Brexit, for once some facts.

[oldtom]

Can you believe that people actually voted for Trump?

I shared that sentiment too but then when I considered how the 'Brexit' fanboys in the UK revere the likes of Farage, Johnson, Gove, Carswell, Nuttall and their ilk, I began to understand.

It then occurred to me that if I began spouting lies like 'There are no racists in UKIP or the Conservative party' for example, or that, 'Nigel Farage and his fellow 'Brexit' architects deserve the highest civilian honour for their bravery and honesty with the British people!' I do believe that I would be worshipped up and down the country and probably in line to replace Nuttall.

Although Trump remains President for the moment, according to my American friends, his popularity has waned considerably and many Americans are very worried and wonder about what he is going to do next.

The realisation that their 'protest vote' against the American political establishment has gone horribly wrong is starting to dawn on people. Now, doesn't that sound rather familiar!

Tom

 

[Woosh]

Your MP s have been bullied into complying with this , and been told that public anger will result if they do not honour ,this.That is bullying and intimidation.

there is and has always been a degree of bullying and intimidation but I think a lot of MPs changed their mind too, not just their stance. It sounds more principled to say that they respect the will of the people that they have simply changed side.
The fact remains that about 400 constituencies voted for brexit, brexit does from that angle represent the will of the people, at the very least, in England.

When bridges are burnt they have to be rebuilt and it is London which is burning the bridges. Rejoining the EU means renegotiating an entire package.

I don't think bridges are burnt.
The Daily Mail and the Express do not represent the view of the majority. For example, most people accept immigration, they only want it controlled to much greater extent than now.

 

[oldtom]

Hansard - Yesterdays House of Lords sitting:

Hansard is not a good read, 'shemozzle999'! I prefer Agatha Christie myself.

Tom

 

[shemozzle999]

Hansard is not a good read, 'shemozzle999'! I prefer Agatha Christie myself.

Tom

I will bite Tom - I prefer fact over fiction.

 

[oldtom]

I will bite Tom - I prefer fact over fiction.

Yes, me too if truth be told. When 'flecc' started this thread, he entitled it, 'Brexit - for once some facts'. Sadly, not many have emerged in almost 12500 posts but this is about politics and that whole area is populated by people who are well-versed in being 'economical with the truth'.

'flecc' is old enough and wise enough to know what was likely to happen when he opened up this line. Indeed, I'm not sure he didn't do it out of devilment! Regardless, it hasn't harmed the readership figures as I have never seen the forum generally quite so busy. Whether that has anything to do with this particular thread, I have no idea - probably just a coincidence. It certainly gets plenty of reads albeit the actual combatants are few in number.

Tom

 

[flecc]

'flecc' is old enough and wise enough to know what was likely to happen when he opened up this line. Indeed, I'm not sure he didn't do it out of devilment!

I can well understand that being thought, but it wasn't my motivation. I opened the thread purely to draw attention to the factual radio program that I linked to, since it gave details of what happens when a country wished to benefit from the EU but restrict immigration.

I honestly didn't expect too many responses at the time. I obviously misjudged that very badly!
.

 

[KTM Bike Industries UK]

there is and has always been a degree of bullying and intimidation but I think a lot of MPs changed their mind too, not just their stance. It sounds more principled to say that they respect the will of the people that they have simply changed side.

ok, you said you've fact checked things you post.

Give us some examples of the "a lot of MPs have changed their minds"

I think you'll find many of them voted against their views, and I'll give you an example.

Barry Sheerman - my MP. - from Feb 1st.

https://twitter.com/BarrySheerman/status/826881966603644930

"With a heavy heart I voted to start the withdrawal from the EU Article 50 !"

I think you'll find those that have voted against what they believe are and will make sure they use phrases like "the will of the people" etc etc. To make sure they are covered if and when it goes tits up, so they can say they were just doing as they were told. It wasn't their idea!

