Brexit, for once some facts.

Nev

Esteemed Pedelecer
May 1, 2018
1,507
2,520
North Wales
Good to see that the Oxford vaccine trial is going to recommence.

"The independent review process has concluded and following the recommendations of both the independent safety review committee and the UK regulator, the MHRA, the trials will recommence in the UK.

We cannot disclose medical information about the illness for reasons of participant confidentiality.

We are committed to the safety of our participants and the highest standards of conduct in our studies and will continue to monitor safety closely."

 
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oyster

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 7, 2017
10,422
14,609
West West Wales
Being a squaddie has never been very much appreciated by those outside the army. Now they might be used to deliver Covid-19 vaccinations.

Worse, it looks like it might become a truly tankless task.
 
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Woosh

Trade Member
May 19, 2012
20,376
16,875
Southend on Sea
wooshbikes.co.uk
The strategy of relying on the NHS to produce software which exploits Apple’s and Google’s OS and hardware better than Apple & Google themselves was never going to work. The NHS can’t even develop a system which allows my physio to look at the xrays taken 50 yards away in the same building. They were always going to fail and fail big.
here is the explanation of the Apple/Google Notification system:

quote:

5. How will the system protect user privacy and security?
Google and Apple put user privacy at the forefront of this exposure notification technology’s design and have established strict guidelines to ensure that privacy is safeguarded:
• Each user will have to make an explicit choice to turn on the technology. It can also be turned off by the user at any time.

4 • The Exposure Notifications System does not share location data from the user’s device with the Public Health Authority, Apple, or Google
• Random Bluetooth identifiers rotate every 10-20 minutes, to help prevent tracking.
• Exposure notifications are only done on the user’s device. In addition people who test positive are not identified by the system to other users, or to Apple or Google.
• The system is only used to assist contact tracing efforts by public health authorities.
• Google and Apple will disable the Exposure Notifications System on a regional basis when it is no longer needed.
a. Can I turn it off? Yes. The choice to use this technology rests with the user, and they can turn it off at any time in Settings.
6. Will governments have access to the information facilitated by this technology?
The goal of this project is to assist public health authorities in their efforts to fight COVID-19 by enabling exposure notification in a privacy-preserving manner, and the system is designed so that the identities of the people a device comes in contact with are protected. Access to the technology will be granted only to public health authorities. If they create an app, it must meet specific criteria around privacy, security, and data control. The public health authority will be able to access a list of beacons provided by users confirmed as positive for COVID-19 who have consented to sharing them. The system was also designed so that Apple and Google do not have access to information related to any identifiable individual.
7. Where is the data stored and who has access to it? If a user decides to participate, exposure notification data will be stored and processed on device. Other than the random Bluetooth identifiers that are broadcast, no data will be shared by the system with the public health authority unless one of the following two scenarios takes place:
• If a user chooses to report a positive diagnosis of COVID-19, the user’s most recent keys to their Bluetooth beacons will be added to the positive diagnosis list shared by the public health authority so that other users who came in contact with those beacons can be alerted.
• If a user is notified that they have come into contact with an individual who is positive for COVID-19 the system will share the day the contact occurred, how long it lasted and the Bluetooth signal strength of that contact, as well as the type of report (such as confirmed by test, clinical diagnosis, or self-report). Any other information about the contact will not be shared.
5 In keeping with our privacy guidelines, Apple and Google will not receive identifying information about the user, device location data, or information about any other devices the user has been in proximity of.
8. Will my data be monetized by Google or Apple?
No, there will be no monetization from this project by Apple or Google. Consistent with well established privacy principles, both companies are minimizing data used by the system and relying on users’ devices to process information.
9. Who will create the apps and where do I find them? Public health authorities will update or create apps which users may install if they choose to participate. Google and Apple will make available, as normal, the public health authority apps for each region in the Play Store and App Store. In some regions, Exposure Notifications will be available without an app created by the public health authority. If this is available in your region, you’ll receive a notification when it becomes available, and you can decide whether you want to participate.
10. How will apps get approval to use this system?
Apps will receive approval based on a specific set of criteria designed to ensure they are only administered in conjunction with public health authorities, meet our privacy requirements, and protect user data. The criteria are detailed separately in agreements that developers enter into to use the API, and are organized around the principles of functionality and user privacy. There will be restrictions on the data that apps can collect when using the API, including not being able to request access to location services, and restrictions on how data can be used.
11. What public health authority can users contact about Exposure Notifications for their region?
Google and Apple are currently in discussions with various public health authorities globally to provide them with this technology. Both companies will highlight public health authority apps that use this technology where they are available.
12. How do users report themselves as positive for COVID-19?
The mechanism for allowing users to report themselves as positive will be determined by the relevant public health authority and may vary across regions. Some public health authorities may allow users to verify a test result using a pin code, while others may provide different mechanisms for verification.
13. How does the system know when I have been exposed?
The public health authority sets parameters to determine if someone has been exposed. For example, by defining the risk parameters based on estimated time the user has been in contact with someone who has been diagnosed as positive for COVID-19 and the approximate distance between the users. Public health authorities will set a minimum threshold for time spent together. To approximate distance, the system compares the Bluetooth signal strength between the two devices in contact. The closer the devices are, the higher the signal strength recorded. This signal strength can vary significantly based on factors like how the device is being held and as such this only provides an estimate of distance.
 
