Ummmm....banned ??

[Jeremy]

The really, really, stupid thing here is that this action, presumably initiated because Storcker weren't best pleased by some comments here, have received far, far more negative publicity from this censorship action than they would have if nothing at all had been done.

Never underestimate the power of a bit of outrage over perceived unfairness to impact negatively on a companies reputation.

Personally I'm now going to go out of my way to suggest to anyone who asks my opinion about ebikes that they should avoid this particular manufacturer. I suggest others who feel strongly about this do the same.

 

[funkylyn]

There you go - you have a sit-in.........

Think you're on your own there wissy......dont you go getting a numb bum....you have bikes to test ride remember

Lynda

 

[GaRRy]

There are still plenty VERY knowledgable people on here to help give you good advice wissy, dont fret.......

Lynda

Yea now were a Eddie free zone you forget all about those rubbish Bosch Bikes for starters

Seriously though as much as at times Eddie can be a pain the forum will be the poorer for his exclusion.

 

[funkylyn]

I'd be the first to say that there are things that several members here post that I don't agree with, and that some occasionally post things that maybe they see as humorous but that others may interpret as being borderline offensive.

However, in this specific case neither Eddieo or Indalo posted anything that could possibly have been interpreted as offensive, even by the most sensitive soul. Their "crime" seems to have been a determination to expose misleading advertising, something that would be supported by the laws of this country and most members of this forum, I would have thought.

Suppressing inoffensive, honest, comment because it exposes a forum sponsor who has published confusing or misleading information is something that I personally associate with the more extreme political regimes of the world, not this forum.

But, as yet, we dont KNOW that is why they have been banned do we, I think it might be counterproductive to presume anything unless /until we actually do know the reason why ....everything else is just pure speculation.

Lynda

 

[GORDONAL]

And appreciably less entertaining , Indalo also I value his contribution .

From a happy Boscher !!!!

Alan

 

[funkylyn]

Yea now were a Eddie free zone you forget all about those rubbish Bosch Bikes for starters

.

LOL.....so, now then, what were you saying about the fabulous Neo GaRRy .......

Lynda

 

[wissy]

still forming my 'sit in' and don;t care why they were banned. Unban them I say. Boo hisss again. Bring back opinions!!!

 

[jackhandy]

I see indalo's thread "what's going on?" is no longer extant.

So - let's see if I have this right - It's fine for a Dealer to refer to me as a Muppet, unfit to comment on his bikes......

 

[jazper53]

Yea now were a Eddie free zone you forget all about those rubbish Bosch Bikes for starters

Seriously though as much as at times Eddie can be a pain the forum will be the poorer for his exclusion.

For those who may believe in reincarnation, I expect they are already reborn and with us in spirit

 

[GaRRy]

I see indalo's thread "what's going on?" is no longer extant.

So - let's see if I have this right - It's fine for a Dealer to refer to me as a Muppet, unfit to comment on his bikes......

Exactly.

I see HelenJ has posted a typical politicians post on reason for ban (ie tells us nothing useful)

Sorry but currently neither the moderators nor Storck are doing anything for their image. If the original posts were full of errors then why havn't Storck just provided evidence of this as IMHO that would be the best way to respond.

What ever the truth this comes across as:-
Member posts opinion on a bike they have tried but does not like.
Bike company (or at least one of its representatives) rather than refuting the claims feels free to insult forum members.
More apparent discrepancies in manufacturers claims are revealed.
Then yet again rather than responding to the claims and proving they are false they put pressure on moderators to remove the posts they dont like and ban the posters.
Now Im not saying this is what has happened but based on what has happened and we have been made aware of this is precisely what it looks like and as the saying goes there is no smoke without fire.

 

[jackhandy]

And, with moderators not prepared to discuss it publicly, there it sits - Very uncomfortably.

 

[rsscott]

Sometimes I think it would be better to name this site Area 51.

Jeremy - As a moderator on another site you should be well aware that as an ordinary member you are not in sight of all the facts. This isn't a case of simply banning someone because they call into question some claims from a manufacturer, there is more to it than that. I'm not going to get drawn into specifics other than to say general conduct is a recurring theme.

{To everyone....}

This website costs money to run. Advertisers support the site by paying for advertising. They do not get to call the shots as to what is said on this site regardless of all the conspiracy theories. Yes it is true occasionally an advertiser doesn't like what is said but as we point out, you can't sit back and enjoy all the positive comments without accepting there will be negative ones from time to time.

However, if we get a complaint that may put us in a position legally then we have to act. This means removing posts from view and then discussing with the parties involved. Sometimes those comments have to stay off the site.

The whole point of setting up the site was for it to be a friendly place to talk about electric bikes. If you can't argue politely then you have no place being here.

