maker lol
 

Ghost1951

Esteemed Pedelecer
Jun 2, 2024
1,579
623
Sorry Peter, I was just replying to Ghost. Hadnt noticed your post



Im not sure the data can be taken as an absolute, given the last 14 years of under investment, but overall it is still a good service, and with proper investment can do better
You still assume that the poor performance is due to under spending when in the last few years of the previous government we spent a greater proportion of the nation's GDP than ever before.

60902
 

Woosh

Trade Member
May 19, 2012
20,361
16,869
Southend on Sea
wooshbikes.co.uk
What's wrong with that?
It's the continuation of British class system. Clarkson doesn't want to pay tax after he dies. I reckon his children will inherit more than 95% of us, so 1 mil tax free, then normal allowances then 20% on the rest seems more than fair to me compared to zero concessions and 40% standard IHT.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Peter.Bridge

danielrlee

Esteemed Pedelecer
May 27, 2012
1,394
723
Westbury, Wiltshire
torquetech.co.uk
Just to emphasise the difference between Clarkson's family background and the likes of Trump.

Clarkson's parents were a teacher and a travelling salesman. They made money sufficient to send their kids to private school and to buy a nice house on the back of a rather clever idea of his mother, who made Paddington bear stuffed toys for Jeremy and his sister for Christmas and they were so good, she was soon fully employed in making more of them at her kitchen table, ultimately outsourcing their manufacture and making quite a bit of money.

Clarkson himself started out in employment as a journalist at a local newspaper in Yorkshire and the rest you know.

Personally, although not wealthy or talented myself, I delight in a story of success like that. I have at times found Clarkson puerile and annoying, and I especially felt annoyed with him in the 1980s when he rubbished and mocked the car I owned (don't ask which) but it is undeniable that his family were ordinary and strapped for cash, but were clever and invested heavily in their children's education. Clarkson thereafter made his OWN way in the world and used his personality and talent to become a wealthy man.

What's wrong with that?
What's wrong with that? Nothing. Sort of. Clarkson's mother made the most of an opportunity available at the time to make her/their wealth, but it couldn't happen today. Anybody attempting this now would be met with an angry lawsuit due to blatant IP theft.
 
Last edited:

Ghost1951

Esteemed Pedelecer
Jun 2, 2024
1,579
623
Utter nonsense.

That plays in to the concept that people from rich families should rule over everyone else. That thinking is so 19th century

My own father came from a humble background in a rough part of Glasgow but went on to become the principle engineer of BAESema.
Principle engineer is the top of the food chain so to speak.

He'd told me that on more than one occasion he had to reprogram the macintosh computers BAE were using at that time because they didnt confirm his own calculations as he was more the slide rule and jottings on the back of a fag packet.
Me, im as thick as 2 short planks - maybe thats why im a furniture maker lol
You are mistaken in that joke you make about yourself - perhaps because you subscribe to left wing dogma.

In the time before about 1950. This country was so ridden by classist attitudes that bright and intelligent people came up against an armoured glass ceiling - a CLASS CEILING which largely prevented them from accessing other than menial work. It was almost impossible for them to access the professions or in most cases to progress into higher managerial roles. The country prior to WW2 and during it, was very far from being a meritocracy.

The term Meritocracy is now self explanatory, but it was coined by Michael young, who wrote a book, 'The Rise of the Meritocracy' in 1958, expressing his concerns about some of the outcomes of judging people on their ability.

The reason for this was of course the inescapable fact that intelligence and capability are not equally distributed in the population and that some people are of below average mental capability, most people are about the average (give or take) and that some are very much cleverer.

60903

Micheal Young was of the left, though he did not deny these obvious FACTS about the distribution of IQ, and every other physical characteristic in the population. The same is true of height, performance at sport, swiftness of foot in sprinting, or in endurance at marathon running and in musical and artistic ability. The differences between people,are ALL distributed as shown for IQ in the chart above. It is called the Normal Curve, because it shows the norm of how these qualities differ on a population basis.

Going back a little - Pre WW2, thicko rich people ran the army. They were given these positions because of their perceived 'breeding' and the officer class was pretty much entirely made up of such people - not that all of them were stupid, but the stupid were among them.

Was intelligence then a matter of social class?

No it was not. There were plenty of intelligent people in the working class (just as you pointed out) and their still are. Back then, they were PREVENTED from progressing not only in the military, but also in all professions and with very few exceptions in management and industry. It was even worse among women. It was truly a time of the CLASS ceiling.

