Well, exactly so, and the presense of this type of reporting reporting is being used to deliberatly misslead people, I refer to this link;
Absolutely - and another misuse of data by anti-vaccine campaigns is to wave around data which shows that the majority of people dying now of covid-19 are vaccinated people. This is true, but it makes no reference when quoted against vaccination, of the obvious fact that the vast majority of adults of the most vulnerable groups are vaccinated. In the high risk categories - the aged and immuno compromised, the numbers are in the high nineties percent. Most of the current deaths are of those with immune deficiencies, ie those with serious illness compromising their immunity, or the very aged whose immune system is weak. All vaccines require that the recipient mounts an immune response to the vaccine, so that would be bound to be the case.
If we're trying to have a serious and sensible conversation here, then simply replying with B.S. and nothing else is a complete waste of time and doesn't reflect particularly well on the intellect of the poster.
This pretty well destroys that idea:
No it doesn't. 87% of that sample were over sixty years old. Older people were always at much greater risk from CV19 and they also have weaker immune systems. Like all vaccination, these vaccines require a functional immune system to work. You can't produce antibodies unless your immune system is working, so old people are both more at risk and more likely to get a less than stellar response in terms of anti-bodies. So it is to be expected that some old, and immune compromised people who are not old, will catch the disease after vaccination. This does not affect the fact that very large numbers have been taken out of the situation of grave illness. The hospitalisation numbers and deaths have collapsed in well vaccinated populations.This pretty well destroys that idea:
Nearly 60% of hospitalized COVID-19 patients in Israel fully vaccinated, data shows
Of 514 patients in Israel hospitalized with COVID-19 as of Aug. 15, 59 percent were fully vaccinated, according to an Aug. 16 report from Science, citing a study from Israel's largest HMO. The figures suggest breakthrough infections may be more common than the term implies.www.beckershospitalreview.com
You need to understand what that article was for. The data reported was already circulating, so the pro-vaxers got Beckers Hospital Review to write a pro-vax piece. You'll note that the original report on which they were commenting had actual data, but the bit you highlighted has no data, no names and no references. It's basically, "a bloke said...". Who is the growing body of research - some fat bloke sitting in his basement eating pizzas and writing political hit-pieces instead of doing a proper job?
The only person characterising the originator of the opinion that the unvaccinated face a far higher risk from covid, than from being vaccinated as, ' a fat bloke in a cellar eating pizza', is you old chap. The piece described the opinion as being the common opinion of health officials, but that aside, the opinion is not even an opinion; it is a fact, supported by a large amount of data, a small part of which I linked to for you, but you seem to have ignored.
and ill get my cart and toe it with my ebike I look at data, see where it came from, think about whether it's plausible, think about all the mechanisms behind it, then try and make sense of what's going on. That's the same technique for ebikes as I use for medical matters, social matters and anything else. It's called pragmatism.
I'd have thought that an open minded individual looking at data like this :
Deaths have been rising steadily since June, from 0.1 per million then to 1.65 now.
No real surprise there though; as we moved from lockdown to freely mixing you would expect the death rate to rise.
Yes, Euros and removed lockdown have had their effect, and schools back will probably increase that. I think most of us agree on the overall picture and the role of vaccination; I'm just concerned stating falsehoods weakens our arguments even if the argument is itself sound.
I think the trick is to try and read a mixture of sources.
covid.joinzoe.com
www.theguardian.com
www.independent.co.uk
Or there's the risk based approach of pedelec members Chainring and POLLY.I think the trick is to try and read a mixture of sources.
Raws stats from the UK gov:
Adverse reaction stats (UK):
Zoe (UK):
Latest Daily UK COVID-19 Data: Vaccines, Cases, Trends | ZOE
COVID infection & vaccination rates in the UK today, based on public data and reports from millions of users of the ZOE Health Study app
General worldwide stats (US-based):
Opinion (i.e. dare to read a newspaper you'd never actually pay money for!):
News, sport and opinion from the Guardian's UK edition | The Guardian
Latest news, sport, business, comment, analysis and reviews from the Guardian, the world's leading liberal voiceNews | The Independent | Today's headlines and latest breaking news | The Independent
The latest breaking news, comment and features from The Independent.Telegraph
Latest news, business, sport, comment, lifestyle and culture from the Daily Telegraph and Sunday Telegraph newspapers and video from Telegraph TV.www.telegraph.co.uk
I don't bother with FB or Whatsapp sources because only the more sensational stuff will flow to the top.
Yes. If you don't want to spend too much time John Hopkins University does an excellent job of collating reliable (or as reliable as possible) sources, and they are well presented for exploration by the Oxford group, link below.
You have to take the death rate alongside the general rate of infections. It is rising, because infections are rising, but the graph I linked to above of hospital cases shows it is massively lower than the last time we had a large spike of infections. My post was not inaccurate at all. You misunderstood it - which might be partly my fault for not making it clear enough.
Yes - exactly - because there are now more infections, and the new variant is ideally suited to take advantage of fewer social barriers, and spreads so easily.
Or maybe not.
