That reminds me of this devastatingly insightful Dilbert Cartoon
I plead guilty as charged....
Last edited:
Brexit, for once some facts.
- Thread starter flecc
- Start date
I plead guilty as charged....
Which will from now on be described as "Trumping in Public"
Well if it's good enough for an American Presidential Hopeful to use, surely he deserves the credit for the act to be named after him ?
And he has such an Emotive name after all, doesn't he?
I admit that I am susceptible to episodes of great stupidity. Sometimes these are short lived, and on other occasions can be prolonged.
However, so far seems to be a good day for clarity of thought. Although it doesn't really bother me one way or the other, the comment that derf made regarding a xenophobic UK is pretty straightforward. It would be hard to misinterpret that.
I still have absolutely no idea what derf was trying to communicate in his earlier post. I simply do not understand the message.
If I do paint myself into a corner, I usually walk straight through the wet paint and then touch up the marks at a later time. A light sanding with flour paper and then retouching the paint chips yields a highly satisfactory finish.
Actually the Trump family name was adopted, it was originally Drumpf which they didn't like.
So they went forwards through the alphabet and after trying many alternatives finally reached "T" and settled on Trump.
All that wasted effort! They should just have gone backwards through the alphabet, since only one step back from "D" and they'd have been at "C".
Then they could have seen the perfect surname for Donald, Chump.
.
Masterful and of course stylish, not many people can handle the "Non apology" with such panache, I might add that your response to derf was pretty hard to misinterpret, yet it seems you believe we did.
And added to that as a bonus the casually dismissive "it doesn't really bother me" is somewhat tarnished by the smooth carefully dismissive and evasive reply.
Panic appears to be setting in! This from the Daily Excess
"
Theresa May urged to trigger Article 50 ASAP amid fears it can be REVERSED
THERESA MAY has been urged to trigger Article 50 of the Lisbon Treaty as soon as possible amid fears it could be REVERSED at a later date by pro-EU MPs.
The Prime Minister, who has vowed not to invoke the legal mechanism for exiting the EU before 2017, has been told to complete Britain’s departure from the bloc before the next general election.
Once Article 50 is activated there is a two-year timeframe before a member state officially ceases to be part of the EU.
The warning to Mrs May to hurry up and get on with the process of exit negotiations comes amid concerns the two-year waiting period could be allowed to straddle a general election.
Both EU law experts and top lawyers have said there is “nothing in the wording” of Article 50 to rule out a departing member state changing its mind even if the clause has already been enacted.
It opens up the possibility of a government less committed to Brexit, or ardently pro-EU, being able to U-turn on the leaving process if elected before Britain’s departure is complete.
Influential Conservative backbencher and Brexit supporter Jacob Rees-Mogg told Express.co.uk: “It is essential that Brexit is completed before the next election as an incoming government could potentially withdraw an Article 50 request.
“The earliest part of 2017 seems the right time to pull the trigger in the expectation that we would be out of the EU by 2019 with an election the following year.”
The chances of us actually leaving are at best 50/50 now
"
Theresa May urged to trigger Article 50 ASAP amid fears it can be REVERSED
THERESA MAY has been urged to trigger Article 50 of the Lisbon Treaty as soon as possible amid fears it could be REVERSED at a later date by pro-EU MPs.
The Prime Minister, who has vowed not to invoke the legal mechanism for exiting the EU before 2017, has been told to complete Britain’s departure from the bloc before the next general election.
Once Article 50 is activated there is a two-year timeframe before a member state officially ceases to be part of the EU.
The warning to Mrs May to hurry up and get on with the process of exit negotiations comes amid concerns the two-year waiting period could be allowed to straddle a general election.
Both EU law experts and top lawyers have said there is “nothing in the wording” of Article 50 to rule out a departing member state changing its mind even if the clause has already been enacted.
It opens up the possibility of a government less committed to Brexit, or ardently pro-EU, being able to U-turn on the leaving process if elected before Britain’s departure is complete.
Influential Conservative backbencher and Brexit supporter Jacob Rees-Mogg told Express.co.uk: “It is essential that Brexit is completed before the next election as an incoming government could potentially withdraw an Article 50 request.
“The earliest part of 2017 seems the right time to pull the trigger in the expectation that we would be out of the EU by 2019 with an election the following year.”