Post war a massive change occurred, the time of meritocracy was born. Grammar schools and technical schools were at the heart of the 1944 Education Act. Bright boys and girls from whatever class poured into these institutions, went to university and into management roles in business and industry. They poured into the professions.

Did all bright boys and girls do this?

No -they did not, and to a very small extent, this is still the case. Parental attitudes prevent it, as do financial worries. There are still bright boys and girls leaving school early to go to work so that they can contribute to family finances, but the number doing this is vastly smaller than it used to be.

Michael Young who coined the term 'Meritocracy' was most concerned at what would happen to those who did not do well at 'merit'. He could see an unfairness in the fact that the stupid would be undervalued in a society which prized merit. He also thought that people who were intelligent, had actually done nothing themselves to deserve their gifts. An intelligent person has been blessed - it can not be denied. He has not achieved intelligence by himself.

By the way - as a man from an ordinary (poor in financial terms) background and the first in his family to ever attend a place of higher education, I know boys who were cleverer than me who went into trades. Although the gateway to higher education was well open by the time I went to secondary school in 1962, not every bright kid came through that gate.

If I were you, I would not even entertain the idea that a furniture maker must be thick. I would not says so and I never ever thought it. On the contrary, a man who can make furniture not only is possessed of wonderful skills, he has the capacity to make a very good living, way better these days than many who graduate from university. Not only that, but he could not do his work if he had not been blessed with intelligence.

These days, people are noticing that the country has areas blighted by under achievement and there are fears that the time of meritocracy may have ended. WE have sink estates blighted by inter generational unemployment crime and under achievement.

This fact is not the result of some sort of upper class plot. It is what we might have expected, given the rise of meritocracy and the heritability of intelligence. All sensible academic work on this subject (now bizarrely discounted and cancelled by the left) shows that at least 60% of intelligence is purely down to genes. This leaves 40% due to other factors such as, attention given to early childhood learning, cultural transmission of good values - work ethic and so on through family and school. The attention in infancy to language development and concept development are crucial to teh development of the 40% of intelligence not related to genes. Indeed, it is also related to the expression of the 60% which is genetic. A child deprived of stimulation will never achieve its potential.

I make damned sure that the time I spend with my five grandchildren, and my partner's grandchildren, is devoted to talking, listening and showing them the differences between things, so that they rapidly develop a more sophisticated view of the world.

Not all children have these advantages. Society needs to make a proper contribution.

It is completely unsurprising to me that some sink estates show consistently bad outcomes for children and young people and that we now see inter generational crime and unemployment . I and my two siblings were brought up in a home filled with encouragement by bright parents whose prospects were limited by the fact that they were born in 1920 and 1923. They passed on above average intelligence to their children and encouraged - more like insisted, on hard work and decency, and the desire to get on. We lived in a council house. We had no money. I remember my mother sitting on occasion in tears when my father's entire pay packet was handed to her as it always was. All of us children went on to graduate professions. We never occupied council accommodation after leaving home. Just like millions of others after the 1960s we made our own way and though not rich were never poor. Those housing estates once lived in by people with a wide range of intellectual ability - a great many held back by circumstance and the CLASS CEILING, began to be occupied only by those whose capabilities were more limited. I think this is why we see a fall in what is called social mobility. The brighter harder working people have moved out of them once they were not held back by society.

I have no answer to the problem of what to do about sink estates and the rump of people who can not succeed in trades, in management, industry, or in the professions, but it is my honest opinion that no one and no class is holding back those children who come from these families. I think they are held back by the nature and ability of their families.

Michael Young was perhaps right about Meritocracy - that by definition it would leave behind a proportion of the people. How could it be else?
 
Last edited:

Ghost1951

Esteemed Pedelecer
Jun 2, 2024
1,579
623
It's the continuation of British class system. Clarkson doesn't want to pay tax after he dies. I reckon his children will inherit more than 95% of us, so 1 mil tax free, then normal allowances then 20% on the rest seems more than fair to me compared to zero concessions and 40% standard IHT.
What rot. Class system? Clarkson's dad was a travelling salesman and his mother was a teacher. They had little money until his mum had a bright idea. He isn't the earl of Somerset. Those kinds of people are an anachronism these days - look at that useless pillock Charles III and his offspring Harry the buffoon.

