Trek / CST motor / Hydraulic Disc Brakes / Cassette

[103Alex1]

This is interminable, Alex you really ought to join the Womens Rural Institute, do you by any chance know Morphix? You would make great penpals, really. Please stop wittering on and just shove the damn controller and battery in a bag. I have my own views as to where you might shove that but the frame triangle would be the obvious choice to the rest of humanity. There are no more outstanding issues so just go out to the shed and do it, and then come back and tell us how you got on when it has been done.

hech, you don't have to read it - suggest you skip this one and read the other ones written by people who have done it before. I've no intention of just going out to the shed and shoving bits in other bits and then looking at the finished result and thinking - ah, I need to start again. If the battery and controller are unsafe mounted in there for their size and the bike geometry I need to know before doing it, don't I. Why do you think I am asking ?

Some of you build bikes because you like building bikes and that is your prime goal. I am building mine to get the end result I want in a finished bike so it matters very much to me to get the detail right. So shove that where you like and have a bit of empathy for others with different priorities to your own.

Finished look might not mean anything to some people - it means a great deal to others. For me the bike is a means to an end not an end in itself. Capiche ?

 

[Deleted member 4366]

If you really want a custom bag in the triangle, then something like this with a fixed compartment for the battery and a velcro flap to access the charger. You can use hoops over the frame all round, or use the bottle fixings with inside plates to make it look a bit neater. You need polystyrene above and behind the battery to stop it from banging into the frame. You could add a compartment at the front for tools. It's OK to put the controller inside of the bag. It won't get hot.

 

[103Alex1]

If you really want a custom bag in the triangle, then something like this with a fixed compartment for the battery and a velcro flap to access the charger. You can use hoops over the frame all round, or use the bottle fixings with inside plates to make it look a bit neater. You need polystyrene above and behind the battery to stop it from banging into the frame. You could add a compartment at the front for tools. It's OK to put the controller inside of the bag. It won't get hot.

Spot on - extremely helpful and very grateful d8veh. Also answers my other question I was mulling on - how many holes and where.

These holes should be side entry to the bag, same side as cable coming from hub ideally, right ? I'm thinking velcro flaps sewn on to bag to cover the holes for a bit of added weatherproofing.... it's blooming wet out West.

PS - thumb throttle received should fit. Just about space to the right of the combined brake/gear lever housing on the handlebars - very promising.

 

[Deleted member 4366]

If you put the bottom hole right at the bottom, any water that gets in will run back out without getting near any electrics. You can always squirt a bit of sealant around the top one, but not the bottom one. I think that the bag would look nice in that silver waterproof fabric with a nice decal or motif in the side.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2-AUTHENTIC-SMALL-TREK-BICYCLES-SHIELD-STICKERS-DECALS-/181057609631?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item2a27dfdf9f

 

[hech]

And if you go off the side of the path into the canal, you might get lucky and find a fish in the bag!

 

[103Alex1]

And if you go off the side of the path into the canal, you might get lucky and find a fish in the bag!

Can't help thinking I'd rather hook one of these instead, but no chance of that with a frame bag ....

http://cdn.purseblog.com/images/2011/04/6-pack-frame-cinch.jpg

 

[103Alex1]

If you put the bottom hole right at the bottom, any water that gets in will run back out without getting near any electrics. You can always squirt a bit of sealant around the top one, but not the bottom one. I think that the bag would look nice in that silver waterproof fabric with a nice decal or motif in the side.
2 AUTHENTIC SMALL TREK BICYCLES SHIELD STICKERS / DECALS **** | eBay

nice touch ... proof positive that he's not just a dab hand with a dremeling tool and a soldering iron I'll sketch out a drawing with some dimensions and get hold of buggy-bags to see what they would charge. There are also sailmakers not far from me in Devon who I'm sure would also make something up if I got them the materials.

Panniers are these so everything wd go nicely if I could get the frame bag to match up :

Wiggle | Carradice CarraDry Bags : CarraDry Rear Panniers (pair) | Panniers

For attaching stiffening inside along the top, diagonal and bottom edges of the bag along the frame profile, most manufacturers these days just use stiff laminated cardboard riveted to the waterproof fabric. Carradice use this method inside their panniers for the stiffening piece which backs the rack for example. You could actually fix a triangular-shaped piece to the non-flap side too, in order to give the bag a clean vertical profile and prevent bulging. Nice and neat.

Could then make holes in same place as the bottle carrier screw holes as you suggest and screw in through a silicone washer or similar so no velcro straps needed down seatpost and along diagonal axis.

Just some thoughts

 

[Deleted member 4366]

I hope it's not too expensive. Football boot bag cost £4.99!

 

[103Alex1]

I hope it's not too expensive. Football boot bag cost £4.99!

I know .. sturdy bags are blooming pricey. I'm willing to put some dosh where my wild ideas are on this one and spend up to £80-100. Hoping it's do'able for that and a realistic budget but realize might be tight. Just sold my Carradice poncho I'll never use (too heavy) for £50 so that'll help pay for some of it.

I know it must sound absolutely crazy but having had top quality bags on my other bike (Topeak / Carradice) and used them day in day out loaded to the max in all conditions and never had them fail on me (zips, waterproofing, handles etc) it's one thing I really do value. Bag failure is one of the most frustrating things especially when you're miles from getting any replacements. If you have to have 'em made you may as well have 'em made right because the cost differential is usually not that big between a great one and an 'OK' one. We'll see !