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oldgroaner

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 15, 2015
23,461
32,613
80
He thought he could treat the EU with the same contempt he's shown to everyone else he's encountered in life.

Now he's reached a level of responsibility where that is no longer possible, he's lost and doesn't know how to deal with the situation.

The answer is simple and obvious, resign.
.
I'm sure everyone will recall that we discussed the WA on here and pointed out the phrase where our idiots reserved the right to make decisions entirely outside the bounds of the law
 
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wheeler

Esteemed Pedelecer
Jun 4, 2016
893
1,776
Scotland
No idea. But I don't see why they could not have gone with the RoI/NI product at the same time that it was rolled out there. Which would not have precluded launching E/W/S or UK versions (as appropriate) later.

We could have had that many weeks of actual app coverage. If nothing else, we would have gained some experience from doing so.
I've installed the Scottish app and I must say it's a bit of a disappointment, I really wanted a world beating app to crow about but this one just works.
 

Paul smith

Pedelecer
Mar 26, 2016
249
198
here is the explanation of the Apple/Google Notification system:

quote:

5. How will the system protect user privacy and security?
Google and Apple put user privacy at the forefront of this exposure notification technology’s design and have established strict guidelines to ensure that privacy is safeguarded:
• Each user will have to make an explicit choice to turn on the technology. It can also be turned off by the user at any time.

