Help! Voilamart 26” front hub looking for repair

[mikeconnect]

Just start with step one and report back.

 

[mikeconnect]

Just start with step one and report back.

I’m lost . You’re saying controller end to circles and vfr is saying cross color test at controller end and continuity from circles to just outside axle

 

[mikeconnect]

I’m lost . You’re saying controller end to circles and vfr is saying cross color test at controller end and continuity from circles to just outside axle

If you have different opinions I’ll just have to do both ways

 

[vfr400]

I’m lost . You’re saying controller end to circles and vfr is saying cross color test at controller end and continuity from circles to just outside axle

My way is much easier and quicker, plus you don't need to disturb the insulation on the joints in the motor. IMHO, the way he said to do it is daft. The results are the same whichever way you do it.

Actually, the way I said, you only have to check from blue to green and blue to yellow, and to check for shorts, you only need to check blue to axle when you have a meter that beeps, so only half as many tests as his way.

 

[mikeconnect]

My way is much easier and quicker, plus you don't need to disturb the insulation on the joints in the motor. IMHO, the way he said to do it is daft. The results are the same whichever way you do it.

Actually, the way I said, you only have to check from blue to green and blue to yellow, and to check for shorts, you only need to check blue to axle when you have a meter that beeps, so only half as many tests as his way.

Ok I’m sure I already did cross colour test from you’re earlier instructions but I’ll repeat it . The test from inside to just outside axle remains to be done.
wIsh I understood how that cross colour routine works for continuity . But I’ll just get in with It When home
Thanks all

 

[WheezyRider]

My way is much easier and quicker, plus you don't need to disturb the insulation on the joints in the motor. IMHO, the way he said to do it is daft. The results are the same whichever way you do it.

Actually, the way I said, you only have to check from blue to green and blue to yellow, and to check for shorts, you only need to check blue to axle when you have a meter that beeps, so only half as many tests as his way.

Can you explain in a bit more detail what you mean vfr? If the number of tests can be reduced, I'd like to know.

So, you are saying unplug the motor from the controller, and connect the continuity tester (multimeter on 200 Ohms) across the different phase plugs of the motor?

The phase coils are connected altogether in a star formation and have a resistance that is too low to give a sensible answer with a basic multimeter, how is that going to give a good indication if there is a short/break or both somewhere between the connector leads and the motor windings? If there is purely a complete break it might tell you something, but not everything you might need to know.

My method is a bit more long winded, but from it you know for sure what is what and I think it's also more in line with Nealh's method. Are we missing something?

 

[vfr400]

Can you explain in a bit more detail what you mean vfr? If the number of tests can be reduced, I'd like to know.

So, you are saying unplug the motor from the controller, and connect the continuity tester (multimeter on 200 Ohms) across the different phase plugs of the motor?

The phase coils are connected altogether in a star formation and have a resistance that is too low to give a sensible answer with a basic multimeter, how is that going to give a good indication if there is a short/break or both somewhere between the connector leads and the motor windings? If there is purely a complete break it might tell you something, but not everything you might need to know.

My method is a bit more long winded, but from it you know for sure what is what and I think it's also more in line with Nealh's method. Are we missing something?

When you check continuity between any two phase wires, you go through two phase windings, so you check them both at once.

The phase windings have such low resistance that you can consider them a direct connection.

If any of the wires were shorted to the motor chassis, effectively, they all are, so you only need to check one.

 

[WheezyRider]

When you check continuity between any two phase wires, you go through two phase windings, so you check them both at once.

The phase windings have such low resistance that you can consider them a direct connection.

If any of the wires were shorted to the motor chassis, effectively, they all are, so you only need to check one.

That's good, but what if you have a short at the point of the twist, that also does not short to the axle hub?

 

[vfr400]

That's good, but what if you have a short at the point of the twist, that also does not short to the axle hub?

If the wires are shorted to each other, you'd need a special meter to detect that since they're all connected in the windings, so you'd need to see the difference between zero ohms and 0.1 ohms, which your average DVM can't do.

His wire got twisted where it comes out of the axle. Some wires must have shorted to each other to damage the halls. His repairer has pulled the damaged part through, then cut and joined the phase wires, and he cut and re soldered the sensor wires. There's clear evidence of that, so it's extremely unlikely that there will be any damage remaining.

