Brexit, for once some facts.

Danidl

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It has been fitted sucessfully if fleets of commercial vehicles for many years
I feel far more concern for the dangers of fires in modern vehicles, and that includes Electric ones in particular, with such a huge amount of stored energy on board
There is less stored energy in the electric batteries than in a petroleum product. Proof... The limited range of electric vehicle, despite being 3 to 4 times more efficient in converting its energy store into locomotion
 
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oldgroaner

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Having adaptive cruise control in my car, I find myself setting it to current speed limit much of the time. And it is spectacularly effective when descending steep hills.

My reservations include the accuracy of the sources of speed limits. How do the systems manage to update fast enough when changes are made? E.g. for roadworks, or removal of roadworks. Quite often I find my satnav gets it wrong, sometimes just thinking it is on a parallel road.

Local street signs are definitely not the way to go. Another car I regularly drive has a sign reading device. And it is so often wrong. It cannot work out whether national speed limit means 60 or 70. It cannot handle 30 due to street lighting only. It cannot distinguish between advisory speed limits (e.g. for bends) and enforceable limits. And I keep imagining people creating their own speed limit signs and holding them up just out of "fun".
To be fair though most days few people take any notice of any of those notices anyway, do they?
The best way of watching the world go by has always been to drive at the speed limit.
 
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Zlatan

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You compare me to racist football hooligans and now you call me a hypocrite. That is not just bad language, it's offensive.
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Your sensitive side is showing again.
I suggest you stop making sexist posts then I couldnt exagerate to make the point. I didnt compare your post to racist behavior, I said they would justify it too. And, if you dont want to be called a hypocrite perhaps you should not make sexist posts combined with being so upset with the minor insult levelled at you. It is hypocritical.
BTW I agree totally re modern autonomous technology. Top Gear (yes not the height of objective testing) couldnt get auto emergency braking to operate at all.
The blanket speed limit technology is right way to go tho and inevitable.
 
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flecc

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Having adaptive cruise control in my car, I find myself setting it to current speed limit much of the time. And it is spectacularly effective when descending steep hills.
I assume your car if an i.c one uses the brakes to hold the rignt speed? My e-car goes one better, using regen to hold the speed while charging th battery as a bonus, so no brake wear.

My reservations include the accuracy of the sources of speed limits. How do the systems manage to update fast enough when changes are made? E.g. for roadworks, or removal of roadworks. Quite often I find my satnav gets it wrong, sometimes just thinking it is on a parallel road.

Local street signs are definitely not the way to go. Another car I regularly drive has a sign reading device. And it is so often wrong. It cannot work out whether national speed limit means 60 or 70. It cannot handle 30 due to street lighting only. It cannot distinguish between advisory speed limits (e.g. for bends) and enforceable limits. And I keep imagining people creating their own speed limit signs and holding them up just out of "fun".
My car is much better in these respects, but too good it seems. For example, our residential roads are 20 limit and it reads all those official signs ok and displays them on the dashboard, even 5 mph ones in factory areas. It doesn't miss anything, and that is its failing. At the end of my estate 20 mph road it joins a 30 limit through road and there's a 30 limit sign at the end to trigger that change. The car instantly shows that but as it turns left into the 30 road, it also spots the signs at the entry of the road opposite and changes to that, which happens to be 20 again.

So it then maintains 20 is the limit in that 30 road right to the end of that road until the sat nav is able to finally correct the error. The sat nav problem is that there's two 30 limit roads at right angles to each other, surround by a packed network of 20 mph streets. Given the distance inaccuracies of sat nav, it simple cannot distinguish them from each other from signals received in a constantly moving vehicle.
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oldgroaner

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There is less stored energy in the electric batteries than in a petroleum product. Proof... The limited range of electric vehicle, despite being 3 to 4 times more efficient in converting its energy store into locomotion
This is very true, but I was reading a case in America where the fire department were called to a scrap yard where a crashed Tesla burst into flames on three separate occasions during the night, not usually a problem with an IC engined fuel system, once the vehicle has cooled down.
 
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oldgroaner

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I assume your car if an i.c one uses the brakes to hold the rignt speed? My e-car goes one better, using regen to hold the speed while charging th battery as a bonus, so no brake wear.



