Can anyone recommend a good bike for hill climbing and distance

[Jon Timmis]

It's worse with ebikes because the range is affected by how hard you pedal. Some systems force you to pedal hard, so that the proportion of power that you provide is higher. Not surprisingly, they tend to go further than ones where you can take a rest and let the bike do the work.

Yes that is a good point...One thing I liked about the Volt bikes was that you could actually vary the way the assistance came in and set you own power levels.

I did find it funny actually looking at the looking at the number of bikes that have the Bafang 8FUN 250W motor and very similar batteries seemed to do very dissimilar distances...and yes I know this depends on the rider, the way the controller is setup, etc etc but it shows the complexity of what should be comparing what should be apples with apples.

 

[Alan Quay]

Is that with the 47v 8.8aH battery (440wH)?

If so, it equates to 5.87 wH/mile, which is equivalent to an average of about 70w for the whole 120km, or about 1.4 amps. To climb steep hills you need about 600w with hard pedalling, or 1200w with light pedalling.

It's the same old thing that I thought we'd bottomed out on this forum: You can either pedal yourself and go a long way, or use the motor to help you and go not so far. The more power you get from the motor, the less distance you can go. No smoke and mirrors or amounts of love can change that.

All range claims by any supplier are absolutely meaningless, and shouldn't be used for any comparison purposes.

I wonder what power is required to offset the additional weight of the electric bits? If it's anywhere near 70 watts.....

 

[Cyclezee]

All range claims by any supplier are absolutely meaningless, and shouldn't be used for any comparison purposes.

Which is why we only claim what is possible in the real world by the average human being who needs assistance.

 

[Jon Timmis]

I wonder if the British Electric Bicycle Association could pull together all their members and invest in a joint system that would use the Google mapping API details to allow customers to see what the likely distance they could travel on the specific bikes with different batteries and power settings.

The Google API already has all the data on distance, elevation and bicycle paths. If the manufacturers were to input the speeds, battery usage on different elevations it should give purchasers as accurate a possible way of comparison.

Such a system could also allow the user to know how long each route would take, and compare how much they would save on fuel vs a car etc.

Does this sound like a good idea?

I would have no idea about how to program this as it would go way over my database skills but I could help someone to spec this out
if any of the companies in this thread like to take this forward at all with the BEBA/on their own at all?

 

[Artstu]

Woosh have one http://wooshbikes.co.uk/clearway.php

I also found this one accurate for me http://www.electricbikerange.info/Electric_bike_range.html

 

[Deleted member 4366]

It's very simple. The more watt-hours in the battery, the more help you get from it. You can use those watt-hours slowly with a little bit of help or fast and get a lot more help. The factors that affect efficiency of the system are too insignificant to make a significant difference. The difference between the systems can make a difference to range by giving you more or less help than you need in some situations, but not significant difference in efficiency depending on how you define efficiency.

 

[Jon Timmis]

Woosh have one http://wooshbikes.co.uk/clearway.php

I also found this one accurate for me http://www.electricbikerange.info/Electric_bike_range.html

I like both but I think the second one is brilliant...I will try this with a number of different bikes I am thinking about.

Still not going to 100% but gives a good idea

 

[EddiePJ]

I wonder how something like this would fit into the required spec. http://www.ebay.de/itm/Haibike-eQ-XDURO-Trekking-SL-HR-RGr-52-27-G-SRAM-Elektrofahrrad-Bosch-400WH-NEU-/271368099567?pt=Sport_Radsport_Fahrrad_Anhänger&hash=item3f2ecc96ef

 

[shemozzle999]

This will climb you hills but won't get you to work unless you buy a bigger battery.
It is poorly titled so might go cheap:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/191034097316?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1438.l2649

totally illegal ofcourse

 

[Jon Timmis]

I like both of them but trying to stay legal

 

[shemozzle999]

It will be difficult to stay legal with your requirements but I think you already know that.

 

[trex]

I like both of them but trying to stay legal

If you could commute 50 miles a day on a legal bike for a week, I'll donate £100 to any charity of your choice.

You know what, a Focus bike with Xion motor (same as in the Pro Connect Xion) beat the KTM in a mountain test run by the German E-Bike magazine last year, achieving a greater distance and reaching a higher elevation than the KTM.

