Wisper 905SE Sport
- Thread starter Laura
- Start date
If there is no button for off road use and the controller is altered so the bike goes over 15mph on throttle alone then it is illegal to use on the road.
And in the very unlikley event that bike is involved in a accident and the equally unlikley chance that the police check the bike you could be in trouble yes or no?
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And in the very unlikley event that bike is involved in a accident and the equally unlikley chance that the police check the bike you could be in trouble yes or no?
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Laura:
I've got a Wisper 905 (2010) with the offroad button, and although I know what it's supposed to do, i.e. allow pedelec input after 15mph, in FACT it seems to affect the power below that speed.
If I'm rolling along at 10-12 mph and the bike doesn't seem as 'nippy' as usual, the first thing I try is the offroad button - and putting it in the 'illegal' position DOES seem to provide more power overall.
Allen
I've got a Wisper 905 (2010) with the offroad button, and although I know what it's supposed to do, i.e. allow pedelec input after 15mph, in FACT it seems to affect the power below that speed.
If I'm rolling along at 10-12 mph and the bike doesn't seem as 'nippy' as usual, the first thing I try is the offroad button - and putting it in the 'illegal' position DOES seem to provide more power overall.
Allen
Obviously yes, but chances pretty slim, the derestricted mode is only a few MPH extra? hardly a staggering difference, and law states a +- 5% tolance anyway I think, so 17mph falls within this .....I have both our bikes permanently derestricted
I cant see what the problem is with doing 20 mph on a bike!...I can peddle faster unassited and im sure a pro can do 40+ mph
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Sorry, I can't talk about derestricting our bikes here. Derestriction is only permitted on our bikes that go to the USA or Canada where higher speeds are permitted.
If you would like to know more about your Wisper's electronics, please speak to your dealer.
By tampering with the electronics on any electric bike so the power does not cut off at 15.5MPH will render the bike illegal to be used on the public road.
There is also a balance between speed and battery range, if a bike is derestricted and is riden at a speed higher than 15.5mph is the range drops significantly. Almost without exception, when a Wisper customer queries range, we find that the bike in question has been derestricted.
Best regards
David
If you would like to know more about your Wisper's electronics, please speak to your dealer.
By tampering with the electronics on any electric bike so the power does not cut off at 15.5MPH will render the bike illegal to be used on the public road.
There is also a balance between speed and battery range, if a bike is derestricted and is riden at a speed higher than 15.5mph is the range drops significantly. Almost without exception, when a Wisper customer queries range, we find that the bike in question has been derestricted.
Best regards
David
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I am sure everybody has a fair idea of the law on bikes,and the fairly obvious effect on battery range when derestricted,all 50cc mopeds and scooters are limited to 30mph,(a legal requirement for a long time now) ,they are usually derestricted at the first service by dealers,to often give 40mph or more legally insurance could be voided,but nobody is ever prosecuted for riding an illegal derestricted motor bike or for having a derestricted bike, generally most riders are young thrill seekers with a need for speed and little regard for pedestrians or other road users,electric bike users,mainly older riders with respect for other people and riding to the conditions, that are seeking a little extra assistance,are warned that their bike may not be fully legal if it does an extra three miles per hour.
This a public forum which anyone can read including those in authority. David is merely protecting his brand image in what will become an increasingly competitive market, and my own experience as a Civil Servant a few years ago was that commercial rivals have no problem with "grassing" up their competitors to Government regulators if they suspect that a competing business breaks some rules.
It might not happen immediately but eventually it will happen.
Already i am noticing (probably linked in with rising petrol prices) a lot more young 20-something lads on pushbikes here - this is no bad thing in environmental terms but many do ride quite aggressively, riding on pavements, paying no heed to traffic lights etc and expecting others to get out of the way. Just because they are on two wheels now doesn't immediately remove the "top gear / gary boy" mentality.
Most are only doing 10-15 mph, but giving them a bit more mph with less physical effort is going to increase the risk of crashes.
