Advice please.... Pro Rider E-Wayfarer controller.

[Nealh]

Sorry as Columbo said "one more thing’..........
Is there any terminology that I can use in searching so I can find some with three?

Try hall sensor ebike brake levers or 3 wire ebike brake levers.
The ones with the Yellow julet connectors will work, either chop off the Julet end and wire/shrink direct or buy short tale Julet female connectors wire /shrink them direct to the controller brake lines and simply plug the brakes in.

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With Julet's there are two round types the short connector 1st generation or the slightly longer type 2nd generation connector.

 

[Lazeyboy]

About 13/14 days I find so not to bad.

Thanks for that, I promise not to bug you too much when it does come.

Just to let you know I have ordered a 36v 22A Basic controller + KD716 Display.
Im going to try your idea about using my existing brake handles for now and see if it works before going ahead and buying the other ones you suggested.
Thanks again.

 

[Nealh]

I did mention in #10 that 22a will be ok if your battery cab support 22a discharge, did you check your battery max continuous current out put.

 

[Lazeyboy]

I did mention in #10 that 22a will be ok if your battery cab support 22a discharge, did you check your battery max continuous current out put.

Thanks, It is described as ‘ GC® E-BIKE Battery 36V 23.8Ah 857Wh Silverfish with Panasonic Original Cells’.

Green Cell® E-Bike Battery 36V 23.8Ah Panasonic Cells Electric Bicycle

Green Cell® E-Bike Battery 36V 23.8Ah Li-Ion Panasonic Cells Electric Bicycle Silverfish with Charger immediate dispatch, 12 month warranty, efficient cells

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Being a newbie at this I had thought, maybe wrongly, that the 250 watt motor would govern the maximum output. (So about 7 amps?) Am I wrong?
I choose this battery because of its 23ah rating which helps with the hills and long country roads I have in north Wales, over the 10ah battery that came with the ebike.

I hadn’t thought about power output or even speed for that matter.

Would the controller somehow make the bike illegal to use on the road as I can’t seem to find any details of it online?

 

[Nealh]

As long as the hub is 250w then it is legal, ideally should be marked.
For testing/certifying then about 7a is what is used for the 250w nominal rating. The 250w rating being governed by copper windings used inside, a hub rated with a higher nominal wattage would over heat through inefficiency and thus fail. The hub can output more watts temporarily, with the 22a controller you will get about 630w in max assist mode. You will be riding like Geraint up those hills.
The controller there are no reg's saying what or how many amps.

It depends on which Panasonic cells it is using all I can say is it is 7 cells in parallel for 23.8ah so 3400mah cells, apart from the capacity rating there are no other specs on the cells and there rating for discharge. With 7 cells in parallel 22a supply if needed should be an issue.

 

[Lazeyboy]

As long as the hub is 250w then it is legal, ideally should be marked.
For testing/certifying then about 7a is what is used for the 250w nominal rating. The 250w rating being governed by copper windings used inside, a hub rated with a higher nominal wattage would over heat through inefficiency and thus fail. The hub can output more watts temporarily, with the 22a controller you will get about 630w in max assist mode. You will be riding like Geraint up those hills.
The controller there are no reg's saying what or how many amps.

It depends on which Panasonic cells it is using all I can say is it is 7 cells in parallel for 23.8ah so 3400mah cells, apart from the capacity rating there are no other specs on the cells and there rating for discharge. With 7 cells in parallel 22a supply if needed should be an issue.

I purchased the bike from ‘pro-rider’ a uk based company probably getting on for 4 years ago, so I’m guessing it would be 250w and has a green dot sticker on it.

I understand that it may give more on a short term basis. On a level road I get 16.5mph no more, which can be boring on a long country straight, ( I do hope things may change).
I have noticed, with the new batter, that it does seem a little more zippy when pulling away and takes hills a little easier, but Geraint and the Lycra crew that cycle along our Conwy valley easily do 25mph on a straight, peloton inc. (It only on the hills when I go passed them.....they really don’t like that, the word CHEAT! get used a lot.
My only worry is that there are a few speed traps hiding around, so I’m I bit concerned if I find the new controller inadvertently takes me over the 16.5mph we are blessed with.