If you buy an electric bike without trying a Kalkhoff or Focus, it's unlikely you've bought the best bike.
View attachment 7677

Both the KTM and the Kalkhoff run out of battery after barely 10 miles. How can you suggest to the OP to use these bikes for his 50 miles commute?
not only he has to have two chargers, what happens if he forgets to charge the battery at work or at home?
The hill i the test is only 9.8% - not very steep.
The Kalkhoff went up the hill at slightly lower speed (8.18mph) against the KTM (8.47mph) and yet, the total consumption (613WH from battery + 158WH from cyclist) 711WH = 49.11WH/km for the Kalkhoff against (499WH from battery + 149WH from cyclist) 648WH = 43.78WH/km for the KTM.
The KTM is faster and more energy efficient.

 

[greencat]

Yes...I was looking to pickup the Leeds Liverpool canal at Saltaire in Bradford which should make it somewhat easier for that portion of the ride.

A few things to consider if you do. It gets pretty muddy in places during the winter, has a few quite bumpy sections and a few dark and lonely spots too. That said, I never had any occasion to worry when I cycled/ran down it.

And I also used to know someone who would regularly commute from Armley to Saltaire on it using an electric bike so it's certainly doable.

 

[peerjay56]

Yes...I was looking to pickup the Leeds Liverpool canal at Saltaire in Bradford which should make it somewhat easier for that portion of the ride.

Don't be fooled by the good condition of the towpath in Leeds and near Salts Mill. In many places it is extremely rough and certainly very muddy. You would struggle to achieve a good commuting speed on these stretches (ie the Rodley to Apperley Bridge stretch).

 

[peerjay56]

What an unedifying spectacle it is when (some of) the traders start circling in for the kill. Sorry, I meant sale
The posts on this forum by some of the traders have guaranteed that I for one will not be purchasing from them

 

[shemozzle999]

Using Google go to "Get Directions",select their beta bike route then type in Halifax and Leeds and it comes out at 18miles:

https://maps.google.co.uk/maps?hl=en&tab=wl

 

[greencat]

Don't be fooled by the good condition of the towpath in Leeds and near Salts Mill. In many places it is extremely rough and certainly very muddy. You would struggle to achieve a good commuting speed on these stretches (ie the Rodley to Apperley Bridge stretch).

Yes, you'd definitely want front suspension if you were going to attempt that stretch at a decent speed. Parts of it will be pitch dark after 4.30pm in the winter too.

 

[RobF]

I agree this 24-mile commute is not doable on an ebike, day in, day out.

But the OP says he is going to start doing part of it, which is fair enough.

How is the rest of the journey to be accomplished?

If I read the posts correctly, it's by train.

Lumping a heavy ebike through a station and on and off a train is not going to be easy, even if the operator allows it.

So my suggestion would be that 20" semi-folder made by AVE.

Quality Bosch bike, the balloon tyres ought to be able to handle a rough path, and it's a lot more train friendly.

http://www.onbike.co.uk/ave-mh-7.html

 

[KTM Bike Industries UK]

I agree this 24-mile commute is not doable on an ebike, day in, day out.

But the OP says he is going to start doing part of it, which is fair enough.

How is the rest of the journey to be accomplished?

If I read the posts correctly, it's by train.

Lumping a heavy ebike through a station and on and off a train is not going to be easy, even if the operator allows it.

So my suggestion would be that 20" semi-folder made by AVE.

Quality Bosch bike, the balloon tyres ought to be able to handle a rough path, and it's a lot more train friendly.

http://www.onbike.co.uk/ave-mh-7.html

if he uses the canal paths, its pretty flat the whole way, so not going to as hilly as original post suggests, so it is very doable as a commute for a fit cyclist with the assist of a eBike.

I've done a lot of riding around there and even commuted from Pudsey to Delph (28 miles each way with a lot of hills) a lot by bike last summer. Never tried an eBike on that route though.

I'm not sure I'd want 20" wheels on any off road riding even if its "just" an canal path, they amplify the bumps so much, and you just stick in the whole.

Up here there is no issue taking full size bikes on the trains generally, i've certain done it in and out of Manchester with no problems for years.

Col.

 

[EddiePJ]

What an unedifying spectacle it is when (some of) the traders start circling in for the kill. Sorry, I meant sale
The posts on this forum by some of the traders have guaranteed that I for one will not be purchasing from them

Like dogs round a bone, or certainly one person is.

I'm well and truly hooked on my off road riding, and have now pretty much outgrown the BH. I've been looking at alternatives, and I think that it's going to be Haibike all the way. The one product that I have not looked at and won't is KTM. I don't like the farm yard smell that it seems to be attached to it.

Jon, take a look at Haibikes. Martin on here comes across as being a very genuine and passionate guy, and is not at all pushy and OTT about his product. http://www.e-bikeshop.co.uk/ If nothing else, I'm sure that he would offer an unbiased opinion.