Brexit, for once some facts.

Wicky

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the US inspired NATO militaristic position and act as friendly neighbours. He's shown this with Georgia. He could have gone the whole way across that country and kept total possession. Instead he secured the Georgian President's agreement for no more EU and NATO approaches and then withdrew the Russian troops from all but the small Russian enclave at one edge.

Remember, there wasn't a hint of the Ukraine and Crimea problems while the Ukraine had a government and president friendly towards Russia. The trouble only began with the Orange revolution coup and moves to join the EU and NATO.
Countries that you want to kowtow to Russia have long memories, and surely have the right to be self-determining esp if they have independence which way their loyalties lie.

The Soviet invasion of Poland was a Soviet military operation that started without a formal declaration of war on 17 September 1939. On that morning, 16 days after Germany invaded Polandfrom the west, the Soviet Union invaded Poland from the east.

What about the corruption of the Russian looking President Yanukovyc who fled when his game was up. So this is NATO and EU's fault - right...

https://www.pri.org/stories/2016-07-26/ukrainians-vowed-turn-their-ex-president-s-estate-museum-corruption-it-s
 

Zlatan

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Nov 26, 2016
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I think this is political convenience.

Theresa May is arguing for more Brexit concessions which the EU don't want to give, so by agreeing with her on the poisoning issue they hope her Brexit stance might soften in return.

The art of politics.

What they are really saying to Russia behind the scenes is a different matter.
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I think you are wrong flecc.
Are you now claiming Donald Tusk and many more with absolutely no political affiliation to Tories are playing political games? Rather a dangerous game..poking the Bear for no reason.( according to you)
Rubbish Flecc.
 

Woosh

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poking the Bear for no reason.
I honestly can't see why we should be afraid of the Russians.
What do they have that we should be afraid of?
That does not stop BJ whipping up xenophobia though.
 
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Zlatan

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Nov 26, 2016
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I honestly can't see why we should be afraid of the Russians.
What do they have that we should be afraid of?
That does not stop BJ whipping up xenophobia though.
We were talking about Donald Tusk's comments.
Johnson's comments were OTT but not being very careful about Russia's ambitions and actions would be very stupid.
I do think Donald Tusk along with EU giving UK more support will heelp situation. I think Russia was expecting us to be in isolation and hence more vulnerable to actions like these. They have been testing the situation, the whole affair was unnecessarily clumsy for a reason. Anybody not cautious of Russia does recognise what's happened in Crimean,Ukraine and with similar actions to Salisbury.( or the probing flights by Russian military over UK and EU)
 
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flecc

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Oct 25, 2006
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I think you are wrong flecc.
Are you now claiming Donald Tusk and many more with absolutely no political affiliation to Tories are playing political games? Rather a dangerous game..poking the Bear for no reason.( according to you)
Rubbish Flecc.
You should have read my last sentence:

"What they are really saying to Russia behind the scenes is a different matter."

In other words, never take what is being said publically as the only words on an issue. There's always communications behind the scenes between the diplomatic staffs on both sides, and that is what counts.
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flecc

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Oct 25, 2006
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What about the corruption of the Russian looking President Yanukovyc who fled when his game was up. So this is NATO and EU's fault - right...
Wicky, I don't need you to keep posting history I'm well aware of.

Yes, Yanokovyc was undoubtedly corrupt and fled for his life. But as I posted earlier but you ignored, the current incumbent Poroshenko is even worse and under accusation at the moment. He's also no friend of the West as this link shows.
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oldgroaner

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Nov 15, 2015
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So the UK is only outnumbered 38 to 1, and we've always got the Home Guard to fall back on.

Nothing to worry about.
.
All together now, after 3.
Music Maestro ~Please.

"Who do you think you are kidding Mr Putin,
If you think we're on the Run?
TM is the one who will stop your little game,
Boris is the one who will make you think again!
....Chorus........:confused:
 

Woosh

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May 19, 2012
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How about the availability of 3,000,000 men at arms for starters!:eek:

Tom
so what are they going to do?
Set up a new jungle camp in Calais to immigrate here?
 
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oldtom

Esteemed Pedelecer
'What else can we do after the public start to tire of and see through the Russian military-grade, deadly nerve agent story?' says May to her political strategy advisor.

