1-1-2016 Today's Change in the Law.

[soundwave]

Business needs certainty to design for the future...if you were a UK e-bike designer looking 12 months ahead what spec would you make these bikes?

one of these with pedals on it

http://www.zytekautomotive.co.uk/products/electric-engines/170kw/

and some fat tyres on it

batts a tad to big tho atm;(

 

[craiggor]

I suppose the trade body"s where happy with the no throttle,because it hides the battery range.If you gave the people mopeds that they can ride with no helmets/reg they would be in moped heaven.

 

[flecc]

Could BEBA and the BAGB have not guided the Dft better?
KudosDave

Judged by their responses, I think the DfT only took notice of two things:

First a fundamental intention to abide by EU pedelec law.

Second to try to show some response to the one major factor expressed in the public consultation, a desire to keep throttles.

What they came up with was compliance with the first, plus a sop to those wanting throttles that also appeared to meet with EU requirements. i.e. Treating a throttle pedelec as an EAPC in the UK if type approved.

It may well be that they don't care that the latter condition is impractical, superficially they've met their brief to satisfy both. From their point of view and in the greater scheme of things, this is a minor issue affecting very few.
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[martindf3]

I'll start by saying the chances of being caught in consequence of any of the following are minimal. However, it's only right that everyone should be aware of the law as it applies to them.

From today, to be a bureacracy free pedelec (EAPC), any new electric assisted bike bought must have it's power actuated by pedal control when riding, throttles acting independently without pedal rotation are not permitted, except on pre-existing bikes with "grandfather rights".

Some pedelecs may have a walk-assist throttle fitted which can act up to 4 mph. Nothing in pedelec law permits that, it's only legal due to the Pedestrian Controlled Vehicle Regulations of 1963, which only permits pedestrian control. It follows that if one of these new pedelecs throttles is used while on board to take off without pedalling, the rider is guilty of riding an unregistered and uninsured motor vehicle. If they don't have a group Q, AM, P, A, A1 or A2 driving licence, they will be guilty of driving unlicenced too.

I stress that the chance of any police officer detecting and stopping anyone for that "take-off" usage is virtually zero. However, if you are aware of the law and if ever that did happen, you will know its best to act the innocent and not challenge the officer. They would then undoubtedly not bother to pursue the matter other than giving the relevant advice.
.

Thanks for that . I do like to know the law . Having said all that I must admit that my bike is not legal (48V 1000w motor ) all the marks I have removed , and don't ride aggressively anymore , so hopefully wont attract the boys in blue . But I do hold a full motorbike license ,so wouldn't have to worry on that bit . I never ride without pedalling but my PAS is disconnected and I just use the throttle gently . Hopefully my "Keep out of trouble, ride thoughtfully ,don't overtake any cars at 25mph pedalling or not and don't ride at 20mph up hills " will keep me from being pulled.

 

[shemozzle999]

I hope all the dealers are sure of their position of placing bikes on the market and are aware of their responsibility when placing their bikes on the market that if they do not meet the EPAC requirements then they will fall under the 168/2013 regulations which specify dealer conditions and failure procedures that have to be followed by the authorities.

 

[flecc]

Link to a PDF of 168/2013 Type Approval document.

In respect of basic compliance, articles 9 to 24 inclusive apply to manufacturers, importers, agents and dealers.
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[OldBob1]

What a state we have come too!!! Laws being thought up and passed by well paid professionals that no nothing. which oppose and stop the people of the country getting out and enjoying a healthier live style.
As usual the only ones that will be effected are us Legal ones.
(Move soap box back under stairs)

 

[mike killay]

From my copy of the DoT document quoted by Flecc above, I get the impression that the UK would be happy to ignore throttles and it is the EU that gets in the way (again)

 

[flecc]

From my copy of the DoT document quoted by Flecc above, I get the impression that the UK would be happy to ignore throttles and it is the EU that gets in the way (again)

True, but look at the entirety instead of being so selective and misrepresenting the EU and UK positions.

This is what the EU gives it's citizens:

250 watts with considerable tolerance allowing peaks of over double that.

Maximum assist speed of 15.5 mph.

No lower age limit.

This was what the UK gave us:

A strict and useless 200 watts limit, no peak powers allowed.

Maximum assist speed 12 mph.

Lower age limit of 14 years.

