What bike is best for learning the Knowledge of London (black cab) on?

[Lee123]

If the dongle is disconnected it's legal. You might not have a chance to disconnect it if dizzy after an accident though, since in crowded London you'd instantly be surrounded by helpers.
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very true, hopefully i dont have one and if i do hopefully ill have enough of my wits about me to check my bikes ok ;-) ;-)
Do you think that 15mph is fast enough round London though? if so then no need to bother with the dongle..

 

[Lee123]

If the dongle is disconnected it's legal. You might not have a chance to disconnect it if dizzy after an accident though, since in crowded London you'd instantly be surrounded by helpers.
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i guess the faster im going the more chance ive got of having an accident too

 

[flecc]

very true, hopefully i dont have one and if i do hopefully ill have enough of my wits about me to check my bikes ok ;-) ;-)
Do you think that 15mph is fast enough round London though? if so then no need to bother with the dongle..

i guess the faster im going the more chance ive got of having an accident too

I do think 15 or so mph is fast enough, I'm happy with it in London and in your case for the knowledge it allows more time for observation and learning. The faster you race around, the more you'll have to concentrate on the traffic and miss the surroundings and street names.

You'll already know that one has to look hard for the street name plaques, they can be at street level, or high on buildings or well back from junctions, so seeing them all takes time.

And as you say, there's much less chance of an accident when slower, to which I add that the consequences are far less serious when travelling slower.

The other day I watched two bike accidents in London on TV and in both cases it was being at over 20 mph that directly caused them, as one of the riders at 25 mph admitted afterwards.
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[Lee123]

I do think 15 or so mph is fast enough, I'm happy with it in London and in your case for the knowledge it allows more time for observation and learning. The faster you race around, the more you'll have to concentrate on the traffic and miss the surroundings and street names.

You'll already know that one has to look hard for the street name plaques, they can be at street level, or high on buildings or well back from junctions, so seeing them all takes time.

And as you say, there's much less chance of an accident when slower, to which I add that the consequences are far less serious when travelling slower.

The other day I watched two bike accidents in London on TV and in both cases it was being at over 20 mph that directly caused them, as one of the riders at 25 mph admitted afterwards.
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youre right about the plaques, and about observations etc.. i just thought when i wanted to get back to my van/car at the end of my days riding id want to get there as fast as poss and put on the turbo mode so to speak but am aware of the dangers of getting knocked off.
Are you able to advise me on any bikes, or is it basically just get one that will do 50 miles on a battery or two and one thats comfy or are there better makes/models than others and indeed are there any to really steer clear of?

 

[flecc]

youre right about the plaques, and about observations etc.. i just thought when i wanted to get back to my van/car at the end of my days riding id want to get there as fast as poss and put on the turbo mode so to speak but am aware of the dangers of getting knocked off.
Are you able to advise me on any bikes, or is it basically just get one that will do 50 miles on a battery or two and one thats comfy or are there better makes/models than others and indeed are there any to really steer clear of?

We're all biased by our own choices of course, but I ride an eZee bike and the previous one was also. That's the ones that Cyclezee who posted above sells, and they have the advantage of a wide range of battery choices at time of purchase. They're good quality and are among the most powerful on the market too.

The other important thing is to choose a bike from a stable supplier who will be there long term, since in this small market there are many who come and go all the time.

And watch out in this forum for the ones that are giving trouble, currently the Kalkhoffs with the Impulse 2 unit are best avoided.

I think for your high usage over a couple of years or so for best reliability I'd choose a hub motor bike. You won't be wanting to spend time in the regular chain and sprockets changing that a crank drive one will need with hard use.
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[paul20v]

very true, hopefully i dont have one and if i do hopefully ill have enough of my wits about me to check my bikes ok ;-) ;-)
Do you think that 15mph is fast enough round London though? if so then no need to bother with the dongle..

Just too add a little comfort , Average speed in london of a car is under 15mph at rush hour ,
so with that in mind a legal bike would still be faster and also as already said the faster you go the more chance of an accident generally because people in vehicles dont see bikes at the best of times let alone one going faster than normal .

 

[Lee123]

thanks guys, advice taken on board.
ill do some research and see where it takes me.
Cheers

 

[oldtom]

thanks guys, advice taken on board.
ill do some research and see where it takes me.
Cheers

Some great advice there Lee and I couldn't argue with any of it.

