Woosh Santana CD gearchange quality

[dmsims]

The Woosh is about 2 months old (and we also have a 3 year old Freego)

The Woosh gear change is shockingly bad (yes even when there is no power applied)! - it feels as if there is someone at the back bashing the chain with a hammer and it's very noisy and won't always change gear

I made some minor adjustments but have also taken it to the bike shop with no improvement

Does anyone have any suggestions ?

The Freego has been faultless in this regard

 

[John F]

Check the cable isn't frayed thus restricting the movement. Also my chain wore out quicker than expected. You need to check, clean, adjust the transmission then consider your changing technique. You don't need to be constantly changing gear like an non electric.

I spent a lot of time adjusting my gears, to the point that I thought they were spot on. The gears did change better after that. I will get a longer lasting chain too (you can get CD ebike specific ones)

It's a basic drawback with CD bikes with all that power going through the chain makes it more of an issue

The trick is to make sure you get into the right gear before a hill, i.e. power off - change gear - apply brake slightly to cut power when starting pedalling to enable gears to change without power.

 

[JohnCade]

Check the cable isn't frayed thus restricting the movement. Also my chain wore out quicker than expected. You need to check, clean, adjust the transmission then consider your changing technique. You don't need to be constantly changing gear like an non electric.

I spent a lot of time adjusting my gears, to the point that I thought they were spot on. The gears did change better after that. I will get a longer lasting chain too (you can get CD ebike specific ones

It's a basic drawback with CD bikes with all that power going through the chain makes it more of an issue

The trick is to make sure you get into the right gear before a hill, i.e. power off - change gear - apply brake slightly to cut power when starting pedalling to enable gears to change without power.

I find that just stopping pedalling cuts the power very quickly. Then if you start pedalling again and change gear at the same time by the time the motor cuts in you're in the lower gear.

 

[Deleted member 4366]

When you say "without power", do you mean with no intended power or with the motor actually stopped because the motor runs on for a bit after you stop pedalling, which causes the problem. Also, the main problem came when changing down under load, like when going up a hill.

The reason that these CD bikes have difficulty changing compared with a hub-motor is that the high tension on the chain prevents the mechanism from working properly. Assuming that there's nothing else wrong with your gears, it's this problem that you have to solve.

I found that the changing was perfectly acceptable if you changed down much earlier than you normally would, so, as I got to the start of a steep climb, I would change right down to first gear from the start, so that I was pedalling air through the gears until the bike slowed down enough to be able to pedal in first gear. This way there's no load on the chain while you change, so it changes very easily. Changing up is OK as long as you wait a bit between stopping pedalling and changing gears.

The only other solutions are to upgrade the gear-set, but even Shimano Deore XT go with a bit of a bang and wear out quickly, or you can swap to a Nuvinci hub, which is expensive and heavy.

Some people will tell you to blip the brake before you change gear to cut the motor, which removes tension, but I found that there was too much delay in power coming back that meant it couldn't work for hill-climbing.

 

[Deleted member 4366]

I find that just stopping pedalling cuts the power very quickly. Then if you start pedalling again and change gear at the same time by the time the motor cuts in you're in the lower gear.

Is that with a Woosh CD bike?

 

[JohnCade]

Is that with a Woosh CD bike?

Yes the Sport CD. I find the motor stops as quickly doing that as touching the brake. Neither method really works on a steep hill of course, and it's best to be in the lowest gear to begin with there.

 

[Artstu]

Yes the Sport CD. I find the motor stops as quickly doing that as touching the brake. Neither method really works on a steep hill of course, and it's best to be in the lowest gear to begin with there.

A very disappointing aspect of that crank drive system. I change gear very often on the climbs I do, changing up or down to suit, whilst the Bosch mated to a Nexus hub isn't perfect it is easy to master the technique required to get smooth gear changes. Changing into a low gear at the start of a climb just wouldn't be acceptable for me.

 

[dmsims]

Thanks for all the comments

hills certainly took some adjusting to (we have lots 15-20% ones here in Devon) and the first ride I ended up stopped dead because I used the brake touch method. You cannot always anticipate the best gear and there are always hazards down the lanes.

To try and clarify the gear change is really bad when the motor is not turning at all (I test it on the flat bit outside the house

 

[JohnCade]

It should be possible to get the mech to change okay using the adjustments. Mine is good up and down without power.

In my previous experience of unpowered bikes I found that the better mechs were marginally better changers and kept adjustment better. But their main benefit was that they were made of better materials and could take more abuse without breaking.

 

[dmsims]

One other thing I have noticed is small metallic particles when lubing the chain

 

[JohnCade]

Have you looked at the gears and are they damaged or hooked?

 

[dmsims]

The bike was only was only bought in April and has been problematic from new. I cannot see any damage

 

[JohnCade]

I assume you've contacted Woosh? I bought a Sport CD very recently which has an electrical problem and they are having it picked up.

 

[dmsims]

I have contacted them several about this and a lot of other "issues"

The last email I had from Andrew was on 27th April below - not heard a thing since!

"Hi David,

You do seem to be having more issues than most, I assume the other bikes that you’ve had were the normal hub motor type and therefore the gears are not subject to the same amount of stress. I am surprised that after having a bike shop adjust them that the chain is coming off. If she hasn’t done so already, my colleague Hatti will be in touch to discuss some options with you.

Regards, Andy"

 

[John F]

I find that just stopping pedalling cuts the power very quickly. Then if you start pedalling again and change gear at the same time by the time the motor cuts in you're in the lower gear.

Yes but you need to have got it into the gear you want BEFORE the motor kicks in which is only a second or so. You'll hear lots of graunching noise if you dont!

 

[John F]

It should be possible to get the mech to change okay using the adjustments. Mine is good up and down without power.

In my previous experience of unpowered bikes I found that the better mechs were marginally better changers and kept adjustment better. But their main benefit was that they were made of better materials and could take more abuse without breaking.

I think it's essential to spend time striving for perfection re your gear adjustment. The better it is the easier it will slip onto the correct sprocket rather than stuck between 2 sprockets thus becoming a problem when the motor kicks in.

Just take time to engage a low gear on a hill and forget about it!

 

[Deleted member 4366]

To change gear on a derailleur bike, the pedals have to be turning. You can't change gear when the chain is stationary.

The next point is that you can't change gear when there's a high load on the chain either, The high load comes when the motors's turning.

So, to get easy gear-changing, you need to be pedalling without much tension on the chain. However you do it is up to you.

If you crash the gears by trying to change while the chain is stationary or when you have power on the chain, you will surely get bits of metal on the chain until something eventually breaks. You need to find the right technique before that happens. You need to try an understand what's going on, so that you can adopt the best technique. This is the one big disadvantage of crank-drives.

 

[Artstu]

This is the one big disadvantage of crank-drives.

and more so on the cheaper versions. Impulse and Bosch have virtually eliminated the issue.

 

[JohnCade]

Yes but you need to have got it into the gear you want BEFORE the motor kicks in which is only a second or so. You'll hear lots of graunching noise if you dont!

Well obviously. Like I said, with my bike I can stop peddling, the motor stops. I start peddling lightly and change gear with an unloaded chain, and by the time the motor starts up I'm in the lower gear.

How long does it take you to change gear?

 

[JohnCade]

I think it's essential to spend time striving for perfection re your gear adjustment. The better it is the easier it will slip onto the correct sprocket rather than stuck between 2 sprockets thus becoming a problem when the motor kicks in.

Just take time to engage a low gear on a hill and forget about it!

Not quite sure why you're replying to me. I don't have the problem.