In most cases these won't be fatal but they will be enough to create the usual moral panics. So I can see why David is playing it safe. In other nations this sort of moral panic has led to a backlash against e-bikes to the point those in power have called for even greater restrictions and in some cases have got them, and even in cycling nations like the Netherlands there are still disputes over cyclists' behaviour.
As petrol prices rise, Old Bill start clamping down more on mopeds and their riders (outside big city areas they do, as much because of complaints about noise / ASB as any suspected illegality of the bikes) and ebikes become more affordable (especially as second hand models increasingly appear on the market) this isn't always going to be the case.
It might not happen immediately but eventually it will happen.
Already i am noticing (probably linked in with rising petrol prices) a lot more young 20-something lads on pushbikes here - this is no bad thing in environmental terms but many do ride quite aggressively, riding on pavements, paying no heed to traffic lights etc and expecting others to get out of the way. Just because they are on two wheels now doesn't immediately remove the "top gear / gary boy" mentality.
Most are only doing 10-15 mph, but giving them a bit more mph with less physical effort is going to increase the risk of crashes.
In most cases these won't be fatal but they will be enough to create the usual moral panics. So I can see why David is playing it safe. In other nations this sort of moral panic has led to a backlash against e-bikes to the point those in power have called for even greater restrictions and in some cases have got them, and even in cycling nations like the Netherlands there are still disputes over cyclists' behaviour.
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I think there is more chance of tripping over a dodgy pavement and breaking an ankle than crashing a bike at 20 mph
I've seen the aftermath of a few low speed collisions between young cyclists in my town. In these cases they have got away with no more than hurt pride, or maybe a few scrapes, but if it was a collision against someone like an elderly pedestrian the outcome might not have been so good.I think there is more chance of tripping over a dodgy pavement and breaking an ankle than crashing a bike at 20 mph
Bicycle collisions are rare but they do happen and when they affect pedestrians they do tend to generate an excessive amount of negative publicity, which affects the perceived image of all cyclisdts.
And what about "kids" (and increasingly including young adults) riding on the dodgy pavement? I work in a Mid Suffolk village where there is hardly any traffic in the evening or outside peak hours and I still see youths doing this, when it would be perfectly safe to go on the road
And yet older cyclists (including some well into their 70s+) have no problem with riding on the road...Also round here most cycle paths here are full of slower people. Provincial areas outside London or Manchester also tend to have a slower pace of life.. 15mph (or slightly more) may not seem like a lot especially when you are personally used to going fast and can handle riding at that speed, but round here other road users simply do not expect to see anything other than a drop handlebar racing bike going much faster than that.
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It should also be remembered that David has a leading role in the electric bike trade body BEBA which is involved in current UK and EU discussions about changes in the law on e-bikes.
This makes his position especially sensitive, so discussion of his position in this respect is best avoided in all our interests.
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This makes his position especially sensitive, so discussion of his position in this respect is best avoided in all our interests.
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Then why does he keep saying we can de-restrict on every wisper thread or daahub thread
he should know the laws if he is a beba founding member, hes just breaking the law call the cops 
I'm with Alex here, I think ebikers need to be extra careful especially if you're riding above 15mph in built up areas or through towns etc.. As an ebiker myself I'm consciously aware of the potential for nasty accidents on an ebike..you definitely need to use more common sense and care when riding a powered bike compared to an unassisted bike.. an accident at 20mph+ with a car or pedestrian doesn't bear thinking about.I've seen the aftermath of a few low speed collisions between young cyclists in my town. In these cases they have got away with no more than hurt pride, or maybe a few scrapes, but if it was a collision against someone like an elderly pedestrian the outcome might not have been so good.
Bicycle collisions are rare but they do happen and when they affect pedestrians they do tend to generate an excessive amount of negative publicity, which affects the perceived image of all cyclisdts.