Frankly, what you require to do in central London is a big ask for an EAPC and even if you decided to break the law by riding around on an uninsured, unregistered motor vehicle, there are so few place where you'd be able to achieve, let alone maintain, much over 15-16 mph, you would pretty soon regret your choice of steed.

I admire your perseverance and determination to get your cab licence but I fear you might become very dispirited fairly quickly trying to manage your commute plus your workload on top of the considerable expense.

Given what you seek to achieve ultimately, risking loss of licence through attempting to learn the 'knowledge' riding a non-compliant machine would certainly deter me from so doing.

Scooters and mopeds do seem to be the transport of choice for most learning the knowledge. A friend of mine bought an old Honda 90 for the same purpose you have in mind and commuted to and from the Harlow area daily on the days he spent up town on it. It never let him down and he got pretty near his money back when he sold it.

Best of luck whatever you decide to do.

Tom

 

[Lee123]

Some great advice there Lee and I couldn't argue with any of it.

Frankly, what you require to do in central London is a big ask for an EAPC and even if you decided to break the law by riding around on an uninsured, unregistered motor vehicle, there are so few place where you'd be able to achieve, let alone maintain, much over 15-16 mph, you would pretty soon regret your choice of steed.

I admire your perseverance and determination to get your cab licence but I fear you might become very dispirited fairly quickly trying to manage your commute plus your workload on top of the considerable expense.

Given what you seek to achieve ultimately, risking loss of licence through attempting to learn the 'knowledge' riding a non-compliant machine would certainly deter me from so doing.

Scooters and mopeds do seem to be the transport of choice for most learning the knowledge. A friend of mine bought an old Honda 90 for the same purpose you have in mind and commuted to and from the Harlow area daily on the days he spent up town on it. It never let him down and he got pretty near his money back when he sold it.

Best of luck whatever you decide to do.

Tom

Thanks Tom.
Ive tried twice on mopeds already (xenter 125 and a mp3 300 yourban) and found it hard to justify spending £200-250 a month for storage/fuel. I figured doing it on a bike is better because its cheaper, youll have time to take more in and an ebike is even better as it will take alot of the strain.
After my chat and consideration i do agree that 15mph is probably fast enough as i do want to be live long enough to actually drive my cab!
i agree itd be daft of me to risk my licence given the profession i am trying to get which has helped me make up my mind but before today i doing this blind so the chat has really helped me out so thanks to those involved and the guys who run the forum itself.
Al that lies ahead of me now is deciding which bike to get which is no small task in itself.

Cheers,
Lee

 

[EddiePJ]

This is something else to think about, and is probably out of date now.

Tfl: Average traffic speeds are less than 20 mph in London
Transport for London's latest figures state that for the first quarter of 2011/2012 the average traffic speed on major London roads for the 12 hours between 7am to 7pm was 19.33 mph and over the same period was 8.98 mph across Central London.

Last updated Sun 20 Jul 2014




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[mountainsport]

Hi Lee,

You are going to need a bike with plenty of torque, large capacity battery and good strong frame.

I would suggest an eZee Sprint 8 GTS http://cyclezee.com/ezee-sprint-8.html

Wow! 21Ah battery now you are really speaking about the big guns you mean business.

MS.

 

[Lee123]

ive come across this little beauty https://www.e-bikeshop.co.uk/Raleigh-Motus-2016-Electric-Bike
most impressive thing too me is the range, plus its a step through so easy to get on/off

anyone have any opinions, good bad or indifferent??

 

[flecc]

ive come across this little beauty https://www.e-bikeshop.co.uk/Raleigh-Motus-2016-Electric-Bike
most impressive thing too me is the range, plus its a step through so easy to get on/off

anyone have any opinions, good bad or indifferent??

Nice bike, but not my choice for your purpose. It's crank motor so the higher chain and sprocket wear with your heavy 50 miles a day plus usage, which system I advised earlier that you should avoid. You wouldn't want to be very regularly changing chains and sprockets.

And I don't like this later Bosch unit with the tiny crank sprocket, faster wearing and more inclined to chain wraparound causing problems. Also never take any notice on maker range claims, they are invariably exaggerated. Battery isn't big enough either to be sure of covering 50 miles with lots of stop-starts, and their batteries are quite expensive.
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[Lee123]

Nice bike, but not my choice for your purpose. It's crank motor so the higher chain and sprocket wear with your heavy 50 miles a day plus usage, which system I advised earlier that you should avoid. You wouldn't want to be very regularly changing chains and sprockets.