My car is much better in these respects, but too good it seems. For example, our residential roads are 20 limit and it reads all those official signs ok and displays them on the dashboard, even 5 mph ones in factory areas. It doesn't miss anything, and that is its failing. At the end of my estate 20 mph road it joins a 30 limit through road and there's a 30 limit sign at the end to trigger that change. The car instantly shows that but as it turns left into the 30 road, it also spots the signs at the entry of the road opposite and changes to that, which happens to be 20 again.

So it then maintains 20 is the limit in that 30 road right to the end of that road until the sat nav is able to finally correct the error. The sat nav problem is that there's two 30 limit roads at right angles to each other, surround by a packed network of 20 mph streets. Given the distance inaccuracies of sat nav, it simple cannot distinguish them from each other from signals received in a constantly moving vehicle.
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I'm surprised you don't get literally trampled underfoot by the hordes of motorists who habitually ignore speed sign at all times!
 
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flecc

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So has mine flecc, it has anti collision radar and the ability to take over the steering from the driver , as it did when I ran into deep water on the M62 at speed, and it has surprised me at times too when it decides there is a collision danger and hits the brakes.
Mine is not unconditional acceptance, but i have seen far worse decisions made by human drivers in the Thirty thousand miles i have driven in just over one year of ownership.
I speak from knowledge and experience too remember and can compare it with two previous 'Octavia 1.9 TDI that I drove for 200K miles in each since retiring.
This car is far safer to drive. I usually drive on adaptive cruise and let the radar "Fly the ship" while keeping a weather eye on events.
The radar is usually set to 2MPH below the stated speed limit which works just fine for me.
I have those too, and use them and I'm not criticising them. It's the additional stuff I have, like the additional sensing that leads to dangerous actions, like the speed limit misreadings that I've described to Oyster, like the lane keeping tech that fails in some angles of bright sunshine or road marking defects.

I don't want to go into unnecessary detail, but I'll explain any one if you want me to.
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oldgroaner

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I assume your car if an i.c one uses the brakes to hold the rignt speed? My e-car goes one better, using regen to hold the speed while charging th battery as a bonus, so no brake wear.



My car is much better in these respects, but too good it seems. For example, our residential roads are 20 limit and it reads all those official signs ok and displays them on the dashboard, even 5 mph ones in factory areas. It doesn't miss anything, and that is its failing. At the end of my estate 20 mph road it joins a 30 limit through road and there's a 30 limit sign at the end to trigger that change. The car instantly shows that but as it turns left into the 30 road, it also spots the signs at the entry of the road opposite and changes to that, which happens to be 20 again.

So it then maintains 20 is the limit in that 30 road right to the end of that road until the sat nav is able to finally correct the error. The sat nav problem is that there's two 30 limit roads at right angles to each other, surround by a packed network of 20 mph streets. Given the distance inaccuracies of sat nav, it simple cannot distinguish them from each other from signals received in a constantly moving vehicle.
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A further problem with sat nav is that some like mine have to be manually updated, and that is only available on an annual basis, and obviously much has changed in the interrim.
 
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Danidl

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This is very true, but I was reading a case in America where the fire department were called to a scrap yard where a crashed Tesla burst into flames on three separate occasions during the night, not usually a problem with an IC engined fuel system, once the vehicle has cooled down.
Why they did not just move it to a safe place and let it burn out?. Its what they did back in the day in West Belfast.
 
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oldgroaner

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I have those too, and use them and I'm not criticising them. It's the additional stuff I have, like the additional sensing that leads to dangerous actions, like the speed limit misreadings that I've described to Oyster, like the lane keeping tech that fails in some angles of bright sunshine or road marking defects.

I don't want to go into unnecessary detail, but I'll explain any one if you want me to.
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Not necessary flecc, I'm with you on that,and yet going back to the original premise of controlling maximum speed it could be applied by implanted signal emitters in the road surface which are instant acting rather than the "laggy" sat nav system.
 
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flecc

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This is very true, but I was reading a case in America where the fire department were called to a scrap yard where a crashed Tesla burst into flames on three separate occasions during the night, not usually a problem with an IC engined fuel system, once the vehicle has cooled down.
But not true for almost all e-cars. I've posted elsewhere that Tesla are irresponsible and I'd never buy one. You may have seen how their cars have amazing range and performance for e-cars.