 

[Nealh]

There are no speeding laws for bikes and below 20 mph no one will take much notice.
My KT/Bafang CST hub combo cuts out at 16.5 mph using my six year old 29E celled batteries but I can in benign conditions do 20 mph, so am pedalling above the assist with my power input.

 

[Lazeyboy]

There are no speeding laws for bikes and below 20 mph no one will take much notice.
My KT/Bafang CST hub combo cuts out at 16.5 mph using my six year old 29E celled batteries but I can in benign conditions do 20 mph, so am pedalling above the assist with my power input.

Hi again, received the parcel today which was surprisingly quick, but I think I may have ordered the wrong type?
Until I had it in my hands to compare, it was only then it dawned on me that there is a cluster of cables that are missing. They have six small wires and seem to go with the three main wires that go to the motor.
After saying that they both have a nine pin plug/socket arrangement so I’m guessing that it might be ok if internally the connections are correc?
I’m not sure if I’m missing something so if you wouldn’t mind taking a look at the photos?

Thanks.

 

[Nealh]

Your hub motor has the standard 9 pin Julet connector on the wheel stay you need the Julet motor extension cable to connect the motor to the controller.
The wiring order follows a standard sequence so it is plug and play, you need this extender cable between the julet motor wire and the controller julet.

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Other connections like PAS and throttle might not have the same sm3 pin connector or the wire sequence might be wrong, so you may have to do some rewiring with new connectors or solder wires direct.
Get the motor wire extender sorted first then the PAS and throttle connection, show us an individual pic of the pas wire connector and the new controller connector . Same goes for throttle and we can help sort out the sequence/order for you. When changing controller brands there usually is a little difference to over come like connectors or wire sequence.
The display is an easy fix as the new one will simply connect to the new controller.

 

[Lazeyboy]

Your hub motor has the standard 9 pin Julet connector on the wheel stay you need the Julet motor extension cable to connect the motor to the controller.
The wiring order follows a standard sequence so it is plug and play, you need this extender cable between the julet motor wire and the controller julet.

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Other connections like PAS and throttle might not have the same sm3 pin connector or the wire sequence might be wrong, so you may have to do some rewiring with new connectors or solder wires direct.
Get the motor wire extender sorted first then the PAS and throttle connection, show us and individual pic of the pas wire connector and the new controller connector . Same goes for throttle and we can help sort out the sequence/order for you. When changing controller brands there usually is a little difference to over come like connectors or wire sequence.
The display is an easy fix as the new one will simply connect to the new controller.

Thanks, that a relief........The 9 pin connector is long enough to reach so should I still need the extension? There are arrows on both so I guess I should just line them up?
Hope these photos of the other connections show enough details.
Thanks for your continued help.

 

[Nealh]

No you don't need the motor wire extender if it/the controller comfortably reach each other. Yes line the arrows up and gently push them together, on the male connector you will feel/see a raised line to push up to.

 

[Nealh]

The Battery connector you can use any that matches your battery so if you need to cut them off and resolder on the wiring.

The controller PAS and your PAS both have a JST sm3 female connector so you will need to change one for a male connector from Ebay/ Amazon or rob the ones off your old controller making sure you cut them with enough wire tail to solder and insulate..
Just match the Black/Black (Gnd),Red/Red (5v) & Green/Blue (Signal).

For throttle the connectors will mate but the wire sequence is wrong, the male controller one you can get the pins/wires out with a small needle though it is a bit fiddly . You have to carefully poke in the end to press the small barb in either that or cut it off and solder a new male/tale to it like the PAS one. Again match the Gnd & 5v together and the signal is what ever the two colours are left.