The chances of us actually leaving are at best 50/50 now
Let me just say that Mike Killay hitting the agree button is extremely unlikely to mean he agrees that you are susceptible to episodes of great stupidity, I will never believe that, and I feel sure he doesn't.
Perhaps Mike may I suggest the "Like" button is more respectful? or perhaps a few words of reassurance?
I believe I was liking the fact that the UK is not totally xenophobic, sorry for any misunderstanding, but I have a shocking case of flu at the moment and I definitely am not thinking with any clarity.
Hope you soon get over your flu virus. I had it in March of this year and didn't full recover until mid May. In fact I took sick leave from work for the first time in 16 years.
The likelihood of leaving is becoming less every day.
I see 2 main reasons why people voted Brexit...
1. Immigration.....stopping or at least control,all 27 member states have categorically stated that if we want access to the EU single market we must have free movement of people,that seems non negotiable.
2. The ability to negotiate trade agreements with the rest of the world remote from the EU,again Merkel has stated that if we want access to the single market we cannot br free to negotiate trade agreements that do not align with those of the EU
There are dozens of other reasons why we won't leave but if people were told that the above was a non starter who would have bothered to vote,most of my friends who voted leave were concerned about our country being filled by EE workers,it looks like they are not even going to get their primary wish.
KudosDave
I see 2 main reasons why people voted Brexit...
1. Immigration.....stopping or at least control,all 27 member states have categorically stated that if we want access to the EU single market we must have free movement of people,that seems non negotiable.
2. The ability to negotiate trade agreements with the rest of the world remote from the EU,again Merkel has stated that if we want access to the single market we cannot br free to negotiate trade agreements that do not align with those of the EU
There are dozens of other reasons why we won't leave but if people were told that the above was a non starter who would have bothered to vote,most of my friends who voted leave were concerned about our country being filled by EE workers,it looks like they are not even going to get their primary wish.
KudosDave
I can see us leaving the EU Norway style with 8 to 10 years of opting out freedom of movement. There is no real reason why the EU could not agree to some restriction to immigration. Even if they don't, we can still construct additional barriers to getting employment once we have left the EU.
An understanding of supply chains can easily explain this.
Its to do with scales of business, stock levels, model rotation, and buying power etc etc.
Bikes (and the whole bike industry) launches its new season in July / August for the next 12 months, so all the brands have to try to set a price they can stick to. Hence the quick reaction to the fall in the value of Sterling. Also most bike stuff comes via Europe into the UK, not direct from the FE.
White goods, cars, big electrical etc are all bigger supply chains, that won't have a annual price set at this point for the next 12 months. There is also a lot of stock in the UK that was bought at pre Brexit prices, and the suppliers might have prices set at time of ordering, not time of invoice, or have forward bought lots of currency. They also are likely to be working with bigger margins, or be able to absorb smaller margins that most companies in the bike industry.
The continuing decline in the value of sterling against all the major supplying currencies (ie Euro / Dollar etc) is going to effect everything imported, or made from imported raw materials over the next 6 months as the implications are felt in all supply chains.
The £/$ and £/€ are down again this week.... its not good.
I'm inclined to agree with you. The more this drags on, the likelihood of leaving diminishes. Two months ago, I would have considered ignoring the vote to be an inconceivable proposition. That together with what is happening within the Labour party makes me realise that Westminster has not yet reached the bottom of the credibility barrel, they are finding new depths on an almost daily basis.
If we aren't going to leave, May needs to say so now and give her reasons. It is the uncertainty which is doing the damage, not the actual decision to leave. I think a clear statement one way or the other will help.
The migrant crisis, and it is a crisis, will resolve itself. I still maintain that terrorists are using refugees and migrants as cover, or a sort of trojan horse, to enter western Europe. The governments of France and Germany are pretty useless when it comes to infiltrating ISIS or indeed exterminating their operatives. Stable doors, locks and bolting horses spring to mind. This will result in a EU wide shift on migration policy after a few hundred more citizens have been murdered in the coming months.
It strikes me that this seemingly interminable thread has gone the way of Brexit, in that it is going nowhere and less and less people have any interest as the days and weeks go by.
The PM and her government are floundering, unable or unwilling to initiate the process that the majority of those polled demanded. No leadership and no business confidence are not good indicators of a country determined to show the world how great we can be on our own.
