Which is more ethical - Woosh or Cyclotrocity?

I am in a dilemma, not just about which bike to buy, but also from which company. Ethics and environmental considerations are important to me, but it is difficult to find out who are the good guys and who are the bad guys. I am thinking about a bike from either Woosh or Cyclotricity and I am limited to spending max £800. Cyclotricity bikes are designed and made in the UK, so that's good (supports local business, environmental impact has to be considered). But if I'm honest, I think the Woosh bike might suit me better (larger battery, front suspension, crank drive for hills) but these are made, um, well I'm not sure where but I think they are imported from SE Asia. Is buying from Asia intrinsically linked with poor standards for employees and environmental degradation? Who has the highest standards regarding employee welfare and environmental protection? Is there any bike company who excels in these areas?

Hah!!

 

`Ethics and environmental considerations`

 

these go right out the window when there`s a pound to be made in this game and try and overlook `the moral high ground` waffle of dubious dealers.

You`ll find most e-bike parts have their origins in China and Asia anyhow, as do a lot of things nowadays

I wonder what the percentage is of the total parts of a Cyclotricity bike that are made in the UK ?

Or is it just the frame ?

No, not the frame.

No, not the frame.

 

So if they dont even make the frame..... what parts are 'made in the UK' ?

the intellectual part.

So i take it its only assembled in the UK then.

Dont know about Cycloticity but my chinese e-bike manufacturer manufactures frames for just about every European bike manufacturer,they are completely open about their customers....they are unique in making their own 6061 tube from billet,it isnt cheap labour they are all robotically welded.

As for other components,every Shimano part is made in PRC,the motors are Bafang made in Suzhou,TCM crank drive comes from Tianjin,90% of the seats come from Tianjin,King displays come from Shenzhen.....it doesnt leave much!!!!!

KudosDave

by the way are there any British built bicycle/e-bike companies still left in the U.K?

 

And i mean `built` not assembled.

 

I somehow doubt it.

Under current EU rules, country of origin is defined as the place where they “underwent their last, substantial, economically justified process or working”.

From that, if the bikes are designed and PDI'ed here, in the UK, any manufacturer can legally stick a Union flag on their bike.

Proposed new EU directive will require the most expensive component of the product or at leat 40% of the components to be made in the UK to justify the label. Even Brompton would have something to say about that.

Edited November 19, 201510 yr by trex

I think Charge make their own frames here in blighty.

by the way are there any British built bicycle/e-bike companies still left in the U.K?

 

And i mean `built` not assembled.

 

I somehow doubt it.

 

There are some custom frame companies who make frames to order, but that's largely it. All other bike and e-bike parts have to be imported, and that's mainly from China.

 

There's the odd manufacturers of hubs and rims in Germany and a chainring maker in France. We do have some British makers of components and consumables that in part are actually made here, such minor things as spokes, brake pads, twistgrip rubbers etc.

.

My Decathlon 3.10 has a steel frame made in Portugal way back when. Front brake, mudguards, pedals, lights and inner tubes are German, tyres and front rim French, frame lock Dutch. Everything else is Chinese made. My other aluminium frame is Made in Germany.

 

There are frame makers in France, Germany, Spain and Portugal. Italy still makes a lot of stuff in the high end. The Germans and Swiss make motors and assemble batteries with cells from Korea.

 

You could probably assemble your own bike from parts sourced above 90% from the EU but it wouldn't be a cheap bike that is for sure.

There are quite a few parts manufacturers in the UK - people like Hope Technology make quality parts for MTB.

 

http://www.hopetech.com/videos/

 

Also don't think just because a brand is based in Germany, the parts are made there. Lots of tyres from brands like Continental are made outside the EU, its only the really high end ones they still make in Germany.

 

I don't think Charge have ever "made" bikes in the UK. They used to be a UK brand certainly, but now I think they are owned by the group that owns GT and Cannondale, so they aren't even a UK company anymore.

 

Orange bikes are one of the few decent sized MTB brands that still manufacturers some of its frames in the UK.

