Brexit, for once some facts.

tillson

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May 29, 2008
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The snag with Farage's plan is the "Next president" might be in office sooner than expected the way this Cartoon Character is acting.
Apparently according the the Wall Street journal 54% of Americans want a Congressional investigation into Trumps links with Putin and Russia.
It's all bullshine from a sour and spiteful liberal media. Investigation closed.

Trump will out-manoeuvre and out-wit them at every turn.
 

tillson

Esteemed Pedelecer
May 29, 2008
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Labour have 2 major problems...
Corbyn just doesn't have ministerial presence,but the prime problem is that they don't have a clearly defined voice over Brexit.
Theresa May is 'Brexit at all costs' whatever the route and the outcome she can claim 'we are abiding by the will of the people'
Corbyn should be brave and take a stance that whilst he agrees with Brexit it is not 'Brexit at all costs' but 'Brexit that makes sense for our country'....he may lose some ardent Brexit votes but attract many of the 16 million Remainers.
KudosDave

It's actually 4 major problems. In addition to what you have said about the leader's presence, they also have a very serious problem with the front bench in the HoC.

The other problem is that very few people like or trust Labour.
 
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tillson

Esteemed Pedelecer
May 29, 2008
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Sour and spiteful media? Corny remark of the day tillson, and trump couldn't outwit a turnip.

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He's become The President of The United States of America. That doesn't happen by accident. It takes a sharp mind, a strategy and a plan. You are falling into the same trap of underestimating your enemy again. Writing them off as idiots. It will result in humiliation!

To win, you must give credit to your opponents strengths and achievements.
 

flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
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30,602
It's actually 4 major problems. In addition to what you have said about the leader's presence, they also have a very serious problem with the front bench in the HoC.

The other problem is that very few people like or trust Labour.
The leader is everything, no matter what bunch accompanies them the right leader is what a party needs. In recent decades Thatcher, Blair and Farage have all shown that to be true, and there's been many more historic examples.

When the voters like a leader, they scarcely look at the rest of their MPs. And when the voters don't like any of the leaders on offer, the electorate lose faith in politics and we have the recent disarray.
.
 

tillson

Esteemed Pedelecer
May 29, 2008
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The leader is everything, no matter what bunch accompanies them the right leader is what a party needs. In recent decades Thatcher, Blair and Farage have all shown that to be true, and there's been many more historic examples.

When the voters like a leader, they scarcely look at the rest of their MPs. And when the voters don't like any of the leaders on offer, the electorate lose faith in politics and we have the recent disarray.
.
I like Corbyn and would vote for more like him. I like his apparent honesty and genuine belief that he can benefit working people. Then I look at the rest of the line up and think, Jesus Christ, never in a million years. What is he thinking of?
 

RobF

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Sep 22, 2012
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He's become The President of The United States of America. That doesn't happen by accident. It takes a sharp mind, a strategy and a plan. You are falling into the same trap of underestimating your enemy again. Writing them off as idiots. It will result in humiliation!

To win, you must give credit to your opponents strengths and achievements.
Absolutely.

The Tories grievously underestimated Blair, thinking it almost comical to see Labour men in suits that fitted - apart from Prescott, but he was still in a suit.

That underestimation led to many years in opposition.
 
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tillson

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The Tories grievously underestimated Blair, thinking it almost comical to see Labour men in suits that fitted - apart from Prescott, but he was still in a suit.
......and a Jaguar, maybe even two. A real man for the working classes.
 
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flecc

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Oct 25, 2006
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I like Corbyn and would vote for more like him. I like his apparent honesty and genuine belief that he can benefit working people. Then I look at the rest of the line up and think, Jesus Christ, never in a million years. What is he thinking of?
But you are tillson. Most of the people who would traditionally vote for labour probably wouldn't be able to name the rest of the line up, or even one of them.

I still remember the typically labour group of people in Liverpool who when interviewed live didn't know there had been an EU referendum.
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RobF

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Sep 22, 2012
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......and a Jaguar, maybe even two. A real man for the working classes.
I met Prescott on the hustings years ago.

Quite aggressive, he was jabbing his finger towards my chest as he attempted to realign my political compass.

No problem with that, I like to see a bit of spirit and commitment.
 

oldgroaner

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Nov 15, 2015
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Apparently according the the Wall Street journal
He's become The President of The United States of America. That doesn't happen by accident. It takes a sharp mind, a strategy and a plan. You are falling into the same trap of underestimating your enemy again. Writing them off as idiots. It will result in humiliation!

To win, you must give credit to your opponents strengths and achievements.
No tillson, like anything else in America Money buys anything, and he is even rubbish at handling that too.
 

tillson

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May 29, 2008
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Apparently according the the Wall Street journal

No tillson, like anything else in America Money buys anything, and he is even rubbish at handling that too.
OK, calm down or else you might lay an egg!

It becomes clearer every day how Farage managed to pull off BREXIT and how Trump won the White House. Insults and slur worked reasonably well in the late 1990s and through into the 2000s. Ordinary voting people now understand the tactic and it is exploding in the faces of the perpetrators in the form of hilarious defeats.
 
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flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
53,197
30,602
It becomes clearer every day how Farage managed to pull off BREXIT and how Trump won the White House. Insults and slur worked reasonably well in the late 1990s and through into the 2000s. Ordinary voting people now understand the tactic and it is exploding in the faces of the perpetrators with hilarious defeats.
Not quite that simple though. Just look at the gross insults and slurs that Trump used on Hilary Clinton. By your reckoning surely that should have lost him the election?

Same goes for Farage, he was very liberal with his insults and slurs.

I think in both cases they succeeded on the failure of others, their electorates finally losing patience with the establishment contenders they'd followed for so long. They just wanted different.
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oldtom

Esteemed Pedelecer
Is there no end to the lies tories will purvey to justify their continuing existence as an apology for a government?

This morning on the Marr show, the interviewer challenged, (ever so gently!), the tory chairman, Patrick McLoughlin, about forthcoming tory cuts to disability benefits.

McLoughlin claimed that his government was 'very generous' to the disabled, spending over £50bn a year on the disabled.

Sadly, as McLoughlin knows perfectly well, that is not the view of the United Nations who just over three months ago published a report, following an investigation into the UK's treatment of people with disabilities.

This is what the UK's Disability News Service had to say about the tory government's policy on the disabled following the UN investigation found that the government was guilty violating the rights of disabled people and in breach of the UN convention.

http://www.disabilitynewsservice.com/uns-conclusion-that-uk-violated-disability-rights-is-vindication-for-activists/

Did Marr press the matter with McLoughlin, knowing that he had avoided a truthful answer and simply trotted out an unlikely statistic to divert attention away from the reality? No, of course he didn't! It really wouldn't have mattered which BBC stooge had asked the question - Robinson or Kuenssberg would have given the liar just as easy a ride - as they are not there to discredit the tory party, being as they are a part of it and paid to support the government line.

If anyone needed any further evidence that the tory party will ride roughshod, not only over the poor and the disabled but over any opposition either at home or internationally-based, it's right here, right now!

Tom
 

oldgroaner

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Nov 15, 2015
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OK, calm down or else you might lay an egg!

It becomes clearer every day how Farage managed to pull off BREXIT and how Trump won the White House. Insults and slur worked reasonably well in the late 1990s and through into the 2000s. Ordinary voting people now understand the tactic and it is exploding in the faces of the perpetrators in the form of hilarious defeats.
What's all this "Calm down" business, I am laughing, not feeling anything other than amusement at your hilarious jokes!
Keep them coming!
 
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