Now that we have most of the story, it looks like the guy did a reasonable job of the repair. The soldering doesn't look particularly good, like he used lead-free solder without extra flux. The main thing is that he apparently used the wrong type of hall sensors, which will be confirmed if and when OP gets them out.

 

[mikeconnect]

If the wires are shorted to each other, you'd need a special meter to detect that since they're all connected in the windings, so you'd need to see the difference between zero ohms and 0.1 ohms, which your average DVM can't do.

His wire got twisted where it comes out of the axle. Some wires must have shorted to each other to damage the halls. His repairer has pulled the damaged part through, then cut and joined the phase wires, and he cut and re soldered the sensor wires. There's clear evidence of that, so it's extremely unlikely that there will be any damage remaining.

Now that we have most of the story, it looks like the guy did a reasonable job of the repair. The soldering doesn't look particularly good, like he used lead-free solder without extra flux. The main thing is that he apparently used the wrong type of hall sensors, which will be confirmed if and when OP gets them out.

Work wise busy so looking like phase wire test by Friday and attempt to remove sensors weekend

 

[WheezyRider]

If the wires are shorted to each other, you'd need a special meter to detect that since they're all connected in the windings, so you'd need to see the difference between zero ohms and 0.1 ohms, which your average DVM can't do.

His wire got twisted where it comes out of the axle. Some wires must have shorted to each other to damage the halls. His repairer has pulled the damaged part through, then cut and joined the phase wires, and he cut and re soldered the sensor wires. There's clear evidence of that, so it's extremely unlikely that there will be any damage remaining.

Now that we have most of the story, it looks like the guy did a reasonable job of the repair. The soldering doesn't look particularly good, like he used lead-free solder without extra flux. The main thing is that he apparently used the wrong type of hall sensors, which will be confirmed if and when OP gets them out.

I see. Your test would show if there is a break in a wire or a short to the axle, but it wouldn't clarify all potential cases. This is why I said to probe each wire from the controller end to where the same wire meets the windings in the motor, that way you can be sure the wires are continuous through the region of the potential break or short. I would do this test if probing across phases and the axle body didn't show anything untoward.

However, if you are confident that the person who repaired the motor has fixed any problems, it shouldn't be necessary, although the question still remains as to why the motor won't run without the Hall sensor cable being attached.

 

[mikeconnect]

While I’m waiting to get to the cable tests , I need to eliminate something which hasn’t been mentioned
Does the throttle mechanism have a mini circuit or wiring that could blow ? And if so could that impact on the pedal assist side of things ?

 

[vfr400]

With the controller switched on, measure the voltage between the red and black wires on the throttle, then measure between black and the signal wire while you twist the throttle. The two results should be 5v and 1,2v - 3.8v.

 

[mikeconnect]

With the controller switched on, measure the voltage between the red and black wires on the throttle, then measure between black and the signal wire while you twist the throttle. The two results should be 5v and 1,2v - 3.8v.

Which is signal wire plz

 

[vfr400]

Which is signal wire plz

The one that's not red or black.

 

[mikeconnect]

The one that's not red or black.

 

[mikeconnect]

Question to all 3 please . I may misunderstand . But why does Nealh and wheezy cable test involve cutting insulation at motor end but vfr second test to just outside axle only involves getting a probe below the shrink wrap

 

[vfr400]

Question to all 3 please . I may misunderstand . But why does Nealh and wheezy cable test involve cutting insulation at motor end but vfr second test to just outside axle only involves getting a probe below the shrink wrap

Because they just used the first thought that came into their heads instead of thinking the problem through.

 

[mikeconnect]

Because they just used the first thought that came into their heads instead of thinking the problem through.

now now does t break up the team spirit
So if I do your cross wire test at controller end and I do their full length controller to red circles test , I’ll have done both young methods of testing , which makes double sure and may possibly show different results . But importantly I have no connectors outside the axle . Cable runs directly from motor to controller do testing just outside the axle is not a good option

 

[WheezyRider]

The one that's not red or black.

On the Voilamart controller throttle, there are 6 cables, doesn't shorten the odds by much.