Leaving the EU

[tillson]

It might surprise you to learn that I quite admire Jeremy Corbin. I admire the fact that he is not afraid to state who he is and what he represents. This is done in the full knowledge that it may not be a popular view and is likely to earn him a kicking in the press. That requires moral courage and is a good character trait in a public figure.

I thought it was disgusting how he was bullied into singing the national anthem last year. It's his choice and he will live with and take the consequences of his decision.

Even though I disagree with some of his views, I'd rather vote for Corbin than other weathervane politicians. You just don't know what you are getting with so many of them.

 

[trex]

spotted on twitter today:

 

[flecc]

spotted on twitter today:

Brilliant, I'd made this comparison a little while ago, it's surprisingly apt.

Vladimir Vladimirovich Putin must be inwardly smiling at the prospects!
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[tillson]

I'm not sure about either of them, but there is no mystery surrounding their popularity. Both speak in a way which reflects the feelings and concerns of the mass population. All the others keep, taking things on board, drawing lines under things, move forward, get it, understand, hear what the people are saying and then do nothing. It's almost like they have lost the ability to differentiate between activity and action, focusing exclusively on the former. People are sick of it and that's why Trump is so popular, they feel that he will actually do something. It's that simple.

I was reading a first 100 days of Trump pledge the other day. This included a ban on Muslims entering the country, a wall to keep Mexicans out and I think some additional electricity on the border to supplement the wall. This all sounds like good news to me and I hope that it happens. It's far too dangerous to ignore these threats and hope that we can protect ourselves with tea lights and chanting.

The polls indicate that despite the BBC's best efforts, UKIP is still gaining ground too and hopefully this indicates the wind is blowing in favour of BREXIT. Go UKIP! Go Farage! Your country needs you.

Edit: Latest signs are that the wooden horse is being pulled through the city gates in London. What were you thinking of in that voting booth? God help you.

 

[trex]

...
I was reading a first 100 days of Trump pledge the other day. This included a ban on Muslims entering the country, a wall to keep Mexicans out and I think some additional electricity on the border to supplement the wall. This all sounds like good news to me and I hope that it happens. It's far too dangerous to ignore these threats and hope that we can protect ourselves with tea lights and chanting..

he can get his wall but I don't think he can fulfil some of his wackier pledges like getting Mexico to pay for it or banning Muslims to enter the country or scrapping Obama care. There are plenty of potential legal challenges from those affected by his decisions.

 

[flecc]

Latest signs are that the wooden horse is being pulled through the city gates in London. What were you thinking of in that voting booth? God help you.

Of course, just as I told you the outcome, we know our city.

And we will continue to thrive as we always do, showing the rest of the country how to succeed. Of course the rest of the country won't take any notice and will in the main continue to fail while being certain of their rightness.

What this election already shows with it's much better than expected Labour and Conservative positions and our new London mayor is that dirty tricks and lies about each other haven't paid off.

What the politicians still don't seem to realise is that if we don't believe them when speaking about their own activities, we are no more likely to believe them when speaking about their rivals.
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[tillson]

Of course, just as I told you the outcome, we know our city.

And we will continue to thrive as we always do, showing the rest of the country how to succeed. Of course the rest of the country won't take any notice and will in the main continue to fail while being certain of their rightness.

What this election already shows with it's much better than expected Labour and Conservative positions and our new London mayor is that dirty tricks and lies about each other haven't paid off.

What the politicians still don't seem to realise is that if we don't believe them when speaking about their own activities, we are no more likely to believe them when speaking about their rivals.
.

Still think it's a mistake.

 

[flecc]

Still think it's a mistake.

Time will tell, but it will be easy to get rid of him at any point if he steps well out of line. We showed that with Lutfur Rahman, demonstrating how safe our London systems are these days. A pity the same isn't true for our national government.
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[gray198]

Of course, just as I told you the outcome, we know our city.

And we will continue to thrive as we always do, showing the rest of the country how to succeed. Of course the rest of the country won't take any notice and will in the main continue to fail while being certain of their rightness.

What this election already shows with it's much better than expected Labour and Conservative positions and our new London mayor is that dirty tricks and lies about each other haven't paid off.

What the politicians still don't seem to realise is that if we don't believe them when speaking about their own activities, we are no more likely to believe them when speaking about their rivals.
.

Maybe London thrives because the government puts more resources into it and starves the North of funding

 

[flecc]

Maybe London thrives because the government puts more resources into it and starves the North of funding

The reverse of the truth, over the years all the central government does is transfer everything out to the sticks. They transferred out all of our industries, then transferring so many of the government functions. Then they started a campaign of pressure, bribes and persuasion to get such things as insurance companies and many company head offices to move away. The list of losses we've sufffered is endless.

In addition the wealth we earn is used to support the provinces, most of our income taken from us every year. It's all done in the name of trying to make the provinces more successful, but has meant we have to constantly create new wealth. Fortunately we are good at that, but we do resent the constant drain of what we create.

Other regions often don't succeed simply because they resist change and innovation. You only have to read the jingoistic anti-immigration and anti-EU posts in this forum to see that. Here in London we welcome immigration, including all nationalities from the EU mainland. The white British born being well under half the population clearly demonstrates that. It's an old formula for success of course, new blood and open minds, one the USA used to good effect long ago.
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[D8ve]

Which democratic system is this? Is it the one where a party secures 12.6% if the vote and those voters are then represented by 1 MP, whilst anther party secures only 4.7% of the vote and those voters are then represented by 56 MPs?