Some people succeed because they are clever and diligent and they make money. You want to prevent that.
 

Ghost1951

Esteemed Pedelecer
Jun 2, 2024
1,579
623
What's wrong with that? Nothing. Sort of. Clarkson's mother made the most of an opportunity available at the time to make her/their wealth, but it couldn't happen today. Anybody attempting this now would be met with an angry lawsuit due to blatant IP theft.
The Clarksons were sued by the writer of the Paddington books - Micheal Bond. They settled with him and gave him a proportion of the profits that suited all concerned and he became a good friend of theirs.

I doubt they ever expected the Bears to take off as they did. It started out on teh kitchen table as a cheap Christmas present for Jeremy and his sister.
 

Woosh

Trade Member
May 19, 2012
20,361
16,869
Southend on Sea
wooshbikes.co.uk
What rot. Class system? Clarkson's dad was a travelling salesman and his mother was a teacher. They had little money until his mum had a bright idea. He isn't the earl of Somerset. Those kinds of people are an anachronism these days - look at that useless pillock Charles III and his offspring Harry the buffoon.

Some people succeed because they are clever and diligent and they make money. You want to prevent that.
It's the 'they are not going to get my money after I die'.
What if everyone behaves the same way?
What if the same family conserves their wealth generation after generation like the royal family?
What if nobody wants to pay tax?
 

Ghost1951

Esteemed Pedelecer
Jun 2, 2024
1,579
623
It's the 'they are not going to get my money after I die'.
What if everyone behaves the same way?
What if the same family conserves their wealth generation after generation like the royal family?
What if nobody wants to pay tax?
Have you missed the fact that he whole of Clarkson's persona and his entire success has been made on the back of his willingness to say outrageous things. I remember his piece in the Times on why sparrows should be exterminated because having moved to the countryside he was being woken at four in the morning by sparrows chirping outside his bedroom window in summer. He suggested that next morning he would go out with his shot gun and shoot them.

It is what he does. It is what he has always done and no doubt he is laughing all the way to the bank about how much the left hate him because they can't see he is a joker contrarian and that this is what has made him a household name and a millionaire. In fact if you watch the Clarkson's Farm series, you will see how much care he takes to foster wild life on the land he owns.

You missed the joke maybe and the joke may be on you.
 

danielrlee

Esteemed Pedelecer
May 27, 2012
1,394
723
Westbury, Wiltshire
torquetech.co.uk
The Clarksons were sued by the writer of the Paddington books - Micheal Bond. They settled with him and gave him a proportion of the profits that suited all concerned and he became a good friend of theirs.

I doubt they ever expected the Bears to take off as they did. It started out on teh kitchen table as a cheap Christmas present for Jeremy and his sister.
I didn't know that, but continuing to research the matter elsewhere is very interesting reading. I can't believe Michael Bond never thought of entering into manufacturing himself!
 
  • Like
Reactions: Ghost1951

flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
53,182
30,597
It's the 'they are not going to get my money after I die'.
What if everyone behaves the same way?
What if the same family conserves their wealth generation after generation like the royal family?
What if nobody wants to pay tax?
We are half way there already!
.
 
  • :D
Reactions: Woosh

guerney

Esteemed Pedelecer
Sep 7, 2021
11,382
3,234
How can tiny governments tax untrackable crypto? Let's hope the USA doesn't start a worldwide trend impossible to row back. One of my customers asked me to make him a crypto mining farm above a property he leases out, using the tenant's electricity. Bitcoin mining was still viable using small rigs at the time, so he wanted a way to convert and hide his wealth using another crypto farm at his house. I quoted him a huge price to make him go away, so he did. I'm sure he found someone else. He now lives a wild life in Dubai.
 
Last edited:
  • :D
  • Like
Reactions: Woosh and Ghost1951

AndyBike

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 8, 2020
1,388
588
You are mistaken in that joke you make about yourself - perhaps because you subscribe to left wing dogma.

In the time before about 1950. This country was so ridden by classist attitudes that bright and intelligent people came up against an armoured glass ceiling - a CLASS CEILING which largely prevented them from accessing other than menial work. It was almost impossible for them to access the professions or in most cases to progress into higher managerial roles. The country prior to WW2 and during it, was very far from being a meritocracy.

The term Meritocracy is now self explanatory, but it was coined by Michael young, who wrote a book, 'The Rise of the Meritocracy' in 1958, expressing his concerns about some of the outcomes of judging people on their ability.