And what about "kids" (and increasingly including young adults) riding on the dodgy pavement? I work in a Mid Suffolk village where there is hardly any traffic in the evening or outside peak hours and I still see youths doing this, when it would be perfectly safe to go on the road
Also round here most cycle paths here are full of slower people. Provincial areas outside London or Manchester also tend to have a slower pace of life.. 15mph (or slightly more) may not seem like a lot especially when you are personally used to going fast and can handle riding at that speed, but round here other road users simply do not expect to see anything other than a drop handlebar racing bike going much faster than that.
I think cycles should be limited to 30 mph and cars to 70 mph and motorbikes 60 mph
and lorry should be banned off the road or use them at night!
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Nothing much to do with legality etc., but earlier in this thread I said:
"If I'm rolling along at 10-12 mph and the bike doesn't seem as 'nippy' as usual, the first thing I try is the offroad button - and putting it in the 'illegal' position DOES seem to provide more power overall."
And Rog concurred:
"I agree with that. It's a different beast altogether with 'off road' engaged."
Anyway, I wonder why (as it's not just me) this happens. I thought the 'offroad' function was just a speed restrictor, but from my and Rog's experiences, it seems to have a bearing on the power of the machine overall, that is to say the power UNDER 15.5mph.
So (and please keep it reasonably simple!) what is occurring?
Allen, Wisper 905.
"If I'm rolling along at 10-12 mph and the bike doesn't seem as 'nippy' as usual, the first thing I try is the offroad button - and putting it in the 'illegal' position DOES seem to provide more power overall."
And Rog concurred:
"I agree with that. It's a different beast altogether with 'off road' engaged."
Anyway, I wonder why (as it's not just me) this happens. I thought the 'offroad' function was just a speed restrictor, but from my and Rog's experiences, it seems to have a bearing on the power of the machine overall, that is to say the power UNDER 15.5mph.
So (and please keep it reasonably simple!) what is occurring?
Allen, Wisper 905.
Any particular reason you picked 30mph for bikes?I think cycles should be limited to 30 mph and cars to 70 mph and motorbikes 60 mph
and lorry should be banned off the road or use them at night!
And why have motorbikes 10mph slower than cars?
The controller has two power control functions: in the first place it limits the currect passed to the motor at all assist speeds, in order to (obviously) not cripple the battery or burn out the wiring and the motor, and in the second place it causes power to tail off as the official 15.5 MPH is approached.
How the 'derestrict' function works is entirely dependant on how the controller is programmed. For one thing it doesn't derestrict the bike in any sense - it merely moves the point at which power to the motor tails off up by some 3 MPH. Also as some have noticed it allows more power lower down the scale too, but once again it's a function of how the controller has been programmed. My opinion would be that it becomes noticeable above about 12 MPH.
There's a downside to using the Wisper in its 'off road' guise of course, as the battery has to work harder and so the range is reduced. If you're on the heavy side or not reasonably fit this effect would be more pronounced.
Rog.
How the 'derestrict' function works is entirely dependant on how the controller is programmed. For one thing it doesn't derestrict the bike in any sense - it merely moves the point at which power to the motor tails off up by some 3 MPH. Also as some have noticed it allows more power lower down the scale too, but once again it's a function of how the controller has been programmed. My opinion would be that it becomes noticeable above about 12 MPH.
There's a downside to using the Wisper in its 'off road' guise of course, as the battery has to work harder and so the range is reduced. If you're on the heavy side or not reasonably fit this effect would be more pronounced.
Rog.
Oh no not the cops!Then why does he keep saying we can de-restrict on every wisper thread or daahub thread
We do need to be sensible about de-restrict Scatty.
I do repeat myself, and I apologise for that but I think it is important that people understand that if they modify the bike so the power does not cut out at 15.5MPH +- 10% they are not riding a road legal pedelec. They open themselves up to the possibility of ultimately losing their licence and or heavy fines.
When asked I will continue to give the same advice.
Best regards
David
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