4 • The Exposure Notifications System does not share location data from the user’s device with the Public Health Authority, Apple, or Google
• Random Bluetooth identifiers rotate every 10-20 minutes, to help prevent tracking.
• Exposure notifications are only done on the user’s device. In addition people who test positive are not identified by the system to other users, or to Apple or Google.
• The system is only used to assist contact tracing efforts by public health authorities.
• Google and Apple will disable the Exposure Notifications System on a regional basis when it is no longer needed.
a. Can I turn it off? Yes. The choice to use this technology rests with the user, and they can turn it off at any time in Settings.
6. Will governments have access to the information facilitated by this technology?
The goal of this project is to assist public health authorities in their efforts to fight COVID-19 by enabling exposure notification in a privacy-preserving manner, and the system is designed so that the identities of the people a device comes in contact with are protected. Access to the technology will be granted only to public health authorities. If they create an app, it must meet specific criteria around privacy, security, and data control. The public health authority will be able to access a list of beacons provided by users confirmed as positive for COVID-19 who have consented to sharing them. The system was also designed so that Apple and Google do not have access to information related to any identifiable individual.
7. Where is the data stored and who has access to it? If a user decides to participate, exposure notification data will be stored and processed on device. Other than the random Bluetooth identifiers that are broadcast, no data will be shared by the system with the public health authority unless one of the following two scenarios takes place:
• If a user chooses to report a positive diagnosis of COVID-19, the user’s most recent keys to their Bluetooth beacons will be added to the positive diagnosis list shared by the public health authority so that other users who came in contact with those beacons can be alerted.
• If a user is notified that they have come into contact with an individual who is positive for COVID-19 the system will share the day the contact occurred, how long it lasted and the Bluetooth signal strength of that contact, as well as the type of report (such as confirmed by test, clinical diagnosis, or self-report). Any other information about the contact will not be shared.
5 In keeping with our privacy guidelines, Apple and Google will not receive identifying information about the user, device location data, or information about any other devices the user has been in proximity of.
8. Will my data be monetized by Google or Apple?
No, there will be no monetization from this project by Apple or Google. Consistent with well established privacy principles, both companies are minimizing data used by the system and relying on users’ devices to process information.
9. Who will create the apps and where do I find them? Public health authorities will update or create apps which users may install if they choose to participate. Google and Apple will make available, as normal, the public health authority apps for each region in the Play Store and App Store. In some regions, Exposure Notifications will be available without an app created by the public health authority. If this is available in your region, you’ll receive a notification when it becomes available, and you can decide whether you want to participate.
10. How will apps get approval to use this system?
Apps will receive approval based on a specific set of criteria designed to ensure they are only administered in conjunction with public health authorities, meet our privacy requirements, and protect user data. The criteria are detailed separately in agreements that developers enter into to use the API, and are organized around the principles of functionality and user privacy. There will be restrictions on the data that apps can collect when using the API, including not being able to request access to location services, and restrictions on how data can be used.
11. What public health authority can users contact about Exposure Notifications for their region?
Google and Apple are currently in discussions with various public health authorities globally to provide them with this technology. Both companies will highlight public health authority apps that use this technology where they are available.
12. How do users report themselves as positive for COVID-19?
The mechanism for allowing users to report themselves as positive will be determined by the relevant public health authority and may vary across regions. Some public health authorities may allow users to verify a test result using a pin code, while others may provide different mechanisms for verification.
13. How does the system know when I have been exposed?
The public health authority sets parameters to determine if someone has been exposed. For example, by defining the risk parameters based on estimated time the user has been in contact with someone who has been diagnosed as positive for COVID-19 and the approximate distance between the users. Public health authorities will set a minimum threshold for time spent together. To approximate distance, the system compares the Bluetooth signal strength between the two devices in contact. The closer the devices are, the higher the signal strength recorded. This signal strength can vary significantly based on factors like how the device is being held and as such this only provides an estimate of distance.
we supposed to read that ****??...wheres flecc..havent popped his clogs have he?....i look on this depresssing thread every day ..then i shoot off over to reddit aww.,,an look at my happy furry animals..you old codgers should try it...
 

wheeler

Esteemed Pedelecer
Jun 4, 2016
893
1,776
Scotland
we supposed to read that ****??...wheres flecc..havent popped his clogs have he?....i look on this depresssing thread every day ..then i shoot off over to reddit aww.,,an look at my happy furry animals..you old codgers should try it...
You shoot off over happy furry animals, each to their own I suppose, but I think I prefer the "old codgers" in here.
 
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flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
53,199
30,603
we supposed to read that ****??...wheres flecc..havent popped his clogs have he?....i look on this depresssing thread every day ..then i shoot off over to reddit aww.,,an look at my happy furry animals..you old codgers should try it...
Still alive and kicking, but it's one of my busiest times of the year so little time to waste in here at present and certainly not enough time to catch Covid of any number, or read about it
.
 

Woosh

Trade Member
May 19, 2012
20,376
16,875
Southend on Sea
wooshbikes.co.uk
i look on this depresssing thread every day .
there is not much to be cheerful for the next few years.
We have an incompetent government led by a bunch of unprincipled politicians.
Their supposed best brain prefers working with weirdos and misfits than with the well trained civil service. I wonder if Cummings does not suffer from a complex of inferiority.
We are deeper in debts than ever before, with no chance of repairing public finance for a generation and a second wave of Covid is looming large with confirmed cases doubling every week.
All the government proposes is they will set fire to their own house! That's what no deal is like on the back of the furlough scheme.
You have to ask yourself why you should be cheerful.
 