The lights will need working out so that your handlebar switch turns them on.
Probably use all the old wire loom from the controller , cutting the loom at the Green mark I made. The two lines from new controller, cut the two reds join them together with a connector and then connect to the single Red (Blue arrow), the Red supplies the power to the switch splitting to a permanent supply and a switched supply by the looks of it. Then join each single Black wire to each of the Brown light wires. I'm assuming that the Brown is Gnd, your meter should tell you this when you check them.






Display no problem.

Brakes, I don't know if these will work. Just try connecting one Red/Red & Blue /Grey. If not you may have to get new 3 wire brake cut out levers.

 

[Lazeyboy]

The Battery connector you can use any that matches your battery so if you need to cut them off and resolder on the wiring.

The controller PAS and your PAS both have a JST sm3 female connector so you will need to change one for a male connector from Ebay/ Amazon or rob the ones off your old controller making sure you cut them with enough wire tail to solder and insulate..
Just match the Black/Black (Gnd),Red/Red (5v) & Green/Blue (Signal).

For throttle the connectors will mate but the wire sequence is wrong, the male controller one you can get the pins/wires out with a small needle though it is a bit fiddly . You have to carefully poke in the end to press the small barb in either that or cut it off and solder a new male/tale to it like the PAS one. Again match the Gnd & 5v together and the signal is what ever the two colours are left.

The lights will need working out so that your handlebar switch turns them on.
Probably use all the old wire loom from the controller , cutting the loom at the Green mark I made. The two lines from new controller, cut the two reds join them together with a connector and then connect to the single Red (Blue arrow), the Red supplies the power to the switch splitting to a permanent supply and a switched supply by the looks of it. Then join each single Black wire to each of the Brown light wires. I'm assuming that the Brown is Gnd, your meter should tell you this when you check them.

View attachment 35566




Display no problem.

Brakes, I don't know if these will work. Just try connecting one Red/Red & Blue /Grey. If not you may have to get new 3 wire brake cut out levers.

Hi again, you may be glad to know, (I am!) that following your advice I have now successfully, I think, managed to fit the controller and so far it seem to be okay. I’ll probably have to change the settings somehow because I have only got one speed at the moment, which I think is full.
I tried every combination of wires for the brakes but nothing cuts the motor so I’ve ordered the new brakes from AliExpress.

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I noticed there was a £9 and a £11 version of the sm 3pin type you mentioned in a earlier post, I couldn’t see a difference so I ordered both of them.
The lights ended out to be easier than I expected because there is a switch on the remote control for the handlebars that turns them both on.
So now I’m off to try and understand the manual.
Thanks again.

 

[Lazeyboy]

The Battery connector you can use any that matches your battery so if you need to cut them off and resolder on the wiring.

The controller PAS and your PAS both have a JST sm3 female connector so you will need to change one for a male connector from Ebay/ Amazon or rob the ones off your old controller making sure you cut them with enough wire tail to solder and insulate..
Just match the Black/Black (Gnd),Red/Red (5v) & Green/Blue (Signal).

For throttle the connectors will mate but the wire sequence is wrong, the male controller one you can get the pins/wires out with a small needle though it is a bit fiddly . You have to carefully poke in the end to press the small barb in either that or cut it off and solder a new male/tale to it like the PAS one. Again match the Gnd & 5v together and the signal is what ever the two colours are left.

The lights will need working out so that your handlebar switch turns them on.
Probably use all the old wire loom from the controller , cutting the loom at the Green mark I made. The two lines from new controller, cut the two reds join them together with a connector and then connect to the single Red (Blue arrow), the Red supplies the power to the switch splitting to a permanent supply and a switched supply by the looks of it. Then join each single Black wire to each of the Brown light wires. I'm assuming that the Brown is Gnd, your meter should tell you this when you check them.

View attachment 35566




Display no problem.

Brakes, I don't know if these will work. Just try connecting one Red/Red & Blue /Grey. If not you may have to get new 3 wire brake cut out levers.