 

https://www.orangebikes.co.uk/

 

Superstar Components also now have the ability to make many of their parts in the UK, so thats another brand that is worth supporting if you want UK manufactured goods.

 

http://www.superstarcomponents.com/en/

I've just read Cyclotricity's website, and they seem to be saying that they produce lots of components themselves, as well as assembling the bikes here in the UK. Not sure if they make the frames but I suspect they are a top contender for a 'Made in Britain' label....http://cyclotricity.com/built-in-britain/

There is a lot of woolly words on that webpage... i suspect if you drilled them down to what they actually manufacture on their bikes it might be less than they like to make out.

lets face it, cyclotricity is chinese made no matter what fluff they try to feed you.

 

Woosh are made and assembled in china before being shipped over by the container load and rebuilt/checked before being sent to customers

[mention=12492]Jefner[/mention]

what do you think of converting your old bike instead of buying a new one?

The way I see it, converting an old bike would reduce the lifecycle carbon footprint by half.

I was talking to Bob at Juicy Bikes yesterday and they buy from China. However, Bob visits the factory out there 3 times a year and the factory adhere to certain good practice such as working 8-5 rather than all hours. He didn't go into it in great detail but if you chat with him he will tell you more. He gave me the impression that good working practices and ethics were important to him and his wife/business partner.

Not a direct answer to your question I know, but maybe some dealers have more of a handle on what is going on in their factories than others.

Lancslass....you are starting to realise that manufacturers claims in adverts are lets say....a bit flexible...super Wizzo will do up to 150 miles on one charge,oh that was with Wiggo riding and told only to turn the power on downhill,hehe!!! ......super Wizzo weighs 21kgs,that was without the mudguards,the battery,the lights and the rack,hehe!!!......super Wizzo climbs hills with no effort,the hill is only 2% gradient,hehe.......super Wizzo was 100% UK conceived and designed,that means the decision to buy a batch of Chinese bikes was made in a pub in London,drawn on the back of a fag packet,hehe!!!...and just in case you have any doubts we will put on a Union Jack flag.....super Wizzo has a 250 watt nominal motor,lovely word that nominal,it allows anything up to 800 watts,but don't put it through testing,hehe.....unfortunately there is no real standard about the performance of these bikes,it is a marketing mans dream product-they can pretty much claim what they wish and who is to question their claims.... I test rode a new e-bike,it had a 5Ah battery,the salesman claimed 30 miles range,it ran out of power after 8 miles!!!

KudosDave

Wizzo was 100% UK conceived and designed,that means the decision to buy a batch of Chinese bikes was made in a pub in London,drawn on the back of a fag packet,hehe!!!...and just in case you have any doubts we will put on a Union Jack flag

KudosDave

Surely you are not serious Dave, who would ever do that:rolleyes:

Orange bikes are one of the few decent sized MTB brands that still manufacturers some of its frames in the UK.

https://www.orangebikes.co.uk/

 

Orange were the first that sprang to mind, quickly followed by Enigma.

I was talking to Bob at Juicy Bikes yesterday and they buy from China. However, Bob visits the factory out there 3 times a year and the factory adhere to certain good practice such as working 8-5 rather than all hours. He didn't go into it in great detail but if you chat with him he will tell you more. He gave me the impression that good working practices and ethics were important to him and his wife/business partner.

Not a direct answer to your question I know, but maybe some dealers have more of a handle on what is going on in their factories than others.

 

A factory in the far east can tell their customers whatever they want to hear.

I remember a TV expose on Indian clothes factories, supplying clothing for well known high st stores here in the UK. Supposed to be ethical employers with good working conditions and reasonable hours, but they were anything but, with books of falsified working hours and wages for employees that were just for show to the customer.

You're never gonna know for certain how ethical an overseas employer is, because the customer can only spend a very limited time there.

Surely you are not serious Dave, who would ever do that:rolleyes:

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Who could forget the Wisper Union flag?

 

We had almost as much fun with that as we are with Smart ebiker.

Surely you are not serious Dave, who would ever do that:rolleyes:

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Keep quiet,just whisper it,hehe !!!!!

KudosDave