 

[KTM Bike Industries UK]

there

also Southend don't seem to have a record of the tender you claim to have lost because of the evil EU. But when pressed we've discovered it was you local bike shop that won it with support from a bigger company.

So I can only assume you've made this up, unless you of course want to give some details.

Because as I've said - I am interested in which Dutch company are taking an interest in these tenders. Its relevant to our business.

-------------------------------

Dear Colin


Thank you for your email. Apologies for the delay in responding but I have been trying to track this tender down. It appears that this tender opportunity has not been published by the procurement team.


Gillian Shine – Senior Procurement Advisor – Southend-on-Sea Borough Council

Creating a Better Southend

 

[Woosh]

so tell me which local company won it?
you may find that 'local' company was not even formed when the tender was required.

 

[KTM Bike Industries UK]

so tell me which local company won it?
you may find out that 'local' company was not even formed when the tender was required.

You told me it was a local bike shop... I didn't make that bit up lol. You replied to Kudos about them. You even said you knew them.

Now I'm saying Southend have no record of it. So if you want to remember any details, that would be great.

 

[KTM Bike Industries UK]

Wasn't "Brexshit" supposed to be good for the UK?

News in this morning from our currency broker, who has no axe to grind.

"Dear Col,

With the triggering of Article 50 looming, suddenly the economic picture doesn’t look as rosy anymore. We’ve had a string of softer economic data releases, prices are increasing and within short intervals, more and more companies are reporting narrowing margins due to the weak pound. The latest of them was Primark yesterday.

Now there are reports that a new Scottish referendum is being discussed. While the SNP announced at the time that there would only be one referendum in a generation, sentiment has changed in the UK since the Brexit vote. Chances of the UK breaking up made the pound tumble yesterday.

In addition, Prime Minister Theresa May’s statement, that EU citizens may soon have their right to permanently stay in the UK withdrawn, added to uncertainty, while John Major became the latest former Prime Minister to warn the British people that Brexit may have horrendous consequences. A former Northern Ireland Secretary, Peter Hain, raised his concerns about Brexit interfering with the peace process in Northern Ireland."

All sounds good doesn't it.

 

[Woosh]

Now I'm saying Southend have no record of it. So if you want to remember any details, that would be great.

How far back did you go? 2012?

 

[KTM Bike Industries UK]

How far back did you go? 2012?

What are you trying to hide?? I don't understand why you won't share the details?

 

[Woosh]

it is because this is a public forum.

 

[KTM Bike Industries UK]

it is because this is a public forum.

So direct message me, then - there is no need to be so cryptic.

However I still don't get it, the winning company will be obvious to everyone, they won.. The bikes are being ridden around. Why are you worrried about sharing another companies details on here. Surely the information that you lost it is more sensitive?

 

[KTM Bike Industries UK]

Hmmm, scaremondering wasn't it.

Oh no wait, its actually happening, and we've not even left yet.

http://news.sky.com/story/firms-start-to-act-in-self-defence-as-brexit-looms-bcc-survey-10784602

 

[Woosh]

So direct message me, then - there is no need to be so cryptic.

However I still don't get it, the winning company will be obvious to everyone, they won.. The bikes are being ridden around. Why are you worrried about sharing another companies details on here. Surely the information that you lost it is more sensitive?

By principle. I worked in information technology for most of my working life.

 

[KTM Bike Industries UK]

By principle. I worked in information technology for most of my working life.

Well the company that won, will be publically available information, so you have nothing to worry about. So direct message me if you could please.

 

[Woosh]

No, as you said, it's public information and I don't stop you to find out but I don't help you either. I have gone as far as I am willing to.

 

[oldgroaner]

yes. That is to me a sign that democracy is working. Pollsters have until now adjusted their polls to fit previous results, to reflect the average participation of different age groups and social classes. Often, they find that poor, young and less educated people participate much less in politics. Social media change that when the issue is Trump or brexit. More of them came out to vote. Quite right too.

As in the good news is that the air bags worked, Dad?