People can pontificate all they like with the 'yeah buts' in an effort to explain or justify the hiatus we now find ourselves in but everyone can see, particularly those who have had to buy foreign currency recently for their annual holiday, that we have done ourselves no favours by the exercise of a national poll and then vacillating after the result. Moreover, we have hardly ingratiated ourselves with the other EU states, nor with the US which wanted us to remain in the EU and I believe Putin has never stopped laughing since he heard the news.
Anyway, now that we have tightened our border security and there are no more Johnny foreigners entering illegally in the back of trucks or in small boats and inflatables, the country is just so much safer from terrorist activity, so everybody should be pleased with that. If every foreign person now entering the country does so legally, we haven't really much to complain about, I'd say......well, we could still have a moan about all those unelected officials in Brussels making decisions that affect us here in Britain.....as well as every other EU state.
Actually, those are the commissioners and there are only 28 of those people, one from each state, and while they are not elected but rather, appointed, they are replaced every five years. They do not make decisions; that is the job of the MEPs in the parliament, all of whom are elected in their own states.
I look upon the EU Commission as a kind of pro-active civil service and probably a good thing in that they are able to sort the wheat from the chaff so that the parliament can debate issues in some kind of agreed priority.
I'm not sure exactly how much those 'unelected officials' actually cost but I'd hazard it's probably less than the 'unelected members' we call the House of Lords costs us. £300 per day for each occasion they bother to attend, even for just a drink at the bar, soon adds up when one considers that there are usually over 800 members at any given time entitled to participate in that chamber's business.
Does no-one else find it remarkable that the 'Leave' campaigners and all those who voted for their premise aren't up in arms over the lack of progress since the 23rd of June?
Tom
The PM and her government are floundering, unable or unwilling to initiate the process that the majority of those polled demanded. No leadership and no business confidence are not good indicators of a country determined to show the world how great we can be on our own.
People can pontificate all they like with the 'yeah buts' in an effort to explain or justify the hiatus we now find ourselves in but everyone can see, particularly those who have had to buy foreign currency recently for their annual holiday, that we have done ourselves no favours by the exercise of a national poll and then vacillating after the result. Moreover, we have hardly ingratiated ourselves with the other EU states, nor with the US which wanted us to remain in the EU and I believe Putin has never stopped laughing since he heard the news.
Anyway, now that we have tightened our border security and there are no more Johnny foreigners entering illegally in the back of trucks or in small boats and inflatables, the country is just so much safer from terrorist activity, so everybody should be pleased with that. If every foreign person now entering the country does so legally, we haven't really much to complain about, I'd say......well, we could still have a moan about all those unelected officials in Brussels making decisions that affect us here in Britain.....as well as every other EU state.
Actually, those are the commissioners and there are only 28 of those people, one from each state, and while they are not elected but rather, appointed, they are replaced every five years. They do not make decisions; that is the job of the MEPs in the parliament, all of whom are elected in their own states.
I look upon the EU Commission as a kind of pro-active civil service and probably a good thing in that they are able to sort the wheat from the chaff so that the parliament can debate issues in some kind of agreed priority.
I'm not sure exactly how much those 'unelected officials' actually cost but I'd hazard it's probably less than the 'unelected members' we call the House of Lords costs us. £300 per day for each occasion they bother to attend, even for just a drink at the bar, soon adds up when one considers that there are usually over 800 members at any given time entitled to participate in that chamber's business.
Does no-one else find it remarkable that the 'Leave' campaigners and all those who voted for their premise aren't up in arms over the lack of progress since the 23rd of June?
Tom
Last edited:
I agree its a crisis... but I'd suggest its more of a crisis for the migrants than it is us.
Is there any evidence that your fears about this Trojan horse are based on any facts?
hmmm, its clearly in ISIS's interest to make you think that, and also in the security forces because they want the funding.
http://www.iss.europa.eu/uploads/media/Alert_6_Refugees_versus_terrorists.pdf
Seems to be pretty much spot on...
I don't see any actual evidence for a % of these 11 million refugees being any more of a risk that the existing domestic population.
I agree. To date in France, Belgium, Germany, Norway and the UK, it's been the resident populations carrying out most of the terrorist attacks.
I think ISIS and Al Qaeda are quite content to motivate them through the various media and know they don't need to infiltrate in addition.
.