If anyone still thinks there is a conspiracy going on, I suggest downloading a copy of your favourite bulletin board software, setting up a forum for a subject you like, get some advertisers on board..... Come and talk to me again in a couple of years and we'll see whether you still have the same opinion.

 

[smudger1956]

Never have this sort of altercation at the Cyclamatic Owners..........

 

[funkylyn]

So - let's see if I have this right - It's fine for a Dealer to refer to me as a Muppet, unfit to comment on his bikes......

Well....about as fine as eddieo calling jcyclezee 'pondlife' I would say..........

Lynda

 

[jazper53]

Never have this sort of altercation at the Cyclamatic Owners..........

Last post 9mths ago, maybe its a conspiracy of silence

 

[Jeremy]

You really couldn't make it up, could you?

I mean, who would have thought that any web site ostensibly set up to promote a particular activity would stoop to the sort of extreme censorship we now seeing?

What amazes me is that the current bout of censorship seems to be senseless and extremely counter-productive - it's actually ****ing off the members here who have contributed a great deal over the years. Goodness only knows what new members must make of it, or what some of the other sponsors of this site might think about it, for that matter.

 

[HelenJ]

Exactly.

I see HelenJ has posted a typical politicians post on reason for ban (ie tells us nothing useful)

Sorry but currently neither the moderators nor Storck are doing anything for their image. If the original posts were full of errors then why havn't Storck just provided evidence of this as IMHO that would be the best way to respond.

What ever the truth this comes across as:-
Member posts opinion on a bike they have tried but does not like.
Bike company (or at least one of its representatives) rather than refuting the claims feels free to insult forum members.
More apparent discrepancies in manufacturers claims are revealed.
Then yet again rather than responding to the claims and proving they are false they put pressure on moderators to remove the posts they dont like and ban the posters.
Now Im not saying this is what has happened but based on what has happened and we have been made aware of this is precisely what it looks like and as the saying goes there is no smoke without fire.

Firstly, the dealer's comment was removed along with a whole host of others from the those that have been banned.

I am not trying to be a politician. Obviously I can't repost defamatory comments to prove what I have said in my 'politician's post'. I have simply tried to explain how we deal with situations like this. We have not been asked to ban these people by Storck or anyone else. We have chosen to do that ourselves after repeated warnings.

As Russ has said there is a serious side to this business, so to say 'whatever the truth it comes across as <insert presumptions>' isn't really that helpful

 

[rsscott]

You really couldn't make it up, could you?

I mean, who would have thought that any web site ostensibly set up to promote a particular activity would stoop to the sort of extreme censorship we now seeing?

What amazes me is that the current bout of censorship seems to be senseless and extremely counter-productive - it's actually ****ing off the members here who have contributed a great deal over the years. Goodness only knows what new members must make of it, or what some of the other sponsors of this site might think about it, for that matter.

Censorship? What has been censored ? Seriously Jeremy, just how much material have we removed since 2006. I'll tell you, it's peanuts.

 

[Jeremy]

Censorship? What has been censored ?

Well, a complete thread for a start................

AFAICS, there was nothing in that thread that could possibly have got you, as site owner, into any sort of legal hot water whatsoever, and there was nothing in it that was offensive. Sure it was critical of what many have seen as an overly heavy-handed bit of one-sided censorship and moderation, but is disagreeing with the views of the web site owner a valid reason for total censorship? Not in my book, and not something that would be entertained on Endless Sphere, even by the most severe of the moderation team there.

The value to your advertisers, as you know far better than I, comes from the honest opinions given here, and the exposure they get to a community that is a focus for their potential customer base. Bias, even if only perceived bias, will undermine that value, particularly if people go to other, far bigger and more influential ebike forums and reveal what seems (from the perspective of some ordinary members) to be going on here.

 

[wissy]

so a threat of legal action blah is enough for forum moderators to pull the plug? Have admins been on a legal training course or actually fully aware on Internet defamation laws or simply assume that if x said blah on a forum they are 'responsible' for then they are automatically in trouble so to speak. They have to give written warnings first and then if ignored they can try to take further action BUT even written warnings are simply a shot across the bow.....

I am new here and was being given good advice and now cannot continue the discussion because of a few - and let's be honest here - what may after all be tame words on an internet forum. Were they libellous - most likely no way. Get a grip whoever. Less power broking. More diplomacy and this situation would never have arisen.

I have noticed in short time I have been here that there seems to be an onus on promoting advertisers of the site first and foremost and it doesn't come across as a constructive neutral site at times. Having said that I WAS getting good neutral advice from you know who - he who must not be mentioned! Booo Hisss.

My sit in is still ongoing!! Bring my advice back!!! Bring neutral opinion back!!! Bring opinion back!! Up with democracy!!