'No problem' says the advisor; 'we simply ramp up media coverage of the impending royal wedding and that will keep people's minds off 'Brexit' till the middle of summer. After that, if nothing crops up that we can milk for another few months, we'll just have to resort to further smears against Corbyn......and don't forget, there's always the chance of a royal funeral any time soon. If that were to be made to happen, that would see us united in grief as a nation and see us all the way through to March 2019!'

'Excellent!' says May. 'Things seem to be going swimmingly! Can we catch the waiter's eye?....I rather fancy another glass or two of this rather fine French plonk!'

18595478_771327249707642_9175547513154551438_o.jpg


Tom
 

oldgroaner

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Nov 15, 2015
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Corbyn has sacked Owen Jones from the front bench over his call for a second referendum
"That ship has Sailed"claims Corbyn.

The ship you have watched sail was....

YOUR SHIP YOU FOOL!

Never was a country Worse served by both the Government and the Opposition Simultaneously.

Neither group represent the huge number of "leave" voters, and in that situation we have in fact abandoned any pretext that Westminster is governing for anyone other than the people who pull their strings, using the Marginal Referendum result as justification, in the full knowledge (by their own forecasts) that the best deal and future we can achieve is worse than we have now, and the idiot opposition back them up.

Let's fast forward a few years,if Brexit proves the disaster expected,what excuse can Corbyn or more likely his successor offer when asked "You knew this was a bad idea, why did you roll over and go along with it?"

If ever there was a guaranteed certain way of ensuring your party will stay out of power, the phrase "That Boat has sailed" must rank as an all time classic.
 
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Woosh

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TM has bought us some time.
we have until around June 2020 to really make up our mind how to see the future.
You know I am a soft brexiter, I think getting out but staying close is the best compromise.
Norway + is the best way.
 
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oldgroaner

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TM has bought us some time.
we have until around June 2020 to really make up our mind how to see the future.
You know I am a soft brexiter, I think getting out but staying close is the best compromise.
Norway + is the best way.
No way is the best way, why should we have to choose between the lesser of several evils, when the clear and obvious choice is to cancel Brexit before it becomes Rexit, and the only winner then will be Putin.
 

Woosh

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for once, BJ makes the brexiters feel happy about the support the EU gave to our government.
Isn't it confusing?
 
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oldgroaner

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From the Guardian
"
Cambridge Analytica conducted data research for one of the leading Brexit campaign groups and then misled the public and MPs over the work the company had undertaken, according to a former employee who has spoken to the Guardian.

In an exclusive interview, Brittany Kaiser, Cambridge Analytica’s business development director until two weeks ago, said the work with Leave.EU involved analysis of data provided by Ukip.

Emails and other documents, seen by the Guardian, show the company was worried about whether it could speak openly about the “interesting findings” and the origins of the data that had been analysed. It decided against doing so.

Leaked: Cambridge Analytica's blueprint for Trump victory
Read more
Kaiser, 30, said the work took a number of weeks and involved “at least six or seven meetings” with senior officials from Leave.EU, which was co-founded by Arron Banks, a Ukip donor. She said the work took place as part of an effort to secure formal business with the campaign group.."
"
Kaiser’s revelations will reignite a fierce argument about the tactics used to try to influence voters in the Brexit campaign – and will add to the pressure on Alexander Nix, the CEO of Cambridge Analytica.

The company is already under investigation by the Electoral Commission over what role, if any, it played in the EU referendum campaign.

Banks said: “Leave.EU did not receive any data or work from Cambridge Analytica. Ukip did give Cambridge Analytica some of its data and Cambridge Analytica did some analysis of this. But it was not used in the Brexit campaign. Cambridge Analytica tried to make me pay for that work but I refused. It had nothing to do with us.”

Nix has repeatedly denied there was any involvement, telling MPs last month: “Let me be absolutely crystal clear about this. I do not know how many ways I can say this. We did not work for Leave.EU. We have not undertaken any paid or unpaid work for them, OK?”

His testimony appears to be challenged by Kaiser, who was a senior employee at the company until she left following a contractual dispute earlier this month.

Interesting! but as usual we will never get to know the true story, will we?
 

oldtom

Esteemed Pedelecer
Has the imposter playing the part of the British Prime Minister managed to convince you of Russian culpability in the 'Military-Grade Deadly Nerve Agent' used against a couple of Russians in Salisbury?

As investigations continue very, very slowly into the make-up and origin of this toxic substance, it appears that all may not be what the public has been led to believe:

doubts-mount-over-plausibility-of-nerve-agent-attack-in-salisbury

Tom
 
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