And if we'd never joined the EU and started harmonisation, that's all we'd still have, as we know from the DfT's intransigent attitudes to more speed and power. Remember, the UK never gave us throttles, they merely omitted how their useless 200 watts was controlled, a power level that rendered throttles impotent anyway.
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[martindf3]

From my copy of the DoT document quoted by Flecc above, I get the impression that the UK would be happy to ignore throttles and it is the EU that gets in the way (again)

I would be happy to not use the throttle and just use PAS ..... But .... My wife has a Juicy classic click,i think and when we ride together theses' a miss match between settings on PAS modes hence I always use the throttle then the bikes can travel at the same speed

 

[Lancslass]

1. I would be happy to not use the throttle and just use PAS ..... But .... My wife has a Juicy classic click,i think and when we ride together theses' a miss match between settings on PAS modes hence I always use the throttle then the bikes can travel at the same speed

I'm being spectacularly stupid here Martin!
I have a Juicy Classic and my husband rides with me as well. Are you saying that your bike can't keep up with your wife when she uses PAS, so you use throttle to keep at her speed? What bike do you ride?

 

[trex]

martindf3 rides a DD 1000W bike. It's much more natural to ride these bikes with throttle and I concur with Martin. It's the same riding with my wife. It's difficult to keep riding together (and have a conversation) when one is a much stronger pedaller than the other or the two bikes are very different.

 

[Lancslass]

martindf3 rides a DD 1000W bike. It's much more natural to ride these bikes with throttle and I concur with Martin. It's the same riding with my wife. It's difficult to keep riding together (and have a conversation) when one is a much stronger pedaller than the other or the two bikes are very different.

Duh! My ignorance Apologies to all, sorry Martin
Trex, you want a conversation - with your wife?........

 

[VictoryV]

Duh! My ignorance Apologies to all, sorry Martin
Trex, you want a conversation - with your wife?........

Just to say "Yes Dear"

 

[Lancslass]

Just to say "Yes Dear"

Yes, I find that usually works well with me.

 

[VictoryV]

Yes, I find that usually works well with me.

The basis of 45 yrs happy marriage!

 

[Lancslass]

The basis of 45 yrs happy marriage!

40 for us. We're both doing something right!

 

[VictoryV]

40 for us. We're both doing something right!

Yes Dear!

 

[HelenJ]

In today from the DfT:
Guidance on European Type Approval for certain Electrically Assisted Pedal Cycles (EAPC)

http://www.pedelecs.co.uk/forum/resources/guidance-on-european-type-approval-for-certain-electrically-assisted-pedal-cycles-eapc.11/

Has anyone else been sent this from the DfT? (Still marked as a ‘draft’ and a ‘short consultation’ in ‘due course’ will decide on penalties for not having type approval in the UK apparently).

I emailed them to ask about contradicting roll out dates for twist and go type approval (Jan 2016 or Jan 2017) and for details on the process manufacturers will need to go through to obtain type approval from 2016 – since we’re already here

This pdf is their reply just in (see link above to Resources). From a quick look through..

The doc says that from now until 2018 (a new date in the equation I think?) the only type approval requirement for an in-scope EAPC is lighting, in the form of an ‘automatic headlamp’ (ISO 6742-1:1987 comes on automatically when bike is in motion). Type approval for the same from Jan 2018 will encompass broader requirements.

As we know, speed pedelecs and those exceeding 250w are classified as mopeds & require type approval (L1e-A up to 1000kw/25kmh, L1e-B 4kw/45kmh).

However 5 (b) Q&A talks about over-speed/over-power non-EAPCs and seems to imply speed pedelecs with a full throttle can be type approved since it says ‘regardless of the precise mode of power assistance’.

Previously I wasn’t sure speed pedelecs with open throttle could be type approved to L1e-B, I thought only L1e-A was available for twist & gos and that’s up to 25kmh, so technically no category.

The doc doesn’t go into the detail I asked about type approval procedure, but seems to be quite confident that the VCA can type approve a ‘vehicle range’. I’ll leave that, and the rest, up for discussion

 

[shemozzle999]

If true, then manufacturers could type approve an EAPC by adding a AHO light onto the bike then submit them to the VCA as a small series of 50 bikes at a time, for UK approval, if I have understood the small series rules correctly.