Or is it the democratic process where the party who has the biggest proportion of MEPs and who also forced the EU referendum is then sidelined in debate over EU membership?

I am of course talking about UKIP and if any of their candidates had done a fraction of what Khan has done, they would have been hounded and victimised by the media. Also, they would do the decent thing and stand down.

As I say, if Londoners vote that Khan into office they will thoroughly deserve what follows.

The major difference is the 4.7% were a majority vote in the areas where they stood. It was a massive vote in % terms as they all defeated the opposition with zero votes in Southwark or Wimbledon.
The 12 % vote was spread very thinly. Not representing a majority in all but one constituency. Therefor local accountability was truly represented.

 

[tillson]

The major difference is the 4.7% were a majority vote in the areas where they stood. It was a massive vote in % terms as they all defeated the opposition with zero votes in Southwark or Wimbledon.
The 12 % vote was spread very thinly. Not representing a majority in all but one constituency. Therefor local accountability was truly represented.

Yes, what you describe is indeed a failing of the first past the post electoral system.

A thin 12% divided by a fat 5% multiplied by Nicola Stugeon's fanny diameter all raised to the power of George Osborne's Jap's eye doesn't really work for me. I'm a simple man, so let's consider the following;

It can never be right, under any circumstances, for a 5% section of the population to be given 5500% more representation and say in the running of the country than a much bigger 12% section of the people. That is what happened at the last election and it's wrong. Plain and simple wrong.

 

[D8ve]

Yes, what you describe is indeed a failing of the first past the post electoral system.

A thin 12% divided by a fat 5% multiplied by Nicola Stugeon's fanny diameter all raised to the power of George Osborne's Jap's eye doesn't really work for me. I'm a simple man, so let's consider the following;

It can never be right, under any circumstances, for a 5% section of the population to be given 5500% more representation and say in the running of the country than a much bigger 12% section of the people. That is what happened at the last election and it's wrong. Plain and simple wrong.

And how many would have voted for Nicola had they anyone to vote for in Surrey? The lack of candidates or options to vote SNP was ridiculous here near Bath! The raw numbers are not useful for statistical analysis. Remember it might have been an effective local anti labour vote.
The numbers disparity is invalid the 4.7% of total population of the U.K. Is not a good measure when it was only around 8% who had the chance to vote for them.
Vs 90+% who had a chance to vote the other way.

 

[tillson]

And how many would have voted for Nicola had they anyone to vote for in Surrey? The lack of candidates or options to vote SNP was ridiculous here near Bath! The raw numbers are not useful for statistical analysis. Remember it might have been an effective local anti labour vote.
The numbers disparity is invalid the 4.7% of total population of the U.K. Is not a good measure when it was only around 8% who had the chance to vote for them.
Vs 90+% who had a chance to vote the other way.

I can't believe what I'm reading here.

You can't extrapolate and award power and influence based on a "what if?" scenario. That's not only wrong, it's dangerous as well, but I'm sure Jimmy Crankie will agree with you.

 

[D8ve]

I can't believe what I'm reading here.

You can't extrapolate and award power and influence based on a "what if?" scenario. That's not only wrong, it's dangerous as well, but I'm sure Jimmy Crankie will agree with you.

Well, as local electoral groups such as Scotland are undemocratic and you find them invalid lets apply your reasoning. Let's go by the majority vote. The EU parlement is the larger group. They should then not be concerned about the
Feelings of a minor electoral party such as currently govern the uk.
Either local people can elect a representative locally to represent the majority. Or the EU rules, your choice, one law for all!

 

[tillson]

I

Well as local electoral groups such as Scotland are undemocratic and you find them invalid , fair enough. Let's go by the majority vote. The EU parlement is the larger group. They should then not be concerned about the
Feelings of a minor electoral party such as currently govern the uk.
Either local people can elect a representative locally to represent the majority. Or the EU rules, your choice, one law for all!

What you are proposing is a return to 18th century Rotten Boroughs. People died in pursuit of overturning that system.

I'm sure the EU (Germany) would love to have total freedom to rule over us without fear of losing power regardless of what they do. This is what they are working towards and why we must vote out.

 

[D8ve]

If you can't see the irony in your statements then it's time to stop bye

 

[flecc]

Or the EU rules, your choice, one law for all!

That's my choice, far better than Westminster ruling. Here's another current example of how much better the EU looks after us than our rotten UK national governments.

The EU have a new measure coming in, giving everyone a right to a bank account.

The UK government are preparing their version, which is a right to ask for a bank account.

In other words, no right at all, a foretaste of what David Cameron's proposed Bill of Rights will offer in place of the excellent Human Rights Act.
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[trex]

found this on twitter today:

 

[tillson]

If you can't see the irony in your statements then it's time to stop bye

Are you actually suggesting that there is irony in the case of the U.K. which is small by comparison to the EU as a whole, wanting to leave, against the wishes of the larger EU body? And the irony originates from the fact that I am promoting proportional representation and if we took the EU as a whole, the UK's proportion of the vote would not enable us to leave because it's insignificantly small. Is that it? Am I getting warm?

If that's is it I'm afraid you are very poorly and need to seek specialist care as soon as possible before you harm someone.

Hopefully you will never have any influence and your logic will remain in history books focusing on unreformed 18th century politics.