After my previous message I then had a closer look at things......At first all seemed fine as I was just using the throttle, then I noticed that the display wasn’t registering any speed or distance. Admittedly I am only holding the rear wheel off the ground an opening the throttle.
Also turning the pedals doesn’t seem to activate the motor only using the throttle.
I did notice when I was using the multimeter before I disconnected the PAS cable from my old controller I had 5v from the red and 0v from the green but on the new controller we had 5v from red & 3v from the blue wire until I connect it then it goes from 3v to 0v.
Not sure if that matters but I only have throttle power but no difference when I change the different settings on the display and no peddle assist.

 

[Nealh]

That's a bugger.
The old controller got wet inside I wonder if it might have damaged the hall in the PAS via the 5v line.
With the PAS connected poke you probes into the back of the connector you should get 5v between 5v /Gnd & about 1v between Gnd/signal.

 

[Lazeyboy]

That's a bugger.
The old controller got wet inside I wonder if it might have damaged the hall in the PAS via the 5v line.
With the PAS connected poke you probes into the back of the connector you should get 5v between 5v /Gnd & about 1v between Gnd/signal.

I didn’t want to over complicate the discussion but I thought I would let you know that I am in fact doing 2 bikes at the same time, one for me and one for my wife.
So I have two controllers and two displays.
This morning I tried the other controller and found out that that one is completely dead, not even turning on the display.
I then put my old controller back in and everything is working again.
I’m not sure what the seller of these are going to make of me but I’ve messaged them telling them of the situation and am now waiting for a very kind and understanding person in China to answer.
So I have, I think, two good displays, and two controllers that are not at the moment working.

 

[Lazeyboy]

That's a bugger.
The old controller got wet inside I wonder if it might have damaged the hall in the PAS via the 5v line.
With the PAS connected poke you probes into the back of the connector you should get 5v between 5v /Gnd & about 1v between Gnd/signal.

Hi again, so I think I’m happily back to square one after the seller kindly and quickly offered to refund without return. (Just waiting on AliExpress to issue it.)
The seller says that the controller was not compatible with my bike but doesn’t say why. I have seller why and what I would need to change to make it so.
Any ideas what I may need to change?

 

[Nealh]

I have had another look at the seller link and the controllers and managed to expand the fuzzy pics the controllers are sensor less square wave models so my mistake for not noticing this when supplying the link, the actual vendor doesn't mention this at all.
The motor connector you can't distinguish it is 3 or 9 pin but now looking at the controller label albeit fuzzy I can now see it syas sensor less.

The fact that one controller /display doesn't even switch on suggests there is also a QC factor with this batch as well.

You best option now if you want to start again is use a KT sinewave set up at least sellers describe them much better. You will be back to wire connector compatibility so best to scrap all you have and buy everything again.

 

[Lazeyboy]

I have had another look at the seller link and the controllers and managed to expand the fuzzy pics the controllers are sensor less square wave models so my mistake for not noticing this when supplying the link, the actual vendor doesn't mention this at all.
The motor connector you can't distinguish it is 3 or 9 pin but now looking at the controller label albeit fuzzy I can now see it syas sensor less.

The fact that one controller /display doesn't even switch on suggests there is also a QC factor with this batch as well.

You best option now if you want to start again is use a KT sinewave set up at least sellers describe them much better. You will be back to wire connector compatibility so best to scrap all you have and buy everything again.

Thanks, to be honest, if your nerves can take it, I would like to start again as we will be looking for new controllers soon, so while I have too much time on my hands it may be best to try and sort it now.

Im afraid my knowledge doesn’t stretch that much into knowing about sensors and sine waves, so would it be too much to ask if you know of a controller that comes with a good display that would suit our bikes?
If you want to duck out of this I won’t be offended as as you have already helped us a great deal and I’m sure you have more important things to do.

 

[Nealh]

Right round two....
The original request was a replacement for the Ananda which you showed pics of and it was a sensored signwave model.

This other controller is a Lishui but not the one you received yes ?