jonathan.agnew

Esteemed Pedelecer
Dec 27, 2018
2,400
3,381
we supposed to read that ****??...wheres flecc..havent popped his clogs have he?....i look on this depresssing thread every day ..then i shoot off over to reddit aww.,,an look at my happy furry animals..you old codgers should try it...
I check on the codgers (I'm rapidly becoming one), look at furry animals, and work. Which is tricky. Half the time I envy the codgers (for not having to work) and hate work. Then I think about early retirement (three years away). Then I feel relief. Then I feel worried. More than one walk on the same beach and I get antsy. Worryingly antsy. Then I think how I sometimes love work. But also often hate it. How does a codger fill the existential vacuum?
 
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oldgroaner

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 15, 2015
23,461
32,613
80
I check on the codgers (I'm rapidly becoming one), look at furry animals, and work. Which is tricky. Half the time I envy the codgers (for not having to work) and hate work. Then I think about early retirement (three years away). Then I feel relief. Then I feel worried. More than one walk on the same beach and I get antsy. Worryingly antsy. Then I think how I sometimes love work. But also often hate it. How does a codger fill the existential vacuum?
There is always some work that will seek you out, and as the old saying goes
"Work expands to fit the time allotted" :cool:
 

oyster

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 7, 2017
10,422
14,609
West West Wales
What the top lawyers did is exactly what I expected. Not as if Suella even has any significant experience of international law of this type. To misquote Burns:

A Crime’s a Crime for a’ that:

Top lawyers slam Suella Braverman for wrecking UK’s reputation
Attorney general faces fury of Bar Council as revolt over internal market bill spreads

Michael Savage and Toby Helm
Sat 12 Sep 2020 21.00 BST Last modified on Sat 12 Sep 2020 21.07 BST

The attorney general, Suella Braverman, was on Saturday accused of sacrificing the UK’s reputation, sidelining legal advisers and bypassing the ministerial code during an extraordinary confrontation with some of the country’s top lawyers.

During the annual general meeting of the Bar Council, the professional association for barristers, Braverman was asked how Britain could retain “a shred of credibility” in imploring other countries to follow international law after revealing its own willingness to breach agreements.

The criticisms came after the government last week unveiled plans to give ministers sweeping powers to “disapply” part of the Brexit deal that Boris Johnson signed in January.

Five QCs confronted the attorney general during Saturday’s meeting, telling her that a crime which broke the law in a “specific and limited way” – the phrase used by the Northern Ireland secretary Brandon Lewis when he announced the move – was still a crime.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/sep/12/top-lawyers-slam-suella-braverman-for-wrecking-uks-reputation

I think the Guardian/Observer are not impressed by Suella:

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/sep/12/when-even-the-attorney-general-flouts-the-law-what-hope-does-britain-have-suella-braverman
 
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flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
53,199
30,603
I check on the codgers (I'm rapidly becoming one), look at furry animals, and work. Which is tricky. Half the time I envy the codgers (for not having to work) and hate work. Then I think about early retirement (three years away). Then I feel relief. Then I feel worried. More than one walk on the same beach and I get antsy. Worryingly antsy. Then I think how I sometimes love work. But also often hate it. How does a codger fill the existential vacuum?
I've hated every minute of education and work without exception, from birth I only ever wanted to do what I wanted to do and I've been far more successful at that than most.

Retirement isn't a vacuum if it's spent occupied with the only real world, the natural world, and we still know so little about it that it's impossible to run out of sources of constant interest. And it's completely free.
.
 

jonathan.agnew

Esteemed Pedelecer
Dec 27, 2018
2,400
3,381
I've hated every minute of education and work without exception, from birth I only ever wanted to do what I wanted to do and I've been far more successful at that than most.

Retirement isn't a vacuum if it's spent occupied with the only real world, the natural world, and we still know so little about it that it's impossible to run out of sources of constant interest. And it's completely free.
.
I thought I was studying and doing what I wanted. And sometimes still think so. But no one tells one about the destructive narcissism and incestuous office politics of organisations. And in a lord of the flies way one cant escape it.
 

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