Brexit, for once some facts.

[Kudoscycles]

I can't disagree with you because I am not in possession of sufficient information to construct a counter argument. I would simply be speculating, in much the same way that you have speculated in the above post.

Therein lies the problem....the referendum vote was given to the people of which 99% did not know what they were voting for.....yet we all now have to accept the vote as a done deal.
Trust me,I am in a position to now see what the effect of Brexit will be and for the average guy it will be so bad as to cause social strife in this country,I have never been so certain that Theresa May is leading this country to 1930's style ruin,but as in the great depression it was the poor who will suffer.
KudosDave

 

[Kudoscycles]

I have thought about this this point a lot, because currently all our KTM dealers essentially import from the EU direct to their stores.

So currently if they are VAT registered they hold that stock at 20% less cost because they don't have to pay the VAT to then claim it back again.

If / when we leave, all the imports will be subject to VAT, and handling fees and any tariff - just as they would be from outside the EU currently.

My thinking is the EU won't be as effected as we would be. They currently import from all over the world, so are set up for it. it would just add one more market that they have to deal with.

For the UK however we'd suddenly be in the situation where ALL imports have to clear customs, where currently only 47% of our imports are subject to this delay / cost / hassle.

So this will have the same effect as doubling the work load of customs over night.

KTM are right....fortunately I import little from the EU....but when I bring goods from Asia I have to pay the vat and import duty immediately on import. This can be very large sums,often £100k plus that HMRC just take from my trading account,you lose the duty and claim back the vat....but this can be 5 months later if it falls at the wrong end of the vat quarter.
THis would be very hard on small companies that buy a lot from the EU.,a cashflow nightmare.
KudosDave

 

[oldgroaner]

All of you are making statements regarding the direction and consequences of BREXIT whilst armed with little or no knowledge of how the deal to leave will be handled.

Does it matter really? financial considerations are relatively unimportant compared to the long term consequences of wagering the countries future by delivering it into the hands of a bunch of Pirates.

And that is a charitable way to describe the Westminster Politicians and their attitude to the people, while acknowledging that a few of them are worthy of being described as being worthy of respect.

How the deal will turn out, I neither know, or for that matter care, as when the people make a choice that is as stupid as Brexit, and cling to it when all reason says it is a mistake, then they deserve to have to face the consequences of their actions in the hope that they will find ways to reverse the mistake.

If I am wrong, what does it matter? I am only one voice and in the scheme of things inconsequential.
But if 17,000,000 get it wrong, then that is not something that can be dismissed so easily, nor forgiven and forgotten by the 16,000,000 who have to suffer or their foolishness.
And that is only the ones who voted, many didn't bother as they thought it wouldn't make any difference.

Tell me what kind of logic sees setting one THIRD of the population up as
Being the "Will of the people"
having the right to damage the lives and future of the other TWO THiRDS?

That is insanity, the risk is imminent and immense and the chances of failure too many to be ignored, on a bet that was based on a pack of lies.

 

[oldgroaner]

The UK will be free to trade with other countries on terms yet to be negotiated. Those terms may well include free trade.

I nominate the word MAY as being the fundamental truth behind Brexit.
It is simply a wager, rather of the order of Russian Roulette

 

[anotherkiwi]

That I completely disagree with....I honestly think that this government dont care a damn or have a clue what economic state Brexit brings to our country,Theresa May and Co are only interested in staying in power as the most right wing government,control of our laws and most important control of immigration...Rees-Mogg,Bone,Redwood are about as racist as its possible to be,throw backs to the days of the empire and the Raj.
I dont think May has a clue what will evolve out of Brexit,she just hopes that it will turn out ok...if it doesn't work out that will become someone else's problem.
Where do you think these wonderful trading opportunities will come from??
KudosDave

flecc got the joke Dave, I was mocking tilson's silly comment. I know you are on edge and you are right to be. All business owners in the UK must be having sleepless nights. This can not work short term, we have examples and concrete proof only from the end of last year. No need to talk of "guessing" and "predictions" when we have examples.

Long term maybe a miracle will happen but history teaches us that this thing cannot work and that those on the bottom of the income scale are going to suffer some more.

 

[flecc]

I nominate the word MAY as being the fundamental truth behind Brexit.

What a pity the vote was a month too late, it could have been a May referendum.
.

 

[oldgroaner]

What a pity the vote was a month too late, it could have been a May referendum.
.

legally of course it was!

 

[Lister]

"If I am wrong, what does it matter? I am only one voice and in the scheme of things inconsequential.
But if 17,000,000 get it wrong, then that is not something that can be dismissed so easily, nor forgiven and forgotten by the 16,000,000 who have to suffer or their foolishness.
And that is only the ones who voted, many didn't bother as they thought it wouldn't make any difference.

Tell me what kind of logic sees setting one THIRD of the population up as
Being the "Will of the people"
having the right to damage the lives and future of the other TWO THiRDS?"

Apart from some of the important commercial inputs, this is the most relevant post on this whole topic.

 

[tillson]

"If I am wrong, what does it matter? I am only one voice and in the scheme of things inconsequential.
But if 17,000,000 get it wrong, then that is not something that can be dismissed so easily, nor forgiven and forgotten by the 16,000,000 who have to suffer or their foolishness.
And that is only the ones who voted, many didn't bother as they thought it wouldn't make any difference.