And I don't like this later Bosch unit with the tiny crank sprocket, faster wearing and more inclined to chain wraparound causing problems. Also never take any notice on maker range claims, they are invariably exaggerated. Battery isn't big enough either to be sure of covering 50 miles with lots of stop-starts, and their batteries are quite expensive.
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Thanks Flecc. you obviously know what youre talking about where as i do not.
i dont really know what you mean about crank motor. also what is wrong with the Bosch unit, i thought it was all the rage being the latest type.
Can you spell out to me what would be the least hassle to own with a good range and large battery please. Thank you.

 

[flecc]

Thanks Flecc. you obviously know what youre talking about where as i do not.
i dont really know what you mean about crank motor. also what is wrong with the Bosch unit, i thought it was all the rage being the latest type.
Can you spell out to me what would be the least hassle to own with a good range and large battery please. Thank you.

Crank motor is a middle one at the bottom bracket which drives through the chain. That means the bike chain and sprockets take both the motor and rider power, meaning higher wear of those. The very small chainwheel on that latest Bosch unit means faster wear too. Some have found that as the small chainwheel wears, its hooked teeth inclined to refuse to let go of the chain and wraps it round, causing a jam. That means a new chainwheel or filing all the teeth to stop that happening, the sort of aggravation you won't need.

A hub motor sits in the centre of a front or rear wheel, so it doesn't wear any of the bike transission parts. For your use I'd choose one of those. In the front wheel is simplest in many ways.

 

[trex]

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A bike that has quick release wheels (this maybe standard these days but not sure) so i can put it into the back of my car.

that rules out the Ezee Sprint 8. It has no QR on the front wheel because the motor is at the front.

I suggest you look at the Woosh Santana 2.
It has a quick release front wheel, a rear BPM motor and a maximum speed about 17mph.

http://wooshbikes.co.uk/?santana2

 

[Lee123]

Crank motor is a middle one at the bottom bracket which drives through the chain. That means the bike chain and sprockets take both the motor and rider power, meaning higher wear of those. The very small chainwheel on that latest Bosch unit means faster wear too. Some have found that as the small chainwheel wears, its hooked teeth inclined to refuse to let go of the chain and wraps it round, causing a jam. That means a new chainwheel or filing all the teeth to stop that happening, the sort of aggravation you won't need.

A hub motor sits in the centre of a front or rear wheel, so it doesn't wear any of the bike transission parts. For your use I'd choose one of those. In the front wheel is simplest in many ways.

Thanks Flecc, if it is in the front will it still be able to have a quick release wheel? or should i just look for a bike that has a hub motor one at the rear?
thanks

 

[flecc]

Thanks Flecc, if it is in the front will it still be able to have a quick release wheel? or should i just look for a bike that has a hub motor one at the rear?
thanks

No, you can't have quick release with a front hub motor, so a rear hub motor it has to be if you want to take out the front wheel to put the bike in the back of the car. Make sure the one you choose has a quick release front wheel, many still have a front fixed hub with rear motors.
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[Lee123]

No, you can't have quick release with a front hub motor, so a rear hub motor it has to be if you want to take out the front wheel to put the bike in the back of the car. Make sure the one you choose has a quick release front wheel, many still have a front fixed hub with rear motors.
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Thanks Flecc, i recieved an email notification saying you sent a msg that started 'My choice of bike for your job would be one of the eZee models with either the 21 Ah battery or preferably two of the 15 Ah batteries to be sure of all day running,

Otherwise there are many other hub motor models which you could choose but with two batteries, few will offer certainty of 50 miles with stop-starts on one battery.'

But for some reason it hasnt come through on this thread, are you able to re-send or finish what hasnt come through pls, thanks again!!

 

[flecc]

Thanks Flecc, i recieved an email notification saying you sent a msg that started 'My choice of bike for your job would be one of the eZee models with either the 21 Ah battery or preferably two of the 15 Ah batteries to be sure of all day running,

Otherwise there are many other hub motor models which you could choose but with two batteries, few will offer certainty of 50 miles with stop-starts on one battery.'

But for some reason it hasnt come through on this thread, are you able to re-send or finish what hasnt come through pls, thanks again!!

That was the complete post, but I deleted it as soon as I saw you needed a quick release front wheel. They do have one rear hub motored bike but it's crossbar and doesn't have a quick release front wheel.
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