 

[GaRRy]

If you really want a custom bag in the triangle, then something like this with a fixed compartment for the battery and a velcro flap to access the charger. You can use hoops over the frame all round, or use the bottle fixings with inside plates to make it look a bit neater. You need polystyrene above and behind the battery to stop it from banging into the frame. You could add a compartment at the front for tools. It's OK to put the controller inside of the bag. It won't get hot.

I keep saying this but I promise I am not on any form of commission. Welcome To BikeBag.co.uk will make exactly what you want. and by exactly I dont mean the standard product is what you need but that if you want specific internal pockets, dimensions materials etc then they will do that for you and for not much more.

i and many of my friends have used their buggy bags and seats etc for years and never heard a single complaint about quality. Welcome To Buggybags.co.uk

 

[103Alex1]

Bit more testing of fit ... motor, cranks & dropouts

Played about with the motor a bit tonight to check that all fits. Not built it into a wheel yet so just took out the existing rear wheel and dropped the motor axles in for a first fitting. Bit of fiddling about and decided to fit the cassette on to see how it all looked.

This was the drive side :

View attachment 4870

View attachment 4871

.. and the non-drive side.

View attachment 4872

It's hard to photograph, but as it stands the smallest cog on the rear cassette (SRAM) looks very close to the frame - even though I did manage to fit them all on the spline on the side of the motor.



Am I likely looking at spacers here ? I also clocked that it would be very hard to fit a 10-speed cassette on there .. not sure if anyone has tried yet but if I'd got a 20/30-gear bike might have been looking at some serious head-scratching about now.

The cassette and brake disc do a great job of keeping the motor discreet so it doesn't dominate the look of the rear wheel. Like.

Going to try to get my head around these torque arm things and how they might work now !

I keep saying this but I promise I am not on any form of commission. Welcome To BikeBag.co.uk will make exactly what you want. and by exactly I dont mean the standard product is what you need but that if you want specific internal pockets, dimensions materials etc then they will do that for you and for not much more.

I and many of my friends have used their buggy bags and seats etc for years and never heard a single complaint about quality. Welcome To Buggybags.co.uk

Thanks GaRRy ... I'm getting straight on to them on Monday as all signs point to them being the right people for this job.

Not 100% certain what the best material to use is, but the Mtbr forum lot seem to be recommending 1000Dnr Cordura. It's water resistant (highly) but not 100% waterproof. I can easily use additional wash-in proofing before bag made, which can be restored periodically if I need it (doubt it), so don't think that is such a problem actually. Thought about trying to use waterproof pvc but the logistics and costs of seam welding etc. are out of proportion for a 1-off bag.

That 1000 dnr Cordura comes in a whole load of colours (including silver-grey ) and I can get it landed into UK in a couple of weeks to send to them. This should look decent with the silver frame.

 

[Old_Dave]

looks very close to the frame - even though I did manage to fit them all on the spline on the side of the motor

Yes it does look that way, fit spacers so that when the chain is on the smallest cog there is clearance between the chain and the frame.

Need to see pics of what's happening on the other side but your attachments are not showing at the moment.

However any plans made now may have to be altered after the wheel is built

 

[Deleted member 4366]

I don't know whether it's just the photo, but your top gear doesn't look like it's seated properly. Check the splines: It only goes in one position because one spline is narrower. The spacing to the frame should be perfect when properly bolted up, and there should be no need for any spacers.

 

[103Alex1]

Yes it does look that way, fit spacers so that when the chain is on the smallest cog there is clearance between the chain and the frame.

Need to see pics of what's happening on the other side but your attachments are not showing at the moment.

However any plans made now may have to be altered after the wheel is built

I think these are the missing photos. Browser kept crashing and doing odd things last night with uploading and think the links got corrupted somehow during an edit. I can see them when clicking but maybe not others .



Didn't put the end bolts on so you could see siting of the axles in the dropouts. Are you hinting that the wheel build may pull the axle one way or another off its current axis ?

Fitting spacers inside the frame (to stretch distance between dropout centres for more chain clearance) has knock-on that remaining axle length is tight for getting end nuts on esp. if torque arms inserted. May have to come back to this one

I don't know whether it's just the photo, but your top gear doesn't look like it's seated properly. Check the splines: It only goes in one position because one spline is narrower. The spacing to the frame should be perfect when properly bolted up, and there should be no need for any spacers.

I think it's the photo angle d8veh, there's only one way the cassette can slot on the motor and fix in place. Screwing on the outer axle nuts on each side doesn't have any effect on the location of the cassette relative to the frame inside.

 

[Deleted member 4366]

You're right, but isn't the top gear seperate. It often moves round a tooth when you assemble the cluster. It'll stay in position, but not down as far as it should be. It happens to me nearly every time I assemble a cassette to its spline.
If you look at the photo, the forward edge is much further from the 8th gear than is the back edge. It looks crooked to me, which is exactly how it looks when the spline isn't right.

 

[103Alex1]

You're right, but isn't the top gear seperate. It often moves round a tooth when you assemble the cluster. It'll stay in position, but not down as far as it should be. It happens to me nearly every time I assemble a cassette to its spline.
If you look at the photo, the forward edge is much further from the 8th gear than is the back edge. It looks crooked to me, which is exactly how it looks when the spline isn't right.

I'll recheck that. The top 2 gears are separate on this cassette so could be I haven't got one or either of them aligned right.

 

[103Alex1]

Cassette re-assembled. (1-7) / +8th / +9th



Looked just the same. Mounted - clearances looked just as before. Only one way to be sure - fitted the chain on and checked operation. Looked very tight before chain fitted but it actually works fine.



Relieved. Should be ready to start building the wheel soon Hope the battery, motor & controller work !!!