Tell me what kind of logic sees setting one THIRD of the population up as
Being the "Will of the people"
having the right to damage the lives and future of the other TWO THiRDS?"

Apart from some of the important commercial inputs, this is the most relevant post on this whole topic.

You don't know how the 1/3 of the population who didn't vote, would have voted if they were eligible to vote or could have been bothered to get off their arses and make their way to a polling booth.

To default to the assumption that the absent voters would have voted to remain is flawed.

 

[oldgroaner]

You don't know how the 1/3 of the population who didn't vote, would have voted if they were eligible to vote or could have been bothered to get off their arses and make their way to a polling booth.

To default to the assumption that the absent voters would have voted to remain is flawed.

Oh good grief tillson, you are still not pushing that corny line?
It is both nonsense and completely irrelevant.

Just think for a moment about this simple fact of human nature.

If this doesn't work out for the best how many who voted for Brexit will have trouble remembering that they voted FOR Brexit and deny they ever did?
And they will be looking for someone to Blame, rather than themselves.
And so will both those who voted against it or didn't vote at all.

That is the reality we face, and there is nothing theoretical about that.
And that is what makes it so very Dangerous.

And who is it supposed to benefit?
Is there anyone brave enough for prophesy that the poor, needy, ill elderly or disabled will be better off?

 

[anotherkiwi]

It is one (the only?) point where I agree with tilson. Political responsibility is an important issue and the young have to be encouraged to engage in it by voting.

 

[oldtom]

Tillson can always be relied upon to provide his support for the avant-garde notion of 'Brexit' no matter how incredibly stupid the idea appears with every passing day. How serious are his views really? Well, I have it on good authority that this is the hand-dryer in the gardener's toilet area of Tillson's outhouse:



Tom

 

[Kudoscycles]

flecc got the joke Dave, I was mocking tilson's silly comment. I know you are on edge and you are right to be. All business owners in the UK must be having sleepless nights. This can not work short term, we have examples and concrete proof only from the end of last year. No need to talk of "guessing" and "predictions" when we have examples.

Long term maybe a miracle will happen but history teaches us that this thing cannot work and that those on the bottom of the income scale are going to suffer some more.

Apologies missed the joke....I don't have sleepless nights about Brexit,in fact I can see a lot of possibilities if we do have free trade with Asia,unlikely though because that may have so many negatives and immigration implications.
But I am concerned that this government will go ahead with Brexit just because they have no other option.
KudosDave

 

[Kudoscycles]

You don't know how the 1/3 of the population who didn't vote, would have voted if they were eligible to vote or could have been bothered to get off their arses and make their way to a polling booth.

To default to the assumption that the absent voters would have voted to remain is flawed.

Leavers should not be concerned with a second referendum.....it would put to bed the argument that we didn't understand,the press is full of Brexit,we should have the knowledge to make an informed choice.
KudosDave

 

[Kudoscycles]

I'm 73 years young, voted to remain as did all my pals of similar age and much younger ones as well.
The referendum was built on lies, and we have the result, a very low percentage margin to leave.
The deed is done, and we will have to live with the outcome for many years.
No,I am not at all happy.

We need to move on, once we are given some information and direction from the Government.

Lister.....interesting name you have chosen.
I have been involved in Motorsport for 45 years....the name Lister has recently had a resurgence....Lister Bell Automotive are producing a copy of the iconic Lancia Stratos and Lister Cars are making again the beautiful Lister Knobbly Jaguar made famous by Stirling Moss.
Both customers of mine.
Getting ready for our stand at Autosports (aka The Racing Car Show) at Birmingham NEC,we will have a small display of e-bikes at the show.
KudosDave

 

[flecc]

....Lister Bell Automotive are producing a copy of the iconic Lancia Stratos and Lister Cars are making again the beautiful Lister Knobbly Jaguar made famous by Stirling Moss.

Lancia Stratos copy

Lister Knobbly Jaguar, complete with engine sound.
.

 

[KTM Bike Industries UK]

I hear Lister, and just think of Red Dwarf... not sure what they says, or doesn't say about me

 

[Lister]

My name is Lister Noble, honestly.
Used to race cars, and now still involved helping friends in motorsport.

 

[oldgroaner]

My name is Lister Noble, honestly.
Used to race cars, and now still involved helping friends in motorsport.

I offer this in friendly jest,

I have visions of Tom cruise there, and now after your "Days of thunder" you have taken to the "Gentle glide" of Ebiking as some form of karma, and elder wisdom, where you can watch the world go by?

Good for you!

 

[oldgroaner]

If ever there was a sign that Brexit means almost nothing at all the words of Mrs May give a clear message.
""I don't accept the terms hard and soft Brexit. What we're doing is (that we are) going to get an ambitious, good, best possible deal for the United Kingdom in terms of ... trading with and operating within the single European market."

How can anyone who voted to leave the EU not see that as a "sell out"?
However practical it may seem it will not be acceptable to huge numbers of the Brexit Voters, even I can see that.
We will have to comply with EU rules over which we have no say.
No one at all will be happy with that arrangement.
It's all or nothing, when you cut to the crunch.