The reason for this was of course the inescapable fact that intelligence and capability are not equally distributed in the population and that some people are of below average mental capability, most people are about the average (give or take) and that some are very much cleverer.

View attachment 60903

Micheal Young was of the left, though he did not deny these obvious FACTS about the distribution of IQ, and every other physical characteristic in the population. The same is true of height, performance at sport, swiftness of foot in sprinting, or in endurance at marathon running and in musical and artistic ability. The differences between people,are ALL distributed as shown for IQ in the chart above. It is called the Normal Curve, because it shows the norm of how these qualities differ on a population basis.

Going back a little - Pre WW2, thicko rich people ran the army. They were given these positions because of their perceived 'breeding' and the officer class was pretty much entirely made up of such people - not that all of them were stupid, but the stupid were among them.

Was intelligence then a matter of social class?

No it was not. There were plenty of intelligent people in the working class (just as you pointed out) and their still are. Back then, they were PREVENTED from progressing not only in the military, but also in all professions and with very few exceptions in management and industry. It was even worse among women. It was truly a time of the CLASS ceiling.

Post war a massive change occurred, the time of meritocracy was born. Grammar schools and technical schools were at the heart of the 1944 Education Act. Bright boys and girls from whatever class poured into these institutions, went to university and into management roles in business and industry. They poured into the professions.

Did all bright boys and girls do this?

No -they did not, and to a very small extent, this is still the case. Parental attitudes prevent it, as do financial worries. There are still bright boys and girls leaving school early to go to work so that they can contribute to family finances, but the number doing this is vastly smaller than it used to be.

Michael Young who coined the term 'Meritocracy' was most concerned at what would happen to those who did not do well at 'merit'. He could see an unfairness in the fact that the stupid would be undervalued in a society which prized merit. He also thought that people who were intelligent, had actually done nothing themselves to deserve their gifts. An intelligent person has been blessed - it can not be denied. He has not achieved intelligence by himself.

By the way - as a man from an ordinary (poor in financial terms) background and the first in his family to ever attend a place of higher education, I know boys who were cleverer than me who went into trades. Although the gateway to higher education was well open by the time I went to secondary school in 1962, not every bright kid came through that gate.

If I were you, I would not even entertain the idea that a furniture maker must be thick. I would not says so and I never ever thought it. On the contrary, a man who can make furniture not only is possessed of wonderful skills, he has the capacity to make a very good living, way better these days than many who graduate from university. Not only that, but he could not do his work if he had not been blessed with intelligence.

These days, people are noticing that the country has areas blighted by under achievement and there are fears that the time of meritocracy may have ended. WE have sink estates blighted by inter generational unemployment crime and under achievement.

This fact is not the result of some sort of upper class plot. It is what we might have expected, given the rise of meritocracy and the heritability of intelligence. All sensible academic work on this subject (now bizarrely discounted and cancelled by the left) shows that at least 60% of intelligence is purely down to genes. This leaves 40% due to other factors such as, attention given to early childhood learning, cultural transmission of good values - work ethic and so on through family and school. The attention in infancy to language development and concept development are crucial to teh development of the 40% of intelligence not related to genes. Indeed, it is also related to the expression of the 60% which is genetic. A child deprived of stimulation will never achieve its potential.

I make damned sure that the time I spend with my five grandchildren, and my partner's grandchildren, is devoted to talking, listening and showing them the differences between things, so that they rapidly develop a more sophisticated view of the world.

Not all children have these advantages. Society needs to make a proper contribution.

It is completely unsurprising to me that some sink estates show consistently bad outcomes for children and young people and that we now see inter generational crime and unemployment . I and my two siblings were brought up in a home filled with encouragement by bright parents whose prospects were limited by the fact that they were born in 1920 and 1923. They passed on above average intelligence to their children and encouraged - more like insisted, on hard work and decency, and the desire to get on. We lived in a council house. We had no money. I remember my mother sitting on occasion in tears when my father's entire pay packet was handed to her as it always was. All of us children went on to graduate professions. We never occupied council accommodation after leaving home. Just like millions of others after the 1960s we made our own way and though not rich were never poor. Those housing estates once lived in by people with a wide range of intellectual ability - a great many held back by circumstance and the CLASS CEILING, began to be occupied only by those whose capabilities were more limited. I think this is why we see a fall in what is called social mobility. The brighter harder working people have moved out of them once they were not held back by society.