The reason is quite simple, they use huge number of high density small cells just like the 18640s in our e-bike and e-motorbike batteries. They are to save weight and space, but are highly stressed and can catch fire on occasions as we well know in this forum. One Tesla model for example has 6,200 18640 cells in its battery, meaning a very high risk of one going up and setting off the rest.

Others like my Nissan do things very differently, as Woosh and I have previously explained. With less space and weight problems, it uses large low density cells which are not in the least stressed. Added to that the controller limits the performance far below Tesla levels, though still more than enough, so the battery is never worked anywhere near as hard as our bike ones and Tesla one's are.

At nearly 300,000 there are more Leafs on the road than any other e-car worldwide, but there has never been a single traction battery fire on one. Even when spent for car use, they safely go into the home storage units that accept solar power for later use or resale to the grid.
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oldgroaner

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The Speed limited piece was in the Daily Mail and clearly intended and indeed succeeded in inflaming the Brexit voters, looking at their comments which demanded we get out of the EU and avoid this tyranny.
Amusingly if they actually read the full article it detailed that if this proposal is accepted it will automatically apply to all vehicles in the UK too even after we leave the EU for Vehicle certification standards reasons.
 
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oldgroaner

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But not true for almost all e-cars. I've posted elsewhere that Tesla are irresponsible and I'd never buy one. You may have seen how their cars have amazing range and performance for e-cars.

The reason is quite simple, they use huge number of high density small cells just like the 18640s in our e-bike and e-motorbike batteries. They are to save weight and space, but are highly stressed and can catch fire on occasions as we well know in this forum. One Tesla model for example has 6,200 18640 cells in its battery, meaning a very high risk of one going up and setting off the rest.

Others like my Nissan do things very differently, as Woosh and I have previously explained. With less space and weight problems, it uses large low density cells which are not in the least stressed. Added to that the controller limits the performance far below Tesla levels, though still more than enough, so the battery is never worked anywhere near as hard as our bike ones and Tesla one's are.

At nearly 300,000 there are more Leafs on the road than any other e-car worldwide, but there has never been a single traction battery fire on one. Even when spent for car use, they safely go into the home storage units that accept solar power for later use or resale to the grid.
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An impressive record indeed
I would consider one if my life became less focussed on long distance travel towing a heavy caravan to some places at the back of beyond.
Who knows what the future holds? it may well happen, but not for the present.
 
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flecc

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I'm surprised you don't get literally trampled underfoot by the hordes of motorists who habitually ignore speed sign at all times!
They do try, but then get a shock when the car unexpectedly decides to brake sharply for some excuse or other. And as well as that scaring the pants off them, the quite severe regen braking on Eco or B mode scares them too, since it doesn't put on the brake lights in the way the brake pedal does.
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flecc

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Not necessary flecc, I'm with you on that,and yet going back to the original premise of controlling maximum speed it could be applied by implanted signal emitters in the road surface which are instant acting rather than the "laggy" sat nav system.
Agreed, but in Britain where we can't repair potholes and nearly all speed cameras are out of use through inability to maintain them, is it likely in more than one or two places?
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wheeler

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Not necessary flecc, I'm with you on that,and yet going back to the original premise of controlling maximum speed it could be applied by implanted signal emitters in the road surface which are instant acting rather than the "laggy" sat nav system.
Were we not leaving the EU perhaps cars sold in the UK would be able to access the survey grade positioning data from Galileo. Centimetric positioning accuracy along with a refined speed limit database would allow the exact speed limit to be applied.

Road surface implants are prohibitively expensive and always create a weakness in the upper layers of the road structure.
They also have to be replaced when the road is resurfaced.
 

oldgroaner

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Were we not leaving the EU perhaps cars sold in the UK would be able to access the survey grade positioning data from Galileo. Centimetric positioning accuracy along with a refined speed limit database would allow the exact speed limit to be applied.

Road surface implants are prohibitively expensive and always create a weakness in the upper layers of the road structure.
They also have to be replaced when the road is resurfaced.
Alternatively could they not be mast or gantry mounted?
 
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