I have no answer to the problem of what to do about sink estates and the rump of people who can not succeed in trades, in management, industry, or in the professions, but it is my honest opinion that no one and no class is holding back those children who come from these families. I think they are held back by the nature and ability of their families.

Michael Young was perhaps right about Meritocracy - that by definition it would leave behind a proportion of the people. How could it be else?
OK I admit it lol, my IQ is about 134. I didnt want to add that and play into your narrative.

But i did like your bit that i cant be thick, being leftwing. which kind of suggests many righties are pudding heads
Though i suppose you just need to lok at the footage of the farage riots to see the wide range of knuckledraggers
 
  • Like
Reactions: flecc

AndyBike

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 8, 2020
1,388
588
Those tests no good. You can add 40 points or more by doing a lot of tests.
I was tested at college and struggled in an aspect(sociability, wasnt happy in a crowd giving speech etc) , so they tested me for autism. Part of it is an IQ measurement.
So thats the only test I've taken via a clinical psychologist
According to the psychologist i've aspergers, confirmed by the national autistic society
 

Woosh

Trade Member
May 19, 2012
20,361
16,869
Southend on Sea
wooshbikes.co.uk
Have you missed the fact that he whole of Clarkson's persona and his entire success has been made on the back of his willingness to say outrageous things. I remember his piece in the Times on why sparrows should be exterminated because having moved to the countryside he was being woken at four in the morning by sparrows chirping outside his bedroom window in summer. He suggested that next morning he would go out with his shot gun and shoot them.

It is what he does. It is what he has always done and no doubt he is laughing all the way to the bank about how much the left hate him because they can't see he is a joker contrarian and that this is what has made him a household name and a millionaire. In fact if you watch the Clarkson's Farm series, you will see how much care he takes to foster wild life on the land he owns.

You missed the joke maybe and the joke may be on you.
I only made the point about his protesting has nothing to do with this inheritance tax is killing farming but rather self serving.
I watch a few times the life of young farmers on the BBC.
If people like him stop splashing their cash buying up the best farms and pushing prices up, the young farmers may have a better chance to buy their own farms.
 
  • Like
Reactions: flecc

lenny

Esteemed Pedelecer
May 3, 2023
2,587
768
‘Scarecrows’ protest outside Parliament ahead of grocery supply chain debate
More than 110,000 people have signed a petition pressing the Government to overhaul the grocery supply code of practice to better protect farmers.

“Our 49 scarecrows outside Parliament illustrate the 49% of farmers on the brink of leaving our industry, and I hope this hammers home to those in power the sheer scale of the problem and the urgent need for change.
“Without fairer treatment for farmers, the reality is the destruction of British farming along with the landscape, wildlife and rural communities it once supported.
“For farmers, the clock is ticking. We urge the Government to take action now to safeguard the future of British agriculture.”


 

MikelBikel

Esteemed Pedelecer
Jun 6, 2017
906
329
Ireland
Another right wing yt channel that pushed brexit, which has cost the UK £100 billion in lost income.

The farmers share the blame for that with 66% of them voting for brexit.

Besides any business should pay inheritance tax, just like the rest of us and especially ones that are valued at £3m

Do you see the telegraph, the daily mail, gb news coming forward to fight for some south Asian business owner so he is exempt from taxation when passing the business down to his kids ?

The truth is these media giants, whom are owned by billionaires do not give a crap about small businesses or small farms, their concern is primarily to do with land owners who bought the land not to produce food but as a method of tax avoidance.
Like James Dyson. Top brexit promoter, bought land to avoid tax, and post brexit took his company to the EU
Or Jacob Rees Mogg, another brexit exponent, whom after getting brexit tok his £70m investments out the UK
Richard Tice. made millions off brexit.

I dont understand why people listen to these thieves, after all they couldnt give a rats about the common man, or the smaller farmer for that matter. Their allegiance is to their own ilk and their own pocket.

Farage,Tice Mogg and others want all social security to be gone, for the nhs to be private, because it would save them 2% or 3% off their tax bill
Then start with King Charlie, the biggest farmland owner, and all the hedge funds buying the land. Exempt *real* farmers with the same test as per *original AHA*. After all, gov said it "wouldn't affect many farmers". Well it won't bring in much money then, will it? Mm? ;)
